Phantom Regiment is going to Win DCI this year.

[festive]

They took what was at best a 7th place show, and managed to get 3rd from the judges. They took average everyday music with very little difficulty, added a few runs(that unfortunately didn't fit into the context of the music) to add to the difficulty, and put it on the field. Adding in the shocker of a first time male in the guard, who didn't even blend in with the rest of the guard for most of the show. And while it was well performed, no where near the level of a 3rd place show.

:(

You are aware that your comments implicitly take the entire judging establishment to task, basically, since Regiment was not "given third" by one set of judges...they were ranked quite highly by nearly all judges near the end of the season. In doing so, it surprises me that you care enough to bother posting that you thought they deserved seventh, at best. Not being a judge yourself (unless you are, of course, in which case you have far more to explain), you must care to a certain extent about judging outcomes, but you have no (or little) faith in the judging establishment to get it right.

If judging is bunk, and Regiment deserved 7th, then judges are hacks and it really doesn't matter what they think, right? Up to and including them gifting third to Regiment.

What exactly are you implying by insulting this corps? It is an insult to imply Regiment didn't deserve their score and then back it up by saying the music "average, everyday, with very little difficulty." Which is utter garbage. It can be your opinion, sure, but lots of opinions are just flat out wrong. March and play the show and maybe your comments about it being easy will have some credibility. It undermines the efforts of those members, IMO.

Actually, never mind, because your posts are :OT: for this thread.

[festive]

Im not anymore, been in Connecticut for about 4 years now and thats a big negative on the party...kinda getting married that day b**bs

Dude...congratulations!!! ^OO^

[cantgetenoughcorps]

:(

You are aware that your comments implicitly take the entire judging establishment to task, basically, since Regiment was not "given third" by one set of judges...they were ranked quite highly by nearly all judges near the end of the season. In doing so, it surprises me that you care enough to bother posting that you thought they deserved seventh, at best. Not being a judge yourself (unless you are, of course, in which case you have far more to explain), you must care to a certain extent about judging outcomes, but you have no (or little) faith in the judging establishment to get it right.

Actually, never mind, because your posts are :OT: for this thread.

OK Back on topic, I predict Phantom will come in 1st because last year I had then in 7th and they came in 3rd, this year I have them in 5th, so the judges will have them in 1ST.

As for being a judge, I have been a judge for the last 16 years, although not in DCI. As a judge, I have always listened and watched and tried to fairly judge each performance on its own merit, regardless of how much information or lack of I have on any competing group/individual.

That beind said, I have seen many instances of scores not reflecting performances in DCI. This is not meant to be offensive to corps, but sometimes the best corps doesn't receive the best score. Unfair but true. And while I do care about the judging outcomes, I don't always think the judges are acting upon what they have seen, so much as what they are told to see.

One thing I have heard(from a friend who was a judge at that show) is that at one of the early season shows a few years back, there was a percussion judge who gave a certain score to a certain corps. they were told by the other judges, that score was too high for being the last week in June, and that they should have only received a score of (x). I'm sorry, but if a corps deserves a score of 9.6 in colorguard/percussion/brass performance on June 30, give them that score. But if that performance goes down because of show changes, redesign of drill, or whatever, don't be afraid to give them a lower score 3 days later. I have found that 95% of the time, I can guess the placements and scores within 3 tenths of a point before the shows even happens, just by reviewing the scores of the last 3 days. Regardless of the performance by that corps on any given night. The 3 shows I've seen this year have been no different.

[The Tsar]

OK Back on topic, I predict Phantom will come in 1st because last year I had then in 7th and they came in 3rd, this year I have them in 5th, so the judges will have them in 1ST.

As for being a judge, I have been a judge for the last 16 years, although not in DCI. As a judge, I have always listened and watched and tried to fairly judge each performance on its own merit, regardless of how much information or lack of I have on any competing group/individual.

That beind said, I have seen many instances of scores not reflecting performances in DCI. This is not meant to be offensive to corps, but sometimes the best corps doesn't receive the best score. Unfair but true. And while I do care about the judging outcomes, I don't always think the judges are acting upon what they have seen, so much as what they are told to see.

Here's the thing, though...you are ONE judge. You are likely judging YOUR area of EXPERTISE.

I am a former band director, and a pretty darn good one from everything I've been told (and when Harry Begian says you have a #*&$ great program, you tend to believe him). I also am involved in the marching activity as an arranger and as a drill designer. Therefore, I could probably judge music (brass) and visual. But I could NEVER judge color guard or percussion with any sort of confidence...I simply don't know enough about those areas. I would be a fool if I tried to tell you who had the best color guard last year...I know I like certain guards and the work they do, but I can't discuss intelligently with you the merits and composition of guard books. Ditto for percussion.

What you are doing, when you say that you have listened and watched but still find instances of scores not reflecting performances, is assuming that you can judge ALL captions at ONCE. That's pretty impressive, yet I have a hard time believing you are qualified to do so. To me, this all-knowing judge would have to be an individual who has performed in a percussion battery, has arranged music and probably played a brass instrument as well, has designed drill, AND has been involved with a color guard enough to either be able to perform, or at the very least recognize aspects that most of us non-color guard folk aren't even aware of. Not to mention they would also have to leave the execution judging aside at some point and try to enjoy it as a fan for the GE aspect of the show.

I can decry the judges all I want, but in the end, all I am doing is gnashing my teeth hopelessly, because I can't judge 8 different things at once....can you? I can speak intelligently on drill and on musicality, and GE as well since that is the easiest thing to judge as a fan...but to take on the job of 8 judges simultaneously? Can't be done.

You've perhaps seen instances of what YOU believe to be incorrect scores based on YOUR area of expertise, not based on the total package. And if you believe otherwise, you're deluding yourself, unfortunately.

[cantgetenoughcorps]

Whether you like the idea of not, you can tell a lot from previous post history...

For example, before anyone had a chance to hear Regiment's show via APD, you already had them in 7th place, despite their -even if you disagree with it- 3rd place show last year.

Then you sit here and tell us that Regiment's music was easy last year....have you ever conducted either of those two pieces? I've conducted Rhapsody, and I've got the score to AiP...let me tell you, that's not easy music. Not only from a technical standpoint, but from a stylistic standpoint, those two pieces are difficult to perform. Not everyone can blend classical and jazz effortlessly enough to sell it, and I feel Regiment did.

Granted...these are all just my opinions...and they are not necessarily right. However, I feel that their music last year was certainly harder than some other corps...yet you think they should have been 7th place. I'm sorry, I have trouble finding the 4 corps that should have beat them, but certainly I've got a bias. And to the casual observer, it appears as if you do too.

These are the sorts of things some people say....but you know what? It's too PC. There ARE corps and corps' philosophies that some of us don't like. Why is it a sin to admit it? There are tons of Cavalier alumni who detest Regiment or Scouts. There are plenty of PR alumni that detest SCV because of 1989. There are plenty of anti-Garfield Blue Devil people out there....why do we always try to mask ourselves in this "I love everyone" mold?

So....if you dislike Regiment....that's fine. It's ok. Let it out.

The reason for Phantom in 7th was not because of Phantom not being good, but I felt the performances of SCV, BD, Bluecoats and Scouts were going to top that this year. Just some preseason premonitions if you will. That along with the financial fiasco from last year with Phantom, and I predicted them for 7th. I am also not the only one who predicted them that low.

As a musician and judge myself, I didn't find Phantoms music from last year to be all that difficult. I have played both pieces(different arrangements) as a student, and don't find the level of difficulty of the original music as high as BD, Bluecoats, SCV, and Crown from last year.

While the end product may have been close to these other corps, the problem I see with the music, is that the runs etc, that they added to make the music more difficult, didn't quite fit in my opinion to the original score of music. Did the members do a great job of presenting what they were handed? Yes. Were the music and drill a letdown from PR the 2 previous years? Yes. I talked with many people who agreed with this last year. Even a poll taken on DCP last year had most people liking 03 and 04 shows better than 05, even though 05 place higher than the other 2 years.

As far as being PC, I don't do anything just to be PC. I honesly like all the corps. Are there shows I haven't been totally 100% excited about? Yes. Did I not like the corps that performed it? No. Just because I am less than excited about a certain show(and there have only been a few over the last 15 years) does not make me like a corps less. I may not agree with everything Hoppy says, for example, but that does not make me not like the Cadets, or even Hop for that matter. It just means I have a different point of view.

[Rocketman]

I am sorry, the compensation comment was supposed to be a little sarcastic,

My bad! :)

Back on topic, AIN'T Gonna happen!

RM

Edited June 30, 2006 by Rocketman

[Studio Tan]

You're allowed to be biased against a corps. I know I am...(and no, surprisingly, it isn't Cadets). And while I can still enjoy their shows, I know for sure that *I* don't give them the benefit of the doubt when they don't deserve it.

This leads me to another thought...

I think too many people are dishonest with themselves and with others...

"I love all corps," "don't get me wrong, I love _____," "I support everyone!" "I am not biased, every corps works hard and I enjoy them all..."

These are the sorts of things some people say....but you know what? It's too PC. There ARE corps and corps' philosophies that some of us don't like. Why is it a sin to admit it? There are tons of Cavalier alumni who detest Regiment or Scouts. There are plenty of PR alumni that detest SCV because of 1989. There are plenty of anti-Garfield Blue Devil people out there....why do we always try to mask ourselves in this "I love everyone" mold?

Humans are only -well- human! We have our likes and dislikes. It's ok to do so. It's healthy. It's human.

Brilliant. We should all take this advice.

[PhantomFanT10]

I can understand how you came to put Regiment in 7th place preseason. The fact that you still believe that they shouldn't have placed as highly as they did is rather scary. They executed their given program at a very high level. Most definatly better than Crown or Vanguard. And there's no way I would place that show on the "easy" list. That's just stupid. Crown's show had significantly less demand both technically and stylistically. But ironically, I thought Crown had a better sound. But off topic.

Phantom is going to win in 2007 because the Cadets will be slipped LSD plunging them into a bizarre and unknown...wait sorry, that's just their show, The Machine will rebel and enslave the Cavaiers to harness their energy; the select few who become unenslaved will not be able to teach Neo how to march cleanly before finals night, and the Blue Devils will be knocked off for hitting to close to home with the Mafia.

Edited July 1, 2006 by PhantomFanT10