Casella and the tilt......

[spirit7698]

We live in the USA. I have a right to express my opinion. It's called fredom of speech. If you don't agree, then express your own. I never once said the tilt has no use. I just don't see what the big deal is. ALL of the DCI Top 12 drumlines would be using it if it was so great. Currently, only a few snarelines do. Why's that?

I was on the DCP site late waiting to see who won finals and just decided to post about Blue Devils winning percussion. Believe me, I would have also posted if the Cavaliers had won percussion with those tilted snares. My point was missed by a few. Why don't more DCI drumlines use the tilt if it's so great. Very few use it.

So Santa Clara won percussion in 04. That's one winner of percussion with tilt in how many years now of the modern era of DCI? Can't think of any of the "Big Boys" using tilt since the early 70's and the invention of levelers. Only recently have a few snarelines used it. There must be a valid reason for that fact........

THE TILT MAKES SENSE!!!...

I know very few people who can play traditional on a flat surface while standing or sitting and not lean to the left.

Wait I'm sorry it can be done if you put your arms out almost straight or, pull your hands to your abs and elbows all the way back.

Unless you play no higher than 9" it is just about impossible to play the same height with both hands and have the same " angle/part" of each bead of the stick hit the head ( on that exact spot of the bead) while making your left stick/vs. right stick angle look symetrical.

If you do achieve this then take a look at the axis ( center of the rist ) of rotation/bend on both hands then you will notice that your left " axis" is going a bit higher than your right so that both sticks can achieve the same bead height. Meaning- the sticks are at different angles meaning you ARE getting a slightly different sound hand to hand.

Maybe the human ear can't detect hand to hand sound quality/consistency on kevlar top and bottom like it can on kevlar top mylar bottom or all mylar. :P

If you look up rudimental percussionist publication ( from 91/92/or 93 don't remember exactly) with the Crossmen drumline on the cover; Inside you will find an excellent article by Ken Mazur dealing with geometry, bone mass matched hand to tradish hand, stick rotation angles, wrist turn and rotation angles. Pretty intense and in depth thinking.

When S.C.V. got the first carriers ( not sling) people were throwing hissy fits cause they were playing matched ( although it was on a flat surface b**bs .

How come everyone is not doing it? Some people don't like change..., "If it works don't fix it"..........

There a larger # of lines doing it in Drum corps ( I/II AND III)

How many people here that played in lines that did not use much arm lift noticed that during the time they were playing the lower left side of the back was a little tight or uncomfortable???..

Who was the first line to play traditional on flat drums?

[Chronos]

We live in the USA. I have a right to express my opinion. It's called fredom of speech. If you don't agree, then express your own. I never once said the tilt has no use. I just don't see what the big deal is.

I didn't negate the fact that we live in the USA nor that we have freedom of speech. That was an unnecessary comment.

To me, it seems that you are trying to push the opinion onto others, like I had stated in the comment you replied to. You tend to provide your opinions as though it is fact. For example, you stated that "The TILT is just a gimmick" and that "It's NOT easier to play like that". There was no reference to those being personal opinions or personal styles of play. They were stated as though they are universal facts.

Also, I don't think it's a "big deal" to begin with. People can play great with either form and have many reasons to use one or the other, as has been stated within this thread. It's simply a matter of personal (or directorial) preference and ideology.

Cheers.

[pvt_cairns]

The pupose of the "tilt" come from the civil war days, where drummers used a drum at there side with a strap, kind of like old school drum corps, but even more pronounced. Thats where the "tarditional" grip came from in the first place. It was almost impossable to play the drum with matched grip. There is no ergonomic reason to play traditional grip on a straight snare, it causes issues with wrist problems, not to mention being highly inefficiant. That being said, I marched snare for a number of years on a straight snare using traditional grip, and then tried just recently tried to play on a tilted platform. I couldn't do it. I would have to reteach myself basic fundamentals with my left hand in particular. Everything changes, bead distances, flames, roles, the stroking. It all changes, easier on the body or not it's much much different. But I think it's like anything else, just takes time to learn and perfect, just like the first time we played traditional grip. It felt freakish and unnatural. I think the tilted drum has it's place, and kudos to the kids that have the ability to switch and be proficiant. Bottom line is that a good line, is a good line. Their fun to watch, and fun to be in. Have fun and play.

[Cadet311]

Actually, it dates to long before the revolutionary war and into european history.

[pvt_cairns]

I stand corrected.

[donincardona]

The snare tilt is a gimmick. Too old school for me. I played snare for 10 years & playing a tilted snare drum is more difficult to me. Also, watching a snare line with tilted snares isn't as pleasing to me..I mean thee is no symmetry to the style.

To me snare tilt = marching band

wrong. in the past ALL drumlines snares were tilted. drum corps always had tilted snares. we all used traditional grip and you had to tilt them. yes it's more difficult.....that was the point. in the 80's they stopped using traditional grip as the dumbing down of percussion began. rip me if you want but it's the truth. sorry

[Slow Adam]

wrong. in the past ALL drumlines snares were tilted. drum corps always had tilted snares. we all used traditional grip and you had to tilt them. yes it's more difficult.....that was the point. in the 80's they stopped using traditional grip as the dumbing down of percussion began. rip me if you want but it's the truth. sorry

Every corps in Division I played traditional grip last summer. Only a few corps here and there have played matched since the mid 80's.

Let's not play the "drum corps was harder in my day" game either, because the modern drum carriers that took slings off the knees and made snare drums flat also gave way to the visual demand on percussion lines today. We could argue over today's snare lines versus the snare lines of yesteryear - IMO two different animals. Blue Devils had great snare lines in the 70's, they had great snare line in the 80's, 90's and this decade as well.

Now, "dumbing down" as you put it is hardly a fair way to describe of the progress made by bass lines, tenor lines and front ensembles in the last 20 years; it really couldn't be further from the truth.

Drum lines run now. The top bass lines in Division III play harder stuff than the very best bass lines of the 70's. You can't even compare the first tenor lines to those from present day. Be proud of your era, but to say percussion has "dumbed down" is ignorant.

It's the truth.

Sorry.

[donincardona]

Every corps in Division I played traditional grip last summer. Only a few corps here and there have played matched since the mid 80's.

Let's not play the "drum corps was harder in my day" game either, because the modern drum carriers that took slings off the knees and made snare drums flat also gave way to the visual demand on percussion lines today. We could argue over today's snare lines versus the snare lines of yesteryear - IMO two different animals. Blue Devils had great snare lines in the 70's, they had great snare line in the 80's, 90's and this decade as well.

Now, "dumbing down" as you put it is hardly a fair way to describe of the progress made by bass lines, tenor lines and front ensembles in the last 20 years; it really couldn't be further from the truth.

Drum lines run now. The top bass lines in Division III play harder stuff than the very best bass lines of the 70's. You can't even compare the first tenor lines to those from present day. Be proud of your era, but to say percussion has "dumbed down" is ignorant.

It's the truth.

Sorry.

first saying anyone is ignorant is ignorant.........it's the truth....sorry

second i can have an opinion and i'm not talking brass. i realize that drumlines run now and i admit that i couldn't do it. i know that it's hard but i'm sorry they have been dumbing down corps for years. i was talking about the tilt. anybody that plays or played snare knows that it's harder to play traditional with a tilt. try to grasp what i'm saying.taking away the tilt is dumbing down.

just my opinion.

[Hulka]

anybody that plays or played snare knows that it's harder to play traditional with a tilt. try to grasp what i'm saying.taking away the tilt is dumbing down.

just my opinion.

Actually, from my experience playing on a til is way easier than a flat drum. Waaayyy easier. This past summer was the first time I've played on a tilt and absolutely loved the feel. Aesthetically I think I still prefer a snare line of flat drum but from a pure playing standpoint the tilt is my new preference.

[atlvalet]

THE TILT MAKES SENSE!!!...

I know very few people who can play traditional on a flat surface while standing or sitting and not lean to the left.

Wait I'm sorry it can be done if you put your arms out almost straight or, pull your hands to your abs and elbows all the way back.

Unless you play no higher than 9" it is just about impossible to play the same height with both hands and have the same " angle/part" of each bead of the stick hit the head ( on that exact spot of the bead) while making your left stick/vs. right stick angle look symetrical.

Huh? Is this post a joke?

Also, if your snare tech was good, and established good technique, all the above was easy. Cadets (among others) seemed to have figured things out, no?