CasualFan Posted March 19, 2010 Share Posted March 19, 2010 I'm a DCA rookie, so bear with me if this is somewhat ignorant. From what I can tell via the interwebs, there were 13 DCA Open Class corps competing in Prelims. 10 of those corps went on to Finals. With Brigs and Cru not competing this year, there are (as far as I know) 11 Open Class corps. As it stands, only one corps will not make finals. Is there any reason DCA might change the format of Finals weekend because of this. Maybe have the top 8 go onto finals, or have everyone go to finals ans just use prelim scores to determine order? Just a thought that popped into my head on the way to work. You have to remember DCA classes are not completely separate as compared to DCI. The top 10 corps, irregardless of class, are eligible to compete, if they so choose, in Open Class Finals unless there was a rule change that I am unaware of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idontwan2know Posted March 19, 2010 Share Posted March 19, 2010 (edited) You have to remember DCA classes are not completely separate as compared to DCI. The top 10 corps, irregardless of class, are eligible to compete, if they so choose, in Open Class Finals unless there was a rule change that I am unaware of. This was changed last year. Class A corps cannot transfer into Open Class finals even if they place in the top 10 in prelims. Why, if this is the case, they're still judged on the same sheets, in the same category, on the same scale, in prelims is a question for another day... Edited March 19, 2010 by idontwan2know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomPeashey Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 This was changed last year.Class A corps cannot transfer into Open Class finals even if they place in the top 10 in prelims. Why, if this is the case, they're still judged on the same sheets, in the same category, on the same scale, in prelims is a question for another day... reaching for my rule book.... part of what the poster was referring to about NOT being like DCI is true. Class A is still voluntary and you do NOT have to go into class A if you have 65 or fewer people. It's YOUR choice to do so. As a matter of fact, I'm going to have to go look it up, but I don't believe there is anything in the new rule about a corps changing their mind prior to the August 1 championship entry date and deciding to compete open class even though on June 1 they may have elected to go Class A... but I must check that... What is correct and this quote is talking about is that the A Class and Open prelims are now 2 separate shows and IF a corps in Class A scores higher than the 10th place corps in open prelims... no matter, they are still Class A and compete in Class A at Finals. This is a very healthy change and mostly a technical one. The way the judging system works, corps at the top of Class A were getting artificially clumpped together to allow the judge room to adjudicate the rest of the open class corps... in a small sub caption you may not have enough tenths (or hundreths) to work with... Show dynamics may cause a judge to be very conservative with his numbers to be sure he has room to properly fit everyone in. This is ALWAYS a problem when you adjudicate a larger quantity of groups... If the judge felt that Class A corps #1 was .2 better in a subcaption than Class A corps #2 and it was one big show and he still had 13 open class corps to "fit in" then he might reduce that difference to .1 better. Again it's called show dynamics and it happens all the time... We all know a tenth can mean a championship... by separating the Class A prelims and the Open Class prelims into 2 clearly separate contests, this is NOT a problem. It is MUCH fairer to the Class A competitors... not to mention how UNFAIR it would have been if a corps was forced to compete in open class and lose the opportunity to win the class A championship so they could come in 10th in open? YIKES... thank God that never happened - but we sure came close a couple of times. As for the comment on the sheets being different for Class A - nah... I'm not in favor of that... the judges handle the difference well... quality drum corps is quality drum corps and I see no reason to have two separate sets of sheets and systems... an added expense and more clinics necessary... not worth the bother... if it ain't broke - don't fix it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOSMarcher Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 Pretty sure there has been at least one year in the past where only 10 corps entered open class prelims, and there weren't any changes. I've heard great things about Sun Devils and their recruiting. Do you think it is possible they might make the jump? My first guess is no... but there isn't a rule stating you have to win Class A before you can move to Open Class. MCL didn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOSMarcher Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 ... add Vigilantes to that list, as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
84BDsop Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 Wow....Class A more numerous than Open..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xsnaredrummer Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 reaching for my rule book.... part of what the poster was referring to about NOT being like DCI is true. Class A is still voluntary and you do NOT have to go into class A if you have 65 or fewer people. It's YOUR choice to do so. As a matter of fact, I'm going to have to go look it up, but I don't believe there is anything in the new rule about a corps changing their mind prior to the August 1 championship entry date and deciding to compete open class even though on June 1 they may have elected to go Class A... but I must check that...What is correct and this quote is talking about is that the A Class and Open prelims are now 2 separate shows and IF a corps in Class A scores higher than the 10th place corps in open prelims... no matter, they are still Class A and compete in Class A at Finals. This is a very healthy change and mostly a technical one. The way the judging system works, corps at the top of Class A were getting artificially clumpped together to allow the judge room to adjudicate the rest of the open class corps... in a small sub caption you may not have enough tenths (or hundreths) to work with... Show dynamics may cause a judge to be very conservative with his numbers to be sure he has room to properly fit everyone in. This is ALWAYS a problem when you adjudicate a larger quantity of groups... If the judge felt that Class A corps #1 was .2 better in a subcaption than Class A corps #2 and it was one big show and he still had 13 open class corps to "fit in" then he might reduce that difference to .1 better. Again it's called show dynamics and it happens all the time... We all know a tenth can mean a championship... by separating the Class A prelims and the Open Class prelims into 2 clearly separate contests, this is NOT a problem. It is MUCH fairer to the Class A competitors... not to mention how UNFAIR it would have been if a corps was forced to compete in open class and lose the opportunity to win the class A championship so they could come in 10th in open? YIKES... thank God that never happened - but we sure came close a couple of times. As for the comment on the sheets being different for Class A - nah... I'm not in favor of that... the judges handle the difference well... quality drum corps is quality drum corps and I see no reason to have two separate sets of sheets and systems... an added expense and more clinics necessary... not worth the bother... if it ain't broke - don't fix it... With this rule change, why is it all shows but finals are just one class. As in: bucs 1st place, brigs 2nd, cru 3rd, govie's 4th, grenidiers 5th" Why isnt it announced govie's first in CLASS A??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cabalumnidrummer Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 "With this rule change, why is it all shows but finals are just one class. As in: bucs 1st place, brigs 2nd, cru 3rd, govie's 4th, grenidiers 5th" Why isn't it announced govie's first in CLASS A???" Just a guess, but would that be at the discretion of the contest /show host or sponsor? Or, does DCA dictate that sort of thing? Actually, I think that it might be nice to have class separation at regular season shows, at least occasionally, if not all the time. Scores and placements are good barometers for improvement for these corps, but an occasional 'win' in their class during the season would be a nice bonus and goal to shoot for each time they compete. They pretty much know winning the whole show is not a realistic outcome when some of the top open class corps are there, so why not have separate placements? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 because it was decided that Class A only applies to finals weekend With this rule change, why is it all shows but finals are just one class. As in: bucs 1st place, brigs 2nd, cru 3rd, govie's 4th, grenidiers 5th" Why isnt it announced govie's first in CLASS A??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 "With this rule change, why is it all shows but finals are just one class. As in: bucs 1st place, brigs 2nd, cru 3rd, govie's 4th, grenidiers 5th" Why isn't it announced govie's first in CLASS A???"Just a guess, but would that be at the discretion of the contest /show host or sponsor? Or, does DCA dictate that sort of thing? Actually, I think that it might be nice to have class separation at regular season shows, at least occasionally, if not all the time. Scores and placements are good barometers for improvement for these corps, but an occasional 'win' in their class during the season would be a nice bonus and goal to shoot for each time they compete. They pretty much know winning the whole show is not a realistic outcome when some of the top open class corps are there, so why not have separate placements? correction to my above post. there are some shows in which Class A is seperated from Open Class. and Tom, when the rule changed, i thought that with the June 1 date in place, nothing changed after that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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