Scores in 1974

[lindap]

Thanks to Guelph Opti-Knights for the scores of a local drum corps circuit in 1974.

edit: I didn't copy/paste enough. Sorry. Guelph Opti-Knights were a good drum corps.

MONDAY SEPTEMBER 2, 1974

TORONTO, ONTARIO

CANADIAN NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIPS

...CNE Stadium

Prelims:

KINSMEN KRESCENDOS 66.35

FLYING DUTCHMEN 59.75

CARDINALS OF PRECIOUS BLOOD 53.90

DUTCH BOY CADETS 51.05

OPTIMIST KNIGHTS 45.75

BLUEWATER BUCCANEERS 43.85

OPTIMIST LANCERS 33.65

We didn't make finals and this was my last competitive show.aged-out.

Edited June 22, 2013 by lindap

[BRASSO]

Those daily highs and lows made drum corps quite exciting.

My files show 49 junior contests prior to June 20 in 1974. And there are no doubt some missing from that total.

Back in the day, they'd be Corps with incomplete shows on the field in Mid May. I could understand that. But now, in an era where every MM can absorb their music charts quickly, and where computers can now generate their personal visual dots for their entire visual show, and the competition shows are 20%- 25% shorter in time duration than in earlier decades, we have World Class Division Corps with incomplete shows out on the field 5 weeks later, the end of June. Thats ridiculus in my opinion. But todays younger generation of DCI fans are conditioned to accept it as the norm. So... it becomes the norm. They desire no change in this practice apparently and are fully content with late June incomplete shows from the Elite portion of the World Class Division Corps. So, it is what it is.

Edited June 22, 2013 by BRASSO

[lindap]

What circuits/judging systems gave these scores? And how many were there in 1974?

Good question. I know of at least 2. In hindsight and as DM, wouldn't it be neat if I scanned the contents of the envelope that contained the recaps before I gave it to the instructional staff? If we received a cheque in 1974, I'd hand it over to the corps director immediately. We learned our music over the winter with 2 days a week practise in 1973-1974 and learned the entire drill over the May long weekend 74 (3 days) at a camp an hour's drive from the city in school buses. Flag work was added later ; )

[JimF-LowBari]

Good question. I know of at least 2. In hindsight and as DM, wouldn't it be neat if I scanned the contents of the envelope that contained the recaps before I gave it to the instructional staff? If we received a cheque in 1974, I'd hand it over to the corps director immediately. We learned our music over the winter with 2 days a week practise in 1973-1974 and learned the entire drill over the May long weekend 74 (3 days) at a camp an hour's drive from the city in school buses. Flag work was added later ; )

LOL some of the quotes I still remember are from the years we did both DCA (more execution based) and lower level Red Carpet Assoc (more GE based). One night at practice we must have been a bit sloppy and heard "<bunch of swear words> We have a DCA show this time... DCA!!! Execute #### it EXECUTE!!".

[lindap]

LOL some of the quotes I still remember are from the years we did both DCA (more execution based) and lower level Red Carpet Assoc (more GE based). One night at practice we must have been a bit sloppy and heard "<bunch of swear words> We have a DCA show this time... DCA!!! Execute #### it EXECUTE!!".

I remember going to contests in the early 1970's where Junior Corps (under 21) and Senior Corps (over 21) competed at the same contest. I wonder if they used the same scoring system? Before 1972 DMs were instructors or directors. In 1972, all members had to be under 21 for Jr. That's why so many guard captains became DMs imo : )

[reallyoldfrt]

Dusting off my creaking memory cells. Ah! That's better. Judging in 1974 was mostly TICK based. Most corps', even very good ones, performance level varied quite widely from show to show due to the fact that most corps of that era were made up primarily of "kids off the street", who had been taught what music they performed as a skill, not as an art. Sometimes it all just clicked sympatico. Other times, for any number of reasons, it all fell apart on the field.

These kids, even in the great corps, were not "music majors". They were just ordinary kids with widely diverse talent levels. So it is very logical that a vast quality difference could occur from show to show. That was part of the fascination of drum corps back then. You never knew which of 10,000 versions of your corps' show was going to unfold each time you set foot on the field. Under the tick system, if you performed poorly you tended to get a poor mark. If you performed well you were likely to get a good mark. This is not so true today. Nowadays a corps' show, written and taught by paid professionals, is worth a fairly firm base mark. The levels of performance of the very few, very talented, very professional corps who can still afford to go into competition vary only minutely.

Judging back in the day was performed by people who began their drum corps careers the same way as the kids they were judging. They were not professionals any more than the instructors of the corps they were judging. Both groups worked for gas money and a box lunch, and because they loved doing it. Most corps competed in a limited geographical area. Most judges did too. They did meet often. They did know each others tendencies, strengths, and weaknesses. Many of the instructors and judges had grown up in the area, knew each other well. In many instances they had marched together in the same units or in competing units.

We are speaking of hundreds of drum corps. Maybe thousands. There was no significant money involved in any of it. No one was making a living at drum corps. It was completely outside of all the participant's day-to-day lives. Do any of you think that Stetson D Richmond, or Moe Knox, or Bobby Bellarosa, or Tony Schlechta, or Sie Lurie was making a living from drum corps?

Nowadays it's all about money. You know it. I know it. Even BMI and NASCAP know it.

In the day, if you wanted a better score, you went out into the woodshed and practiced, and worked harder. And it worked. Your scores improved. And it cost no money, just effort. That, to me, was one of the major positives of the tick system. It emphasized execution. Particularly in VFW rules, where execution was almost everything. If your corps had 20 horns you had a fair chance to beat some big time corps hornline in Field Brass, because you could out-execute them. (You had fewer kids to make mistakes; were playing simpler charts.) You still might not beat the big timer in total score because they DID play better stuff, DID get better GE scores. But you could beat them in a caption. You had a fair chance to do that. If you did manage it , no one could take it away from you. It gave you hope. It gave you a reason to keep at it. It gave you a reason to survive. To keep trying.

Today that kind of incentive does not exist the way DCI and their henchmen have the game rigged. The little guy has no chance, no matter what he does.

Edited June 27, 2013 by reallyoldfrt

[Ray Priester]

Dusting off my creaking memory cells. Ah! That's better. Judging in 1974 was mostly TICK based. Most corps', even very good ones, performance level varied quite widely from show to show due to the fact that most corps of that era were made up primarily of "kids off the street", who had been taught what music they performed as a skill, not as an art. Sometimes it all just clicked sympatico. Other times, for any number of reasons, it all fell apart on the field.

These kids, even in the great corps, were not "music majors". They were just ordinary kids with widely diverse talent levels. So it is very logical that a vast quality difference could occur from show to show. That was part of the fascination of drum corps back then. You never knew which of 10,000 versions of your corps' show was going to unfold each time you set foot on the field. Under the tick system, if you performed poorly you tended to get a poor mark. If you performed well you were likely to get a good mark. This is not so true today. Nowadays a corps' show, written and taught by paid professionals, is worth a fairly firm base mark. The levels of performance of the very few, very talented, very professional corps who can still afford to go into competition vary only minutely.

Judging back in the day was performed by people who began their drum corps careers the same way as the kids they were judging. They were not professionals any more than the instructors of the corps they were judging. Both groups worked for gas money and a box lunch, and because they loved doing it. Most corps competed in a limited geographical area. Most judges did too. They did meet often. They did know each others tendencies, strengths, and weaknesses. Many of the instructors and judges had grown up in the area, knew each other well. In many instances they had marched together in the same units or in competing units.

We are speaking of hundreds of drum corps. Maybe thousands. There was no significant money involved in any of it. No one was making a living at drum corps. It was completely outside of all the participant's day-to-day lives. Do any of you think that Stetson D Richmond, or Moe Knox, or Bobby Bellarosa, or Tony Schlechta, or Sie Lurie was making a living from drum corps?

Nowadays it's all about money. You know it. I know it. Even BMI and NASCAP know it.

In the day, if you wanted a better score, you went out into the woodshed and practiced, and worked harder. And it worked. Your scores improved. And it cost no money, just effort. That, to me, was one of the major positives of the tick system. It emphasized execution. Particularly in VFW rules, where execution was almost everything. If your corps had 20 horns you had a fair chance to beat some big time corps hornline in Field Brass, because you could out-execute them. (You had fewer kids to make mistakes; were playing simpler charts.) You still might not beat the big timer in total score because they DID play better stuff, DID get better GE scores. But you could beat them in a caption. You had a fair chance to do that. If you did manage it , no one could take it away from you. It gave you hope. It gave you a reason to keep at it. It gave you a reason to survive. To keep trying.

Today that kind of incentive does not exist the way DCI and their henchmen have the game rigged. The little guy has no chance, no matter what he does.

BINGO!!!!!!!

[lindap]

1974 was a year of raw talent, hard work and music appreciation. He started in colour guard in an all male corps and was baritone in 1974. He marched with my brother in 72 and is a music teacher : )

http://www.dci.org/news/view.cfm?news_id=5c7bc407-abe2-4a79-8b72-89507716d2da

[drumno5]

...the way DCI and their henchmen have the game rigged...

Yeah, the golden age of drum corps, when it was all for the kids: back when Tony Schlechta fixed the scores at Nationals, when the chief judge at a local show I marched in came up to our director as we were boarding our buses and took back the first place trophy we had won, after he decided to assess a penalty long after the show was over and the scores/placements had been announced.

Those sure were the good old days.

Peace,

Fred O.

[CrunchyTenor]

Yeah, the golden age of drum corps, when it was all for the kids: back when Tony Schlechta fixed the scores at Nationals, when the chief judge at a local show I marched in came up to our director as we were boarding our buses and took back the first place trophy we had won, after he decided to assess a penalty long after the show was over and the scores/placements had been announced.

Those sure were the good old days.

Peace,

Fred O.

Y'all shoulda jumped off the bus, kicked his ###, and taken the trophy back...like the good old days.

Garry in Vegas