jwillis35

great soloist, nice job

ballad is lovely! Guard is just not adding anything though. The red streamers are not cutting it.

The volume is just WOW! They are blowin'. The 2nd tune is where things break down some. Lots of clutter, not very clean, and the drill and music do not flow as well. The opener is wonderful.

Holy mello/horn volume!!! Just be careful. But wow, I really dig their opener.

man, those are some difficult parts. Nice job baritones and tubas

excellent trumpet feature

It is difficult to keep the feed in sync if you have two open. I had it for a while and was clicking back and forth to hear stereo or commentary, but every once in a while you have to hit the play button off and on to refresh the audio, and that throws them off sync.

Boston is really improving. Great show, great use of field. Still some things to work on. They could hang on to their spot over Phantom and Blue Stars, but we'll see. I do not think they are in the Bluecoats league just yet. BLOOO is a lot better than people think this year. But Phantom and Blue Stars will definitely have their work cut out for them.

John Cage!! Who else!

love the steel drum effect

Not bad, and yes the brass is really blowing, but at times they get a real nasty edge, with the baritones almost putting their tongues through those things. Be careful guys. Nice music.

I actually love the capes. It's unique for today. I also really like the Crossmen's music, but yes they have lots to clean. This show can go a long way if they clean.

Right on, Harvey!!! Bravo, Bravo! Well done and well written. I haven't seen everyone yet (at least live), but I knew when I saw Cadets early (and they were really dirty) that we could be looking at a true classic from these guys. It could easily win, but that aside this show will definitely thrill the audiences for the rest of the season. And I agree with you and your friends, the competition from 6 to 10, and beyond, is truly amazing. Now if DCI can figure out a way to maximize all this excitement and entertainment in a brand name that starts making them more money, I think we could see a turn-a-round. But the economy really hit at a bad time.

I can't comment much on the guard, but Cadets percussion book is incredibly demanding, and tastefully written. I think they will be top 3 in percussion when it's all said and done.

A couple of quick notes: 1. Not to bash or be mean-spirited, but I tend to agree with the person who cited that this is a hot topic and therefore will get discussed. This is DCP, a place for discussion and argument (in a positive way). Phantom is a hot topic this year. It seems to me that if someone feels a topic has been beaten to death that they feel the need to chime in a try and close the thread or tell everyone to stop posting about it, the argument is over. Well, it's not over. There is plenty to discuss, and plenty of shows to go. This is the place for it. This is no different than these people that want to create "Official" threads for everything under the sun, and when a new topic is created that discusses the same thing, but perhaps in a slightly different way, people want it to stop or be joined. There might be a time for that, but sometimes it's best to leave the new topic open. Nobody really wants to add to something 40 pages long and 200 to 300 threads in quantity, especially after things get off topic and all. 2. As for Phantom. Honestly, it is a hot topic. A DCI Champion from last year is looking at 9th place at the moment. That is a big fall. Having said that, Phantom is actually quite good this year. They have brass, drums, and some excellent music. Did the show pan out as planned? Probably not. This is the tough thing about drum corps. It is really very difficult to design a World-Class show and hope that it will beat out others who are doing the same thing. I really like their music, and the brass and drums are again of Phantom quality. Maybe a bit young if you ask me, but I wouldn't know for sure. In all this debate that pops up from time to time about wanting new faces in the top 5 or so, we must remember that if this is really what we want, we must expect that some of these long-time "traditional" powers are going to get knocked off their perch once in a while. It's nice when it happens to the "other" guy's corps, but when it's your favorite, or at least a show you like, it feels awkward. Most people on here know that I grew up loving the Cadets. I am sure it had a lot to do with my age and being in HS in the early 80s when they were making some serious waves. But I also grew up loving a local corps, the Bluecoats of Canton, and never in my wild imagination think that BLOOOOO could beat the Cadets, or Cavaliers, or BD. But they have, and even beat Cadets at finals in 2006. It has been fun to watch Crown rise in the ranks. I think we all love seeing some of these new names move up the ranks, but with that comes peril for others, and some powerful competitor will fall, even if just for that year. I know some of us want to think our favorites will never fall, or should never fall, but it will happen. The BIG 3 (BD, Cadets, Cavs) have been somewhat immune to this, which is why they are the BIG 3. But they will have their moments. And now we see a reigning DCI Champion falling...BUT NOT FAILING! They are still Phantom, and they are darn good. No matter what their placement is this year, YOU KNOW they will be back.

Here I would disagree. I think the Blue Devils are packed with great music and wonderful drill that flows fell. That is a great show. And the Cadets are just magnificent in all aspects. People have said they like their drill but not the music. To the contrary for me. Their music is exciting, riveting, and well crafted. Is it perfect? No. Are there a few spots that they need some enhancement? Yes. But the design is far better than people give it credit for, and the audiences at the shows (live) have been going wild for the Cadets all season. I can listen to or watch BD and Cadets all day! Now that is drum corps!

For me it goes like this: 1978 - first saw drum corps on TV: Phantom was my favorite corps 1979 - saw some shows live, but not finals: favorite = Phantom 1980 - saw shows live, but not finals: favorite = 27th Lancers 1981 - plenty of live shows, no finals: favorite = SCV and Madison FINALLY, I get to finals with my father in Montreal in 1982. The remaining years are all years I attended finals. Obviously I have seen live shows on years that I did not go. 1982: favorite = SCV and Garfield 1985: favorite = Garfield 1986: favorite = BD, Garfield, and Spirit 1987: favorite = Garfield and SCV (Phantom was also amazing) 1989: favorite = Phantom 1990: favorite = Cadets and BD (loved Tommy) 1992: favorite = Cadets and Star 1995: favorite = Bluecoats, Cadets (girlfriend was marching that year), and Madison (duh) 1996: favorite = BD, Phantom, Cadets, and Madison 1997: favorite = BD, Madison 1998: favorite = SCV, Cadets, Cavaliers 2000: favorite = Cadets, Cavaliers 2001: favorite = Cadets, Cavaliers, Bluecoats 2002: favorite = Cavaliers, BD, Bluecoats 2003: favorite = Phantom, BD, Bluecoats 2008: favorite = Phantom

Scores fluctuate for many reasons. The more corps in a show, the more variance because of spreads. A judge has two jobs: 1. offer insights and opinions about a show (in their caption) and offer positive feedback about how that particular aspect of the show is taking shape. 2. When it comes time to assign a number for that caption, they must accurately reflect the level of the construction (design), the demand, and the performance. Each caption, of course, is different. When doing this they compare because it is, after all, competition. For instance: Corps A performs. My caption is brass. They play a medium level book (middle box, demand), they have some construction issues to work out, and the performance level is still weak. Let's just say brass is 20 points. Let's say I am instructed to give 1/4 to demand, 1/4 to design/construction, 1/2 to performance. Demand is OK, so I give them a 2.5, and construction has issues, so 1.75, and they get 5 out of 10 for performance. It's a typical early season performance. Well, my score for them in brass is 9.25 out of 20. Ok, we see scores like that in brass early in the season. And no, I don't think DCI uses this method, but I am using it as an example. Now, the next show I see this same corps, they perform a little better, but they also go on after a corps that I feel is a bit better (corps B), yet corps B is also middle of the pack, and they themselves had to perform after a corps that was very weak (corps C). So Corps C set the low bar, and corps B was judged against that bar (the spreads), and now I have to fit corps A in between, because they were less that corps B, but better than corps C. My spread ranking will more likely reflect differences between corps B and A, not C. Corps C helped me adjust the correct spreads between them and corps B, and then corps B helped me to get the spreads right for corps A. In the long run, corps A did perform better, but their score could easily have gone down by a point or so. I let them know on the tape that they did better, but the corps above them was a bit better, and those spreads are reflected. Often times it can work out that both improvement can be shown through score and placement, but placement, ABOVE ALL ELSE, is what matters...because it's a competition. The best wins! PERIOD! Scores do not matter in this regard, what matters is the placement. The more corps there are in a show, the more variance there will be because there are only a finite set of numbers to deal with (0-100) and spreads must be accurately reflected. This makes it a challenge for judges, and that is why sometimes even the spreads can be off or a little weird. But placement, in most cases, is very accurate. Obviously we all have opinions about that, but by and large DCI gets it right when it comes to placement...and the spreads have largely been very accurate as well. Whether or not a corps' score can continue to go up all season largely depends on the basement and the ceiling.

Good question! Here are some things to keep in mind: 1. Each corps handles this differently (the design phase), so the changes that often occur in the summer may focus more on visual or music depending on what was not completed at spring training, or what was planned for later in the season, or they are affected by scores and the comments the judges are giving them. 2. The late fall and winter months are typically spent on music. The music arranger has a short period of time to put some stuff together for the first camp, then with each additional camp there will be more music. It is difficult for a visual guy to write drill or sketch when the music is in a constant state of flux until perhaps April. At least by then they can start blocking due to weather and a somewhat complete music book. However, even then there will be changes musically until they get things right. So what I am saying is that by the time you see these corps after spring training, chances are that the music book will be in better shape than the visual. This is because of the constant re-writes and editing that takes place all winter long. The visual, at least for most corps, doesn't really take shape until spring, and often times spring training is where the real work gets done. If the weather is bad during this period then there will be delays (i.e. corps that play their entire show but must stand for the last song or the last minute or so until the drill is finished).

Phantom Regiment will be just fine. They always regroup and put on one heck of a show for finals, regardless of placement. Just enjoy what you can. New endings don't save corps. A new ending might help a good corps become even better, and it may push a great show over the top (Phantom 2008), but the "new ending" dialog that permeates on DCP, like adding one or changing one is the ultimate in fixups, is just not a good way to save a show. Phantom has a great tradition, some wonderful staff, and they know exactly what's wrong with their show this year. They also know what they can do to enhance that product and how to get the kids to perform even better. And I GUARANTEE that they will perform their socks off at finals. Be that as it may, designing a world-class corps show is not easy, and this year it just didn't work the way they were hoping. No biggy! It's just a placement, and maybe a little pride. The more important thing is making sure the kids have a great time, get a good education, good experience, get down the road and back home safely, and in the process I believe they will make lots of fans happy. This show is still not bad at all. I like the music, and the brass is still classic Phantom, although I think they are younger. I submit to all of you that a new ending at this point might actually set them back. THey have plenty to clean as it is.

If drum corps today was more localized, in other words if there were more regional circuits and corps that competed in those regions of the country, then the issue of leaving a corps for the "elite" and all the reasons to do so would not be as big a topic. Drum and bugle corps today is still competitive, but it's also more of a national tour with national marketing. In the old days it was about how the local kids from my city could compete with the local kids from your city. Their was a pride in where you came from. The early part of the summer was dedicated to local/regional shows and those corps did not travel all that far. In the middle of the summer and toward the end you would hit the regionals, and at the end you would travel the longest distance to attend world finals, or VFW. The model that is much more in play today is one similar to professional sports, except there is no money in it and it's not nearly as popular. But some things are very much alike. Many who get drafted by an MLB team usually start by playing A or AA ball. They want to move up to AAA, and eventually the Majors. This means a move up in quality and a move in terms of city or location. Sure, the experience at A ball can be good, but it can only take you so far. Ultimately they want AAA, or better yet, Major League. Football players are constantly trying to move up in their ability, making the 2-deep roster, and after high school many of them want to get a scholarship to a college. They do not all stay in state or play for their local college. Why? Because it is about going where they can achieve greatness, where they get the right training, where they feel the best, perhaps where they have a better chance at the 2-deep, or where a position is being guaranteed (quarterback). Some cannot play at the college level, and most will never play in the NFL, but that remains their dream, and if they can get there they will move to any city to be a member of a NFL team and to collect that paycheck. With drum corps being much more national--its tour, marketing, the membership, web-based business, etc.--the plus side was the high quality of students that come from all over the country to march with certain corps. We see some amazing things in this activity. The down side of the national presence is that local corps have been hurt or all but wiped out. Local circuits have mostly died, and finding LOCAL help to work bingo, run fundraisers, be on committees, and volunteer for about a million other things has diminished. People like myself get overworked doing stuff that other kids' parents (and those kids) could be helping with, but they are all from elsewhere, so folks like me are left to help fund a corps that doesn't march any local kids. To call it a regional corps is really a stretch as well. Yet, the corps wants to house their operation in some city, and they want city funds and city help, and city facilities. You see, this is the case with almost all of the corps today, and it presents a BIG problem. But for all that, I don't think the national presence is going anywhere anytime soon. And as long as you have these elite corps and a competitive status that promotes the best, you will have kids from all over the country who aspire to march the best. Just like in sports, they wish to move up the ladder, much like we all do in our careers. Moving up the ladder means going to a better corps with a better foundation and better teaching, and perhaps one with more name recognition. I do agree with many others here that it is YOU who has a choice. Your choice is dependent on what you want out of the experience. Do you want to win or learn? Do you have to score high to get both winning and learning, or can that be done separately? What style do you like? What do you know about the corps? All those things must be considered...and cost of course. Also, because there are no local corps anymore (at least not by the old definition) chances are you will have to travel to march with someone. What can you afford and what can you deal with in terms of travel?

Phantom will be fine. So maybe this year they don't win, or place top 3. It happens. Designing a drum corps show to compete at the world class level, or any level, is really difficult. Sometimes ideas that you think will work do not pan out, and concepts that you are sure will bring applause and entertainment do not. Add that to the fact that Phantom gave us one of those rare special treats last year with Spartacus. That show was an instant CLASSIC! It was a Garfield 84 or 87, a Blue Devils 86 or 88, an SCV 87 or 89, a Cavaliers 2002, a Madison Scouts 1995. The chances of repeating a show that good are tough. Garfield in 86 and 88 could not come close to their success in 85 or 87. The 3-peats with Garfield (83-85) and The Cavaliers (2000-2002) stand as amazing feats, but I don't know that each of those 3 shows were true "classics." They won, and that is pretty darn good. However, we haven't seen a repeat winner now since 2002. I believe Phantom is very young this year, and they do have some new staff. So it will take time to develop things. I wouldn't count them out of the top 5 this year, but I am sure they will be good again.

This is one of the great things about the activity, the evolution of a season. I, myself, did not think much of the Cavaliers show when I saw them in Toledo. I still do not like their music book, but as I said in my review of their show, I knew they would tweak and clean and add layers and turn this show into a good one. They certainly have the know how. I am not sure the show is top 3. I know they are scoring high now, but I have this feeling that Crown and Cadets are just behind BD, and Crown might be in front. This is the great thing, none of us really knows. BY the way, having watched the Cavaliers a good bit more on the FN I do find some great moments in their show. As always, the visual is wonderful. I am loving SCV and think they will be one of the dark horses in the end. And I still think Crown and HNC could be 1 and 2 come finals, only I still give the nod to HNC. They are flat out amazing and just need to clean that show. As for scores in different locations, if we went by spreads, then I think the Cadets score from last night would be comparable to the Cavaliers score. I believe Cavaliers beat Phantom by 2.7 or around 3.0 points the last time they met. The Cadets beat Phantom last night by 3.2. Not scientific, but it may be an indication. Here's hoping the Bluecoats clean the visual and add a few layers to get that show moving. They have a great brass and percussion section!

Great review! Loved it!

There are a lot of directions we can go with this. In short, identity is a good thing, and for each corps to have a unique identity is good. Whether it helps you competitively or not, it certainly helps others decide if they would like to march a certain corps. The success of a corps is not based on scores ONLY, but on recruiting and the experience members have while marching with a certain group. Did they learn, did they enjoy themselves, do they like the show and the style (identity), was the experience worthwhile, and did they improve? Having a successful organization means recruiting, quality service, fund raising, marketing, and teamwork. An identity can help you recruit, raise funds, and market your operation. But there is more: an identity is what many fans look forward to seeing when your corps steps on the field. You are not just trying to be like everyone else. You have your own style, your own way of doing things...an identity. So, in this sense it is also important for the future of DCI and the entertainment of its fans. How important is an identity to winning? Here is where things are complicated. In a very general sense, it's not as important to have an identity to win or score high in drum corps. When Garfield changed their identity in the early 80s they were more successful for doing so. Same with the Cavaliers in 84 and 85. Some corps, however, just need to find ANY identity in order to get better at selling their shows to the fans and judges. Success, in terms of performance, is mainly a result of good teaching, solid basics and skill building, and excellent performers. Performing a show at a high level is the quickest way to improve your score. But... Garfield and the Cavaliers are two examples of corps that already had very clear identities in the 1970s, and they were largely very successful corps; but the change in style in the early 80s made them more competitive. It was a clear identity shift in each case, spearheaded by two visual designers (Zingali and Brubaker). We know this because that style change lasted. It didn't just phase in one year and out the next, and it didn't die off after just a few years. The above style change was not only a shift in identity, but it helped to present the corps' performers in a much different light. This helped each corps to achieve greater awareness of show development, general effect impact points, and there was a sophistication to the new look. Obviously, it helps to have performers who can play and march the show, and the Cavaliers and Cadets have always had great talent, but design helps, and, in this case, the shift in identity made all the difference. In 1989 the Cavaliers did not have the brass or percussion to beat the Blue Devils if only those two captions were judged. It was their fabulous show design, the coordination of music and drill, the inclusion of guard, and a style that was readable and sophisticated that spoke to fans and judges, and that allowed them to take 3rd at Finals. Garfield's identity shift in the early 80s allowed them to change how judges looked at the sheets a bit. Even before the tic system was eliminated, Garfield clearly said (not out loud but through their identity shift) that they would use demand, speed, and a new curvilinear design to challenge what was expected of a drum corps. This created a new look and feel to a show. Some liked it, some did not, but it was new and fresh, and it helped to separate them from the other corps. Some corps have struggled with finding a style. For years, Spirit of Atlanta had a fantastic style of playing southern music, but that style (identity) was only going to last for so long. When the time came to make a shift, it was difficult and I felt as though the corps was searching for many years trying to rekindle past glory but also find that new niche. I believe the Madison Scouts are going through this at this very moment, and many probably wish they would bring back the old identity. I will say that, in Madison's case, their old style was one that would translate for many decades and not get old, although it would need a refresher once in a while. The Cadets have made a living on an identity that was started in 1980-82, even though they have tinkered here and there with other things (electronics, voice, narration, singing, etc.). But their basic style is unchanged and almost every show of theirs will have some trademark Cadets (Garfield) like moves and music. Those of us who are fans of these various corps always look forward to what we consider the "look and feel" of that corps.