LAMystreaux Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 1.) Slotting has to end. If 5 corps are competitive in the brass caption, then 5 corps take 19.8's and 20's home with them. Same in other captions.2.) Judging community standards have GOT to come up. Too much bias, for BD brass, for Cavies visual/GE, etc. Whoever has had 30 great years in whatever caption just MIGHT have an off-year in, say colorguard, and not fare so well because of it. Oops! Doesn't matter if you're a wannabe bus mom for that corps, you have to be CAPABLE and WILLING to put them in third or even--EGAD!--6th!! Heaven forbid. My thoughts. Ding ding ding. . .winner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rut-roh Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 I never said that, they can win brass with a 19.2, and it would have looked like he gave ample room incase someone had a better brassline. It's not the number that was the deal, it was how much room he gave incase he would see a better brassline. If they satisfy the criteria on the back of the sheet to the point where the judge thinks they actually DESERVE a 19.8 or a 19.9 (according to that judge's interpretation of the sheets), then that's what they should get. Not a 19.2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaSqueegee Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 Well.......the guard judges were not afraid to mix things up this season!! :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mouthpiece1234 Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 If they satisfy the criteria on the back of the sheet to the point where the judge thinks they actually DESERVE a 19.8 or a 19.9 (according to that judge's interpretation of the sheets), then that's what they should get. Not a 19.2. The sheet is a guide not a checkbox. Judges judge by comparison not the number. This is why it doesn't make sense to compare numbers from different shows as we all know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmurrey74 Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 Yes I did see them live this season....numerous times and from numerous angles. Their feet were dirty hmm...me too. And I'll continue to disagree. oh and on the fact that almost their entire visual staff is being let go...that does not happen if the corps is happy with the performance of that caption If that's true, than that's a shame. The corps seems to be moving in the right direction from a performance standpoint. They moved much better this year than in 2006. Sure they moved alright. They just did not move (In my opinion) as well as:BD Cavies Cadets Crown SCV Phantom Blue Knights Boston I would have to rank them: BD Cadets Bluecoats Cavies Crown Phantom SCV Blue Knights Boston Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvertrombone Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 SilvertromboneI agree with most of your post except your comment about the 4/6/7 corps winning the captions untill finals week. That is the problem. The judges made calls at those earlier shows becuase it was easier (i.e shows were smaller and therefore made comparisons easier and the numbers managament easier). But in the end none of these corps won a caption during finals week. Crown's guard probably should have won...they didn't Bluecoats brass probably should have won...they didn't Pnathom's Percussion section definately should have won....they didn't I was very excited coming in to finals week just for this reason. A bunch of corps that are not in the title hunt that could win caption awards. ...but in the end the same thing happened that always does: the caption awards are reserved for the top three silvertrombone is all lower-case. :) I think I'm correct that these corps' in these captions were winning over EVERYBODY face-to-face, head-to-head. PR won drums at SA, I think, Blooo brass, and Crown was 2nd in guard if I remember. And I don't think this changed much until 1/4finals in head-to-head's. My earlier post stated two things that MIGHT have changed the results in these. 1.) Score them where they should be. If we have a tie in a caption, oh well--make two trophies! If the 4/6/7 corps walk with the caption awards, fine. That's REALLY exciting, as you said, because we could easily have 8-12 corps scoring above 95 in finals within 5 years. Not only does that allow great movement year to year, but between 1/4's, semis, and finals. 2.) Judging standards must be updated. I nominate college band/music instructors for the role. I'm sure you can find enough to judge who are not biased from participating in one or the other, they will be more capable of identifying a quality drumline as soon as they hear them playing, and they bring great academic, professional, and adjudication experience to the table that, sadly, many of our current judges cannot come CLOSE to! I'd LOVE to see a different 1st place corps each night of championships and those three be different than the caption winners--wow!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audiodb Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 Well, the number has a message too. It's a SCALE, for crying out loud, and the actual numbers and spreads are supposed to have relevance. Yes, but the first two priorities of the judge are to rank and rate (in that order). Making sure the caption winner has an impressive-looking 19.8 or higher should not take precedence over those two primary tasks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
octavia9299 Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 Yes, but the first two priorities of the judge are to rank and rate (in that order). Making sure the caption winner has an impressive-looking 19.8 or higher should not take precedence over those two primary tasks. Ranking is putting the corps in order and rating is matching the performance to the rubrick or criteria reference, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowtown Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 You want the real reason? They watered down their brass book to try and get their visual scores up because that what the judges suggested It didn’t work Tip: usually when the judges talk about your GE or visuals scores being low, they are saying ‘Not this year’. Those are the fluffiest scores where politics and pageantry judging really make their mark. Its harder to fake brass and drum scores, often you’ll see good, worthy corps do well in Brass and Drums yet never make it to the big dance, that’s politics and pageantry or visual and GE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randomnoise Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 Looks like we have identified a number of possibilities (some more realistic than others): 1. Quarters score was an anomaly 2. Semis and Finals scores were anomalies 3. Coats peaked early 4. Judges suck 5. When all corps were at the same show, Coats placement changed 6. Going on early (potentially) affects your score This year's top seven was the best ever (I think we can agree on that). Another thing I think we can agree on is that BD has a great brass staff and has generally done quite well in the caption. It is not too much of a stretch to consider the idea that BD won Brass because they know how to win Brass better than anyone else! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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