drumcat Posted December 7, 2007 Share Posted December 7, 2007 I'll keep this short... Most sports leagues, particularly the top pro leagues, adjust their rules annually. They usually focus on two main ideas; player safety and fan interest. In drum corps, the teams and the coaches change the rules, for self interest. It's the instructors who push the rules, and are generally the most liberal in asking for any and all changes. Now imagine for a moment if football still had a 15 yard penalty for an incomplete pass. Do you think it was the coaches that asked for something like this? No. It was in the fan interest, making their game the offensive style you have today. I could give example after example, but the key is that rules changes are almost always made in the interest of fans, and getting them in the gates. DCI doesn't seem to be based around this, and I find it a fatal error. When, if ever, are rules going to be driven by gate receipts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerriTroop Posted December 7, 2007 Share Posted December 7, 2007 I could give example after example, but the key is that rules changes are almost always made in the interest of fans, and getting them in the gates. DCI doesn't seem to be based around this, and I find it a fatal error. When, if ever, are rules going to be driven by gate receipts? Answer: when "education" and "art" is less emphasized by those making the rules. Rules changes in DCI are about artistic direction - often masked under the "education" umbrella. The problem with that is the reward for doing a show that has less artistic demand but more audience appeal is lower placement. That said, I think you can pull off a top 12 caliber show with absolute audience appeal as long as you don't mind the competitive hit to the ego. I think Crown was the closest thing to that this year, in terms of top 12. I enjoyed a lot of other top 12 shows in 2007, but Crown is the show I would show total newbies who don't get it just yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted December 7, 2007 Share Posted December 7, 2007 I could give example after example, but the key is that rules changes are almost always made in the interest of fans, and getting them in the gates. DCI doesn't seem to be based around this, and I find it a fatal error. When, if ever, are rules going to be driven by gate receipts? Gate receipts are up at DCI events since the lowest point in the mid-90's. This covers the era of multi-key and amps. The changes are made in the iterest of fans as well as the corps themselves. Why do you think they are not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corpsvalues Posted December 7, 2007 Share Posted December 7, 2007 In drum corps, the teams and the coaches change the rules, for self interest. It's the instructors who push the rules, and are generally the most liberal in asking for any and all changes. This may be true... but as is written on the DCI.org web site nearly every year since I've been following the rules congress meetings every January, the most radical and "liberal" ideas generated by the instructors very rarely ever make it out of their "caucus" sessions and are very seldom ever approved by the board when put to a full vote. Even though the directors have approved several controversial ideas over the past few seasons, most of the things that could be construed as REALLY progressive / liberal / controversial stuff hasn't been approved. This makes sense (to me, at least) since the top designers and instructors are the guys "living in the trenches," and they are the creative forces who want to experiment with new things, pushing their directors to create change. Thus, the sensitive balance between traditions of the past and innovation/evolution of the art form. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corpsvalues Posted December 7, 2007 Share Posted December 7, 2007 Gate receipts are up at DCI events since the lowest point in the mid-90's. This covers the era of multi-key and amps. The changes are made in the iterest of fans as well as the corps themselves. Why do you think they are not? Is this because of more people flooding into shows or because DCI is charging more at the gate? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Bari Posted December 7, 2007 Share Posted December 7, 2007 The changes are made in the iterest of fans as well as the corps themselves. That's the most laughable statement I've seen here lately. And, it's right up there with the claim that "narration is music." Why do you think they are not? Because it is patently obvious. I can give several examples: What part of the reasoning for changing to 3-valves had to do with the fans? What part of the reasoning for changing to a smaller judging panel had to do with the fans? What part of the reasoning for changing to Bb had to do with the fans? What part of the reasoning for allowing amps had to do with the fans? None whatsoever. None of those changes increases the interest/excitement for fans. Fans were not clamoring for those changes. Potential and/or disgruntled fans didn't decline to attend shows because DCI didn't use 3-valve/fewer judges/Bb/amps. Those changes were all done by the corps for the corps, whether one agreed or not, whether the changes were good or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted December 7, 2007 Share Posted December 7, 2007 Is this because of more people flooding into shows or because DCI is charging more at the gate? The most recent releases I recall from DCI say that ticket sales are at their highest level, so it's not just increased prices. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted December 7, 2007 Share Posted December 7, 2007 That's the most laughable statement I've seen here lately. And, it's right up there with the claim that "narration is music." Why? Because you disagree with it? Because it is patently obvious. I can give several examples:What part of the reasoning for changing to 3-valves had to do with the fans? What part of the reasoning for changing to a smaller judging panel had to do with the fans? What part of the reasoning for changing to Bb had to do with the fans? What part of the reasoning for allowing amps had to do with the fans? None whatsoever. None of those changes increases the interest/excitement for fans. Fans were not clamoring for those changes. Potential and/or disgruntled fans didn't decline to attend shows because DCI didn't use 3-valve/fewer judges/Bb/amps. Those changes were all done by the corps for the corps, whether one agreed or not, whether the changes were good or not. 3-valves...added the ability to use the entire scale, hence the ability to create better arrangements, hence a better listening experience for the audience. Bb/F...Creates the ability for corps to cycle their old horns every couple of years and use the latest and best from the manufacturers, hence improving the sonority and tone quality of the brass...hence a better listening experience for the audience. Amps...permits vocals (narration and singing) to be used in an appropriate manner...hence increasing the programming possibilities...thereby improving the listening experience of the fans...plus the added benefit of improving the sound of the pit, also enhancing the listening experience for the audience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tromboner42 Posted December 7, 2007 Share Posted December 7, 2007 Amps...permits vocals (narration and singing) to be used in an appropriate manner...hence increasing the programming possibilities...thereby improving the listening experience of the fans...plus the added benefit of improving the sound of the pit, also enhancing the listening experience for the audience. Just to buffet this response, I think the best argument for amps is that members of the pit no longer have to exercise improper playing technique in order to get the volume necessary to be heard over the corps proper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sburstall Posted December 7, 2007 Share Posted December 7, 2007 I'll keep this short...Most sports leagues, particularly the top pro leagues, adjust their rules annually. They usually focus on two main ideas; player safety and fan interest. In drum corps, the teams and the coaches change the rules, for self interest. It's the instructors who push the rules, and are generally the most liberal in asking for any and all changes. Now imagine for a moment if football still had a 15 yard penalty for an incomplete pass. Do you think it was the coaches that asked for something like this? No. It was in the fan interest, making their game the offensive style you have today. I could give example after example, but the key is that rules changes are almost always made in the interest of fans, and getting them in the gates. DCI doesn't seem to be based around this, and I find it a fatal error. When, if ever, are rules going to be driven by gate receipts? What you're restating is one major problem with the DCI Board that has been part of the discussion even as far back as RAMD, and that is run by the directors. Or in other words, a major conflict of interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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