Has anyone ever . . .

[FTNK]

I like to look for the middle ground...marching isn't as terrible and unmusical as some people think and as it used to be. However, the job of applied professors is to make you as good as you can be on your instrument...and marching is not the way to do that. Not that it's not a valuable learning experience, but realistically you WILL be better if you devote a large amount of your summer to dedicated practicing and lessons with a highly regarded teacher. Drum corps has its limits; let's face it, even now at the top level it's not going to provide the same level of depth of musicality as other things. Also I feel like a lot of people get into the mode that drum corps is their life to the exclusion of other opportunities and interests. I ultimately decided not to march my age-out because I decided that in the long run, since I didn't want to be a marching band/corps instructor for my life, that working on grad school and getting good at my instrument was more important for my long-term career and life. Sometimes I feel like people get so wrapped up in the activity that they have trouble moving on with their lives and going to new things.

[BST07]

All the time. My teachers want me to go to a camp in Germany, the international trumpet guild, or some other traditional music camp. I have a feeling that me choosing to do it for the next 3 years is going to be quite a challenge. Especially considering school doesnt let out till june every year! All my friends move in next week and I still have 3 weeks of school left =(

[The Other Mike]

Something most college students don't understand is that the professor is not really the boss. You definitely have to work towards their standards to be successful in their classes, but the bottom line truth of the situation is that you are a paying customer and they are providing a service to you. Unfortunately, a lot of professors don't understand that either.

As a mindset though, you are not required to go in and lick their shoes. As you have already figured out, they are people too and don't know everything (although like some people in general, some professors like to THINK they know everything).

If you want to attend a particular learning institution, the practicality of the situation dictates that you don't give your professors any grief. But if you understand that there's nothing magical about any particular department, one possible (although probably not likely or even desirable) option is to exercise your freedom of choice and find a school that shares (or at least accepts) your priorities. (When you chose this school, did you go to the music department and ask them what their opinion of drum corps was and if they'd support your participation in the activity?)

I would never counsel someone to do something self-destructive, but knowing that YOU are the one paying THEIR salary puts the student-professor relationship into wonderful perspective, and might help you find the balance in your own mind that you might be looking for.

While you present factual information I think some very big points are missed.

Yes, it is true that the student paying for their education is the customer so to speak, but in many cases, esp in music/music ed, they are usually on some sort of financial aid in one form or another. No matter if it's just a full ride or play for pay ( symphonic band = 1/3 tuition / marching band = 1/3 tuition, being a slave by playing in any ensemble the faculty deems necessary for the other 1/3 ) the faculty IS the boss.

As we all know, every boss is an *%^(^%$# at least every now and then. The end goal is to get as much of an education as you can for as little money as possible. It's much wiser to understand that this is the real world and as we should have learned in high school, it's not always about being right as much as it's saying what the teacher wants to hear so that you will get the passing grade ( or keep your scolarship ).

A large part of education IS about learning to put up with the BS and the degree is the piece of paper that proves you've learned to "play the game".

Yes, it sucks, but if you're on a performance scolarship it's better to keep your head low so you don't end up licking someones shoes.

[hsreed]

I went into my initial valuation with Mario Guarneri (inventor of the BERP and professionl trumpeteer) when I was a freshman in college. After playing a couple things, he asked me what I wanted to do with my playing. I told him I wanted to increas my dynamic capabilities, increase my range, and speed up how quickly I changed notes. He said "So you want to play loud, high and fast?", I answered "That about covers it." and he said "he does not teach that". I started packing my horn and told him "Then I guess I don't need lessons". At least I knew what I wanted.

[The Other Mike]

I went into my initial valuation with Mario Guarneri (inventor of the BERP and professionl trumpeteer) when I was a freshman in college. After playing a couple things, he asked me what I wanted to do with my playing. I told him I wanted to increas my dynamic capabilities, increase my range, and speed up how quickly I changed notes. He said "So you want to play loud, high and fast?", I answered "That about covers it." and he said "he does not teach that". I started packing my horn and told him "Then I guess I don't need lessons". At least I knew what I wanted.

Good for you. As least you found out early on.

[Eddie]

High school director didn't want anyone to join a drum corps. I didn't do it until after I graduated anyways. As a clarinetist, I went in to play baritone. Both college ensemble director and clarinet teacher (who even said that he wished he could ahve done something like that at my age) were cool with it. All I was told was to not forget to practice clarinet.

[84skyrydr]

Has anyone ever come back from a camp so unbelievably psyched to only have a teacher / professor come and tell them that drum corps is a waste of time?

I had a professor actually tell me that drum corps is not part of my education and that it's "just a hobby and nothing more." I mean . . . it's not a career, but how could someone call it "just a hobby."? But, yeah, when I told this person that I thought it was a valid part of my education (as a person and as a musician), they simply said "no, I'm sorry, but it's not." And, that was the end of that discussion.

I even had another professor, completely unprovoked, call me to their office to "question my priorities" because I march corps . . . and this was after missing 2 rehearsals for camp THE ENTIRE YEAR.

Does anyone have any thoughts or ways to talk to people who just don't understand the caliber of what DCI has to offer to students?

Seems to me its time to change schools, yours tends to have educators who are not educated themselves.......

[ToferVis]

Another thing i find amusing is that instructors have been known to tell kids marching corps.....

"Can you carry your french horn and practice throughout the summer?"

Proves they don't know that much about the activity!

[Meat]

I guess I have just been lucky so far, my old and current band directors have both been in the activity. My previous director wrote the brass book for the Scouts in 1988 and other years, and my current director marched Scouts in 1998.

[corps-mudgeon]

Yes, it sucks, but if you're on a performance scolarship it's better to keep your head low

Like I said, I don't counsel self-destructive behavior. Everyone's situation is different and each person has to choose his own path.

A large part of education IS about learning to put up with the BS and the degree is the piece of paper that proves you've learned to "play the game".

Sorry, no. My condolences if that's what your piece of paper says. Although a degree does prove a person is capable of completing a task.

Regarding the "professor is your employee" point I made, it's clear that professors are in a position of power, and rightly so, but the fact that they are merely providing a service that you have contracted for is a point that is almost never brought out. The bottom line still comes down to the fact that if you are not satisfied with services rendered, you have a choice to make about how you want to continue. (And it may simply be that what's right for you is to lay low and "play the game.")

Props to hsreed for having a clear idea of his own wishes and being willing to proceed accordingly.