drumlaw80 Posted June 23, 2008 Author Share Posted June 23, 2008 ..and leading the cheers on how great the "seniors" were being accepted with open arms by DCI?just saying........... Well Gary, I respectfully answer that you are misquoting people. I would also ask -- would you be inclined to speak up if the Erie Thunderbirds, for example, appeared in competition somewhere, had a great show, and then were suddenly put into exhibition, with no score announced for your corps' hard work? I believe that you would, and I also believe that it is the right thing to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Matczak Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 Well Gary, I respectfully answer that you are misquoting people. I would also ask -- would you be inclined to speak up if the Erie Thunderbirds, for example, appeared in competition somewhere, had a great show, and then were suddenly put into exhibition, with no score announced for your corps' hard work? I believe that you would, and I also believe that it is the right thing to do. First, and respectfully,...........I don't think I quoted anybody, did I? I think I asked a question....................second, I would definitely speak up, as did you, and I support you in that regard,..................but that doesn't counter my assertion at all,............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumlaw80 Posted June 23, 2008 Author Share Posted June 23, 2008 (edited) First, and respectfully,...........I don't think I quoted anybody, did I? I think I asked a question....................second, I would definitely speak up, as did you, and I support you in that regard,..................but that doesn't counter my assertion at all,............. Actually Gary, you did not specifically ask me a question, but I chose to respond. As to your assertion, the choice of words was poor and misleading. As anyone who has basic Google or DCP archive skills can attest to, we/I did have an issue a year or two ago with DCA rules that were about to be implemented that had the pragmatic result of only affecting one corps in DCA, the Renegades. And yes, it is true that we have much cooperation with the local DCI corps. For example, many Blue Devils board members have been Renegades, we often share staff, and SCV's current director is a Renegade alumni. Renegades work bingo games for both corps, and I even serve as an entertainment lawyer for one of them. I am hopeful the cooperation between senior corps and everyone else in the West will increase dramatically over the coming years, and there is no reason to expect that it will not. But as a drum corps participant in the only region in the United States that does not pay appearance fees to senior corps, and someone who led the charge to get Renegades into its first ever DCI show in 1999 and got kicked off of the Internet in the process (true story), you must be talking about someone else in regards to your "open arms" reference. If it's a quote, it's likely inaccurate. If it's not - it's misleading. Edited June 23, 2008 by drumlaw80 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErieSopMike Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 I have heard this rhetoric since I joined SoCal Dream in 2004. While we (Senior or All-Age corps which ever terminology you prefer) still have some issues with DCI-P, there have been great strides made in the acceptance of us in the DCI theater. I have seen the shift in thought change. I have seen us accepted and appreciated. Not in the same manner as a Jr corps, but there is still some respect of what we do. Maybe not by everyone in DCI-P, but at least by the fans. Aren't they the most important anyway? They realize we are not just "old farts trying to re-live our glory days".As the DM/co-DM for two years, I have stood on the field waiting to be announced and had it not happen. I even stood there, after they thought they were done while the others were leaving, until they announced SoCal Dream. Even when they didn't announce us, I at least was able to take pride in the fact that I knew the fans got entertained by us. We must take our pride in what we can control and forget about what we can not. You may be a veteran of the drum corps realm, but as the director of an upstart corps attempting to get onto the field in 2009, you may want to reconsider publically bashing those who will control your performance opportunities. Every time this is done, it chews away at the positive accomplishments of Mike Nash, and the people of the Renegades, who have worked with DCI-P to get what we currently have on the west coast. It may not be perfect, but it is all we have at this time. Even if we end up with three DCA corps on the west coast, we will still need DCI-P. Just having three DCA corps is not going to magically create shows at which we can perform. I know we have to fight for what we get, and fight to retain what we get. However, there is a proper way to fight and publically bashing those in power is not the way. I hate playing politics, but it is what we must do on the left coast. [/ ] I think this is where DCA and DCI need to co-exist and have shows that run together, esp. on the west coast. I explained this in the "DCA Show in Erie" thread. Basically, have DCA and DCI do some shows together and put an intermission between them even... I know, I know, who am I, what corps do I run and what weight do I pull... the answer is none. But as a casual observer... it would make sense and everyones scores would be accurate and read outloud at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumlaw80 Posted June 23, 2008 Author Share Posted June 23, 2008 I think this is where DCA and DCI need to co-exist and have shows that run together, esp. on the west coast. I explained this in the "DCA Show in Erie" thread. Basically, have DCA and DCI do some shows together and put an intermission between them even... I know, I know, who am I, what corps do I run and what weight do I pull... the answer is none. But as a casual observer... it would make sense and everyones scores would be accurate and read outloud at least. We must coexist ... there is too much to be gained by everyone. It's a win-win if we all work together for the common good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LisaLisaMoMeesa Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 10..... 9...... 8...... 7...... oh.... sorry, was just counting down till someone posts that this isn't a big deal and it's just more of "Lee's whinning" and trying to stir the DCI pot and that the Renegades were at a Jr Corps show and should just be grateful for the opportunity to perform, blah blah blah blah :::chopping right hand down left arm::: Same as it ever was Same as it ever was Same as it ever was Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randomnoise Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 As for the judging thing, DCI-Pacific did mess up on using DCA sheets. I really do think it was an honest mistake. It won't happen again, I'm sure. I would like to point out that the mistake is not the numbers we were given - these numbers are from trained judges who have been judging our corps for years. From what I have been able to work out, the error was in the contest coordinator's judging assignments, which he changed after we performed (drum judge was given visual sheets, I believe). As to other comments - we do work very well with the other corps in DCI-Pacific, but there are still a number of people that see Senior Corps as a distraction or inconvenience, and they think nothing of making arbitrary decisions (like putting us in exhibition all of a sudden) without regard to the possible negative effect on the All Age movement. At what point should we stop taking abuse? I totally understand the response of MiniSopGuy, but it is getting old to have to take whatever one person decides to give you without complaint or recourse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LisaLisaMoMeesa Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 With all do respect to my friends with Renegades and others outside the NE,...............but weren't a bunch of people slamming the hell out of DCA for some rules issues several months back, (maybe even before last season, but after the rules congress),.................and leading the cheers on how great the "seniors" were being accepted with open arms by DCI?just saying........... No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keyp Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 I don't understand this nonsense, especially when the junior and senior corps work very well together on the West Coast -- there is a tremendous amount of interaction and cooperation between Renegades, Blue Devils and Santa Clara. We all help one another -- there is no need for this. I even think the arranger for SCV and the Renegades get along pretty well. They both studied with the BD arranger in the early 80s. Do we all really think that the crowd is stupid enough to think that the scores between each division are comparable? Congrats on a great run at Stockton Lee! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ContraRich77 Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 I even think the arranger for SCV and the Renegades get along pretty well. That's because you're the SAME GUY smartass!!!! Love & miss you Key.............................hope I get a chance to see you at DCA! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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