GGarrett Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 (edited) How about this? I was there on the bus getting into MY uniform when the ageout (I can tell you his name if you'd like) walked up to me with his empty hanger asking if anyone had seen his uniform. I was also there when people from our admin team brought him the uniform (which had been returned to them by some people from Scouts).Yes, I was. I was sitting on the Crossmen brass bus as we left semifinals and approximately 30 Madison Scouts (in their corps jackets) stood outside our bus, flipping us off and jeering at us as we drove away. I was also there on finals night when a single Madison Scout walked by the brass bus and taunted us as he walked by Nope. But an alum/volunteer that was riding the brass bus finals night got off and confronted the Scout that was taunting us. . . he strangely had less to say when he was standing face to face with someone. He's lucky the whole bus didn't unload. A few guys??? There was a crowd of Scouts standing outside of our buses semifinals night and thirty is a very, very conservative estimate. Where was I standing? On the Crossmen brass bus, Wynne motor coach number 114, with the six other brass bus ageouts. Six of us had uniforms on, and one did not. Six of us found our uniforms hanging on our hangers when we got on the bus, and one did not. His was the front seat on the bus. . . it must have been easy to just hop on and grab it. They had the same buses as us, too, so they must've known how to turn the battery on so they could open the front door. This is not heresy. The uniform was returned to us by people from the Madison Scouts organization. I'm still in awe at the events of the last week. I lost some respect for Madison when they stole capes and aussies from us in 2007, lost a little bit more in 2008 when they sent text messages to members threatening to do the same thing again during finals week, and I lost any last ounce of respect I had for that organization with what happened this week. Classless. Completely classless. OK... I've been waiting for this all day. Funny how you and the posters above are so quick to say: "Classless. Completely Classless" when you are leaving out so many details of the situation. I DID indeed get verification of what happened here. There ARE two sides to every story, aren't there? And somewhere in the middle of it all generally lies the truth. I won't dispute what you say... but I will say that you are seeing it all, and explaining it all, exclusively from the Crossmen point-of-view. And with some irritation, as can be expected, in your point-of-view as well as you speak/type it here I might add. As I mentioned before... and since then I have indeed done my homework... you are holding the whole corps, and previous years corps, responsible for the actions of a few who were indeed held accountable... more than likely will not be back again as Scouts if they are eligable... and who (again as I mentioned in a post above) acted stupidly as many kids who are 18 or 19 do when they get all full of themselves and do stupid things with seemingly no explanation to them. You were there, so OK, I'll take your "30 is a conservative number" of participants "ganging up" on the defenseless kids of your corps. But you are leaving out MANY MANY details of what happened here... apparently SOME of the Crossmen kids weren't exactly "innocent angels" in all of this, either. The incident wasn't COMPLETELY unprovoked as you suggest/imply here... and should this go to a "fair and impartial jury" (which it won't, of course, this isn't a trial thank God) there would be several unflattering things said as well about the "innocent victims," who themselves were completely classless as well. To read your version, and those of DCIwhatever guy above makes it sound as if the Scouts just went randomly around and selected the Crossmen as their random victims, and that is completely false. Kids will be kids... and I will NOT, and DO NOT in ANY WAY ACCEPT THAT AS AN EXCUSE FOR THAT KIND OF BEHAVIOR from the guys in the Madison Scouts or any other corps. You are also leaving out the FACT that several vets from the Scouts did indeed go talk to several of the age outs from the Crossmen and apparently had a decent conversation that will remain forever THEIR business. No excuses. Accountability. And as I ALSO mentioned above, this is definitely NOT the kind of thing a vet or alumni of the corps wants to or likes to hear. It is embarrassing and disappointing. But since you DO know the truth of many details left out of your report above, I challenge you to speak them here and let the chips fall where they may in the court of public opinion. Just make sure the facts are correct, because there are several who know the other side as well who were there, too. Edited August 10, 2009 by GGarrett Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGarrett Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 "...Yes, I was. I was sitting on the Crossmen brass bus as we left semifinals and approximately 30 Madison Scouts (in their corps jackets) stood outside our bus, flipping us off and jeering at us as we drove away. I was also there on finals night when a single Madison Scout walked by the brass bus and taunted us as he walked byNope. But an alum/volunteer that was riding the brass bus finals night got off and confronted the Scout that was taunting us. . . he strangely had less to say when he was standing face to face with someone. He's lucky the whole bus didn't unload. ..." A "single Madison Scout walked by the brass bus and taunted" you... and not a SINGLE person got off your bus to ask him what his problem was? Not the Drum Major at the very least? Wow... things have changed a tremendous amount since I was in corps... I walked by the Cavaliers once when I was in the Guardsmen (the Cavaliers local arch nemeses corps at the time) and responded to a single guy who called me a pretty bad name in front of my parents. About 7 or 10 guys got off and asked me "what the F my problem was" right there in front of my mother. I told them a guy yelled out at me from "that window" (I pointed to it) and they all got back on the bus. I don't know what happened after that, but I assumed they went back and had a "talk" with the guy. But the point is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE ORIGINAL Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 OK... I've been waiting for this all day.Funny how you and the posters above are so quick to say: "Classless. Completely Classless" when you are leaving out so many details of the situation. I DID indeed get verification of what happened here. There ARE two sides to every story, aren't there? And somewhere in the middle of it all generally lies the truth. I won't dispute what you say... but I will say that you are seeing it all, and explaining it all, exclusively from the Crossmen point-of-view. And with some irritation, as can be expected, in your point-of-view as well as you speak/type it here I might add. As I mentioned before... and since then I have indeed done my homework... you are holding the whole corps, and previous years corps, responsible for the actions of a few who were indeed held accountable... more than likely will not be back again as Scouts if they are eligable... and who (again as I mentioned in a post above) acted stupidly as many kids who are 18 or 19 do when they get all full of themselves and do stupid things with seemingly no explanation to them. You were there, so OK, I'll take your "30 is a conservative number" of participants "ganging up" on the defenseless kids of your corps. But you are leaving out MANY MANY details of what happened here... apparently SOME of the Crossmen kids weren't exactly "innocent angels" in all of this, either. The incident wasn't COMPLETELY unprovoked as you suggest/imply here... and should this go to a "fair and impartial jury" (which it won't, of course, this isn't a trial thank God) there would be several unflattering things said as well about the "innocent victims," who themselves were completely classless as well. To read your version, and those of DCIwhatever guy above makes it sound as if the Scouts just went randomly around and selected the Crossmen as their random victims, and that is completely false. Kids will be kids... and I will NOT, and DO not in ANY WAY ACCEPT THAT AS AN EXCUSE FOR THAT KIND OF BEHAVIOR from the guys in the Madison Scouts or any other corps. You are also leaving out the FACT that several vets from the Scouts did indeed go talk to several of the age outs from the Crossmen and apparently had a decent conversation that will remain forever THEIR business. No excuses. Accountability. And as I ALSO mentioned above, this is definitely NOT the kind of thing a vet or alumni of the corps wants to or likes to hear. It is embarrassing and disappointing. But since you DO know the truth of many details left out of your report above, I challenge you to speak them here and let the chips fall where they may in the court of public opinion. Just make sure the facts are correct, because there are several who know the other side as well who were there, too. TOTAL bull crap. THe old a few BAD APPLES routine does or never does work. If members of the Madison SCOUTS STOLE anything from anyone it is inexcusable. If it it from a participating group even worse. WE are giving these corps our children to educate for the sumer. Is this EDUCATION ? STEALING...... FLIPPING THE BIRD to MULTIPLE CORPS BUSES IN THE PARKING LOT AS THEY PULL AWAY ? I think the MADISON SCOUTS owe the Crossmen ,DCI. The other corps who were treated with disrespect in the parking lot , and the fans a apology. anything less would be a total lack of class. they have all ready lost my respect and the respect of many I have talked to at INDY after this story got out. All it takes is for band directors and parents to read about these actions and we will have less members in less corps. BAD FORM SCOUTS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE ORIGINAL Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 Was there a police report filed and witness statements taken? Can someone point out the alleged thieves and hold them responsible? This is definitely not the type of thing so many years of Madison Scouts want to hear about... but there has to be more evidence to substantiate such serious charges instead of "I was told by a reliable source..." or a single person here on DCP posting the he/she saw it happen. You haven't given anything for accountability to occur here, and the two posters below seem to have jumped on the bandwagon to really start the slander process in motion... If it did happen, the guilty should be held accountable, not the whole corps and the corps from the past, as these two loud mouths below seem to insist on doing... WERE YOU REALLY THERE? DID YOU REALLY PERSONALLY SEE IT HAPPEN? CAN YOU POINT OUT WHICH PERSON(S) MAY HAVE BEEN GUILTY OF THIS? You're having too much fun here writing such a "smack down" letter here. Why didn't you voice your concerns directly to someone on the corps bus if they were right there for you to see? OH I KNOW... because you wanted to come HERE and hide behind your post and say these things without anyone holding YOU accountable for YOUR accusations... I see. OK. PROVE this happened... tell us all the time and place you saw the buses and under what circumstances... PROVE YOU were there and saw it with your own eyes and that you aren't reacting to someone elses post... or shut your trap ... because what you're doing to the entire organization is far worse than holding accountable a few guys who made stupid decisions. A TOTALLY CLASSLESS ACT indeed... PROVE the charges to me, or knock it off... AGAIN... PROVE THIS... tell us all where YOU were standing when you saw all this unfold and happen. Especially the part where Scout members went and stole uniforms and trashed buses... PROVE THIS. Let's see the police report or get a statement from the Crossmen's corps director. The only thing very wrong here is the fact two or three people would write such letter slandering the corps with nothing that proves their charges. wow, AS A alumni of the SCOUTS why aren't more people concerned about the behavior of the corps. YES, they finished well out of finals again , but there are bigger fish here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE ORIGINAL Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 Was there a police report filed and witness statements taken? Can someone point out the alleged thieves and hold them responsible? This is definitely not the type of thing so many years of Madison Scouts want to hear about... but there has to be more evidence to substantiate such serious charges instead of "I was told by a reliable source..." or a single person here on DCP posting the he/she saw it happen. You haven't given anything for accountability to occur here, and the two posters below seem to have jumped on the bandwagon to really start the slander process in motion... If it did happen, the guilty should be held accountable, not the whole corps and the corps from the past, as these two loud mouths below seem to insist on doing... WERE YOU REALLY THERE? DID YOU REALLY PERSONALLY SEE IT HAPPEN? CAN YOU POINT OUT WHICH PERSON(S) MAY HAVE BEEN GUILTY OF THIS? You're having too much fun here writing such a "smack down" letter here. Why didn't you voice your concerns directly to someone on the corps bus if they were right there for you to see? OH I KNOW... because you wanted to come HERE and hide behind your post and say these things without anyone holding YOU accountable for YOUR accusations... I see. OK. PROVE this happened... tell us all the time and place you saw the buses and under what circumstances... PROVE YOU were there and saw it with your own eyes and that you aren't reacting to someone elses post... or shut your trap ... because what you're doing to the entire organization is far worse than holding accountable a few guys who made stupid decisions. A TOTALLY CLASSLESS ACT indeed... PROVE the charges to me, or knock it off... AGAIN... PROVE THIS... tell us all where YOU were standing when you saw all this unfold and happen. Especially the part where Scout members went and stole uniforms and trashed buses... PROVE THIS. Let's see the police report or get a statement from the Crossmen's corps director. The only thing very wrong here is the fact two or three people would write such letter slandering the corps with nothing that proves their charges. wow, AS A alumni of the SCOUTS why aren't more people concerned about the behavior of the corps. YES, they finished well out of finals again , but there are bigger fish here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGarrett Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 (edited) TOTAL bull crap.THe old a few BAD APPLES routine does or never does work. If members of the Madison SCOUTS STOLE anything from anyone it is inexcusable. If it it from a participating group even worse. WE are giving these corps our children to educate for the sumer. Is this EDUCATION ? STEALING...... FLIPPING THE BIRD to MULTIPLE CORPS BUSES IN THE PARKING LOT AS THEY PULL AWAY ? I think the MADISON SCOUTS owe the Crossmen ,DCI. The other corps who were treated with disrespect in the parking lot , and the fans a apology. anything less would be a total lack of class. they have all ready lost my respect and the respect of many I have talked to at INDY after this story got out. All it takes is for band directors and parents to read about these actions and we will have less members in less corps. BAD FORM SCOUTS. "Total Bullcrap?" Oh, well thank you for your point of view, mr sees everything so clearly. Did you hear anything about ANY of the other side of the story? You sir, are not allowing for any action of a KID to be figured out and appropriated. You are worried about "educating" here? Ah, yes, your style of education is "SHOOT FIRST... then get the facts." Good for you... sending out all kinds of opinionated kids into the world who will never make an error in judgement. Obviously, you haven't been around many corps parking lots since, say... the BEGINNING of DCI... Mr. Mom. Corps I was in were flipped off many times by close competitors every year I was in corps. Even had rocks thrown at us once by another corps. You're going to change the world here, huh, by taking down the Scouts? Better watch out where you go with this... I bet there are a LOT of unflattering stories out there that don't even involve the Scouts... that you and some parents may not want to hear as the kids go off to be "educated" by WHATEVER corps... Edited August 10, 2009 by GGarrett Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE ORIGINAL Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 A "single Madison Scout walked by the brass bus and taunted" you... and not a SINGLE person got off your bus to ask him what his problem was? Not the Drum Major at the very least? Wow... things have changed a tremendous amount since I was in corps... I walked by the Cavaliers once when I was in the Guardsmen (the Cavaliers local arch nemeses corps at the time) and responded to a single guy who called me a pretty bad name in front of my parents. About 7 or 10 guys got off and asked me "what the F my problem was" right there in front of my mother. I told them a guy yelled out at me from "that window" (I pointed to it) and they all got back on the bus. I don't know what happened after that, but I assumed they went back and had a "talk" with the guy. But the point is... DCI has changed in the last 30 years. YOU must have been an AS* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGarrett Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 wow,AS A alumni of the SCOUTS why aren't more people concerned about the behavior of the corps. YES, they finished well out of finals again , but there are bigger fish here. read my posts again... I believe you will see that I am indeed concerned about the behavior of the corps, and I offer NO EXCUSE for it. I say accountability and no excuses for bad behavior. Oh and thanks for pointing out the corps didn't make finals again. A little salt rubbed into the wound is always good to do when you want to get a little dig in there as well... which you did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camel lips Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 (edited) Lets remember we are dealing with kids or very young adults here. The stealing is inexcusable.I feel certain Madison Scouts or ANY of the DCI corps finds out one of their members steals something from another corps,,that kid is going to get a one way ticket home.Not only that but I suspect they will not get a letter of member in good standing if they try to join another DCI corps.So I am betting the offenders have gotten their punishment in spades. Edited August 10, 2009 by camel lips Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
louielouie Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 TOTAL bull crap.THe old a few BAD APPLES routine does or never does work. If members of the Madison SCOUTS STOLE anything from anyone it is inexcusable. If it it from a participating group even worse. WE are giving these corps our children to educate for the sumer. Is this EDUCATION ? STEALING...... FLIPPING THE BIRD to MULTIPLE CORPS BUSES IN THE PARKING LOT AS THEY PULL AWAY ? I think the MADISON SCOUTS owe the Crossmen ,DCI. The other corps who were treated with disrespect in the parking lot , and the fans a apology. anything less would be a total lack of class. they have all ready lost my respect and the respect of many I have talked to at INDY after this story got out. All it takes is for band directors and parents to read about these actions and we will have less members in less corps. BAD FORM SCOUTS. Maybe they needed the uniform to cover up those NACHO LIBRE WRESTLING GUARD UNIFORMS ? :wub: :wub: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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