The Struggle of Direction

[Fred Windish]

scottgordon,

I'm not a musician, so it's always been difficult for me to express the point you are making. I agree totally with your view. Thanks for putting into words what most everyone can understand.

My biggest beef with DCI presentations for the past 20 years has been the apparent removal of "music" from the finished product. At least, "music" as I define that term.

[Jeff Ream]

That's an impressive list!

Now I have to go watch Bluecoats... although I'm thinking that it was 1988 when they had the massive snare line? Gonna go check right now...

87 was I think the snares alone, you are right...88 was when they added the tenors in and expanded to 18 or 20.

hmm 88...off the top of my head:

SCV with Phantom #1

Madison of course with Malaguena

BD with Happy Days in the grey jackets

Cavies with Firebird

Phantom with Romeo and Juliet

Cadets with Copland 3

Star with Porgy and Bess

Spirit and Petrushka

Suncoast and the Child show ( know in some circles as symphonic dances for the confused drum corps fan :tongue)

Sky Ryders with the Sound of Music

VK with Mystery tour 2...and the bullfight with the bull winning ( and whizzing)

Bluecoats and Take 5, Autumn Leaves v2 with the massive snareline

bonus points: Crossmen with Summertime and the capes

Dutch Boy with the My Way

Boston with Les Miz

Freelancers with ET

then I tried to rack my brain about 2005...again, I'm not looking anywhere online

Cadets and the Zone

BD and yowza

Cavies was the Chicago show

Phantom was American in Paris

SCV was Russin Xmas

and um....um...

oh Madison with Carmen

and after that......

ican not remember a #### show

[Stu]

My biggest beef with DCI presentations for the past 20 years has been the apparent removal of "music" from the finished product. At least, "music" as I define that term.

Fred; here is what happens in movie music: The movie composer comes up with a bunch of general musical ideas. Lets just deal with two; the first is the main actor theme (husband muisic) and the second is supporting actress theme (wife music). That music stays is in raw form and is shelved until the final cut of the movie is done by the director. The movie director shows the final cut of a particular scene to the music composer that has a time line meter bar graph showing the scene in length in hundredths of seconds. From time line "0" to time line "7.62" seconds there needs to be an eerie sound while the husband looks perplexed and turns to walk toward the woodpile; from time line "7.62" to time line "23.49" seconds there needs to be suspenseful music based on the husband theme starting soft and building with intensity and also accelerating as the pace of the actor intensifies; at time line "23.49" the music should stop abruptly without resolution just as the actor freezes; from time line "23.49" to "26.04" nothing but silence while the actor has a close up and yells NO!; a loud crass musical impact should occur at time line 26.04 at the point where the body of his wife is shown on screen and that impact should last from time line "26.04" to "27.36" at which point the next scene begins that requires a serine love theme musical sequence based off the wife's theme that reflects the actor's memories of his wife. However, when the movie is shown to the trial audience they discover that the sceen of the husband running is a bit too long for the audience; so a cut is made at time line "19.07" and "2.07" seconds is removed which causes the music composer to quickly rescore that moment. So, taking that example and put it into drum corps context where there will be general musical ideas in which the visual design moves, counts, and visual pace take precedence in the show development process which causes the visual elements to dictate the actual musical moments on the field; then you will begin to see the connection as to why a lot of DCI music has become disjointed.

Edited June 11, 2010 by Stu

[Fred Windish]

Thanks for the additional input, Stu. Sounds like you know what you're talking about. Maybe I'm just getting too old and losing my depth of comprehension of complex constructions. Frankly, I need melody. I need some repetition, some "flow."

Others have criticized what we hear today by saying "But, can you whistle what they played on your way home from the show?" I miss whistling, too.

I enjoy piano music, just not Keith Jarrett. He seems to just bang away on the keys in random order. I suppose Keith is great. Millions enjoy him. Why don't I see him on prime time TV? We both know the answer.

[corpsband]

Fred; here is what happens in movie music: The movie composer comes up with a bunch of general musical ideas. .....taking that example and put it into drum corps context where there will be general musical ideas in which the visual design moves, counts, and visual pace take precedence in the show development process which causes the visual elements to dictate the actual musical moments on the field; then you will begin to see the connection as to why a lot of DCI music has become disjointed.

While it's true that arrangers do make changes to music accommodate visual effects, i don't think they are anywhere as sophisticated as the arrangements for movies. I remember when the rumor circulated here that the Cavies had written their drill first and then composed original music to match the drill. But it turned out to be a big hoax.

I think many arrangers do a good job writing complete musical thoughts in their book: Crown and SCV last year both were both the opposite of "chop and bop". And you just *know* Jim Prime's stuff for Madison this year is going to be really effective while retaining it's musicality (IMHO he's one of the very best at this).

[Stu]

While it's true that arrangers do make changes to music accommodate visual effects, i don't think they are anywhere as sophisticated as the arrangements for movies. I remember when the rumor circulated here that the Cavies had written their drill first and then composed original music to match the drill. But it turned out to be a big hoax.

I think many arrangers do a good job writing complete musical thoughts in their book: Crown and SCV last year both were both the opposite of "chop and bop". And you just *know* Jim Prime's stuff for Madison this year is going to be really effective while retaining it's musicality (IMHO he's one of the very best at this).

I am not saying that it is quite as complex as the movie music example; and the drill is certainly not written completely first "then" the music is crowbared in as an afterthought; but there was a DCI documentery short put on one of the recent DVDs which goes along the line of the process that I was refering to. Bret Kuhn is discussiong how more counts were added to a visual impact point and he had to write percussion for that increase in counts. This visual driving the musical changes happens fequiently on a daily basis during the summer, so much so that near the end of the season, the music does not seem to follow "musical" sense. Also, even though it was a hoax that the Cavaliers drill was written "first' then the music plugged into the drill, I will guarantee you that the drill dictated "how" the music was implimented into the overall design process instead of the other way around; especially as the season progressed. That is why their music sounds so much different than say the SCV Copland show in '09 where the music drove the drill; it is also an indication of how the Cavaliers create some really awsome drill moves but sometimes their music sounds rather disjointed.

[corpsband]

I am not saying that it is quite as complex as the movie music example; and the drill is certainly not written completely first "then" the music is crowbared in as an afterthought; but there was a DCI documentery short put on one of the recent DVDs which goes along the line of the process that I was refering to. Bret Kuhn is discussiong how more counts were added to a visual impact point and he had to write percussion for that increase in counts. This visual driving the musical changes happens fequiently on a daily basis during the summer, so much so that near the end of the season, the music does not seem to follow "musical" sense. Also, even though it was a hoax that the Cavaliers drill was written "first' then the music plugged into the drill, I will guarantee you that the drill dictated "how" the music was implimented into the overall design process instead of the other way around; especially as the season progressed. That is why their music sounds so much different than say the SCV Copland show in '09 where the music drove the drill; it is also an indication of how the Cavaliers create some really awsome drill moves but sometimes their music sounds rather disjointed.

I suspect adding counts to music is by far the most frequent musical change *after* the show starts going on the field. Sometimes adding counts affects the flow of the music significantly -- many times it doesn't (extending a percussion break for instance) . I agree that some corps (like the Cavies ) seem to arrange pieces to the point that it's only somewhat reminiscent of the original. I"m no fan of chop and bop but it does't seem to me that most corps do it to excess.

I do agree with you that sometimes music does change a lot over an entire season. I almost always prefer those early season arrangements (even though they are not played as well) over what we sometimes end up with at finals.

Edited June 11, 2010 by corpsband

[GMichael1230]

let's see, what sticks with me about 87 before SCV and the Cadets hit the field:

Cavies with the snake in Koren Folk Song, as well as Liturgical Dances and Canzona

BD with Fanfare for the New, the Zappa drum solo, Free

Phantom with the all white unis and Nutcracker

Madison with Captain of Castille and Stars and Stripes

Vk and the First Magical Mystery Tour

Suncoat and My Fair Lady

Spirit with the Mardi Gras show

Sky Ryders and WSS

Bluecoats first time in with Autumn Leaves and the massive snare line in the drum solo

Star and the circus show

and thats without looking up anything on corpsreps

...how about Freelancers returning with a full corps and "born again"..Crossmen showing signs of life, Spirits full-out, New Orleans Mardis Gras with funeral. "Im getting married in the morning". Ryan Turner. Black, White, and grey. Florida wave. Scouts with fireworks !!!! LOL, laugh and I'll kill you ! Phantom Regiment in third after prelims. Blue Devils and their yellow rifles..........sigh

G

[Rochester New York]

FWIW - I have been one of the fans disappointed by the direction DCI has been going over the past 10 years. In fact, very few shows since the late 1990s have really excited me. The choppy arrangements and increasing use of gimmicks have, in my opinion, diluted what was becoming a truly unique and exciting medium.

That last sentence expresses my feelings perfectly, if by "gimmicks" you also mean synthesizers, amplification, electronics, and B-flat horns. Call me a dinosaur if you will (I saw my first live dc show in 1996), but each of these "gimmicks" had a direct, palpable effect on the medium's uniqueness and musical effect on the audience.