Amps

[idontwan2know]

It will happen, sooner or later.

Eventually the decisions will be made by those for whom it's never been an issue, because amps have been a part of every other circuit/activity they've ever performed in. It will simply be a non-issue.

The cost argument is a valid one, but it didn't stop grounding the pit, 2 and then 3 valve horns, Bbs, or any of the other changes that cost money and inevitably benefited those who were in a position to adapt sooner/more fully.

[JimF-LowBari]

My personal feelings about amps, electronics, etc aside, I think it all boils down to $$$. In DCA, we don't have all the big-time sponsors that the DCI corps have. They get the equipment they get for a steal. Sure, some top DCA corps can swing similar deals, but most probably can not. Every year we have corps that either can't come to Championships or can't make it to the field at all. Sometimes it's about membership numbers, but it's also very often about $$$. When you're on a strict budget in your real home life, you need to make decisions between needs and wants. I need a vehicle to get from place to place, but I want a Corvette. I can't afford a Corvette, so I settle for simply getting what I need. The same principle applies here. I need to get my corps to the field fully equipped with the horns, drums & guard equipment that we need. Maybe I want to add electronics for a variety of reasons, but in over 40 years I haven't needed them.

Ditto on the $$$$ and Corvette ideas (but I want my old Mustang II back).....

Plus DCA is more small and start up corps friendly and those would be the corps most affected by the cost of amps.

Also big believer in Hairbears "All the DCI participants who today perform on Bflat horns, utilize electronics and synths will eventually bemoan the changes that have come to drumcorps long after they competed" WHY???? Because I've seen it again... and again... an again... And those were usually the people BITD who couldn't understnad why their elders were against "change".

[JimF-LowBari]

It will happen, sooner or later.

Eventually the decisions will be made by those for whom it's never been an issue, because amps have been a part of every other circuit/activity they've ever performed in. It will simply be a non-issue.

The cost argument is a valid one, but it didn't stop grounding the pit, 2 and then 3 valve horns, Bbs, or any of the other changes that cost money and inevitably benefited those who were in a position to adapt sooner/more fully.

Actually when the pits were first grounded the old marching tymps and bells were used. Then corps switched to the better stuff as they could afford them (if they could afford). And for some corps going to newer horn types (3v, Bb) is driven by what's in the market place. Anymore if you want a G horn you have to buy new as used ones are pretty much not to be found.

[kosovobill]

The world has changed considerably in the last twenty years. Change is inevitable, irreversable, and vital.

Nobody likes change. We like our "comfort zone" undisturbed. These two statements are in conflict.

It is THIS conflict that I see as the core of the arguement. I struggle with the changes taking place

within the ENTIRE drumcorps activity. At some point in the future, we will hand over the activity to a new

generation of participants. They will define success in their own way, with the "tools" they are comfortable and

familiar with. THAT'S life.

Another generation of performers HAS ALREADY taken over drum corps, and is doing their thing; evolving the activity. It is only cantankerous old people in the audience who think they are somehow in control who are whining about all of this. History tells us that tradition is not the norm; change is.... Does this mean I dig amps? No, not really, but I will say that Ive seen some really creative things done with them, and others really stupid, such as an unnamed corps' rock band... Some of you older guys' concept of what drum corps ought to be (post WWII) is really a drastic change over what it was before the war; so in fact your "tradition" is in fact yet another CHANGE.

We really need to get over ourselves and let these kids have fun and perform, just as we did...

Bill

[donincardona]

Well if it was so good all the time and well documented as you say then why was DCI formed in 72? Drum Corps didnt begin in 72 although many would like to believe it did. Whats good or bad of the past is in selective memory ( the good and bad of that ) its human nature.

and as to you questions of how 21st century drum corps members will react to the challenge of their traditions? The answer is most likely the same way many react now.

i had to jump in here. since 1972 you had many jr. corps go under. they were small church sponserd corps . in ny, nj, pa mass and so on there were thousands of jr corps. they are all dead & gone now. and sr corps is losing great corps all the time. so don't tell me the activity is fine. it's not. it's getting smaller. it's all about mega corps with lots of money. i know things will evolve as they always have but i have to tell you as they have we have lost many coprs along the way. and let's not forget the crowds that used to come out to DCA show's for instance. bridgeport....14,000 people. dream an easy 20,000. tournament of drums 12,000-22,000, baltimore 18,000......DCA in rochester 18,000-22,000. is it growing or losing?we all need a reality check here. i know all the apoligist's will jump all over me but these are facts. you can either except the truth or live in a dream . it's your choice. these are the facts and they can't be ignored. the new breed will do as they must but don't be surprised if the numbers continue to drop. it's very sad. prior to 72 was the glory days of drum corps and that is a fact. by 1975 it was starting to wane & wax. tell me how many corps are there now and how big are the crowds? just think about it before you all jump all over me.

[kosovobill]

It will happen, sooner or later.

Eventually the decisions will be made by those for whom it's never been an issue, because amps have been a part of every other circuit/activity they've ever performed in. It will simply be a non-issue.

The cost argument is a valid one, but it didn't stop grounding the pit, 2 and then 3 valve horns, Bbs, or any of the other changes that cost money and inevitably benefited those who were in a position to adapt sooner/more fully.

Amen.

Old guys, better grab your pacemakers, because this will happen as these performers will get older and want them, since they used them when they were in Jr corps. Its not the end of the world, really...

[donincardona]

Another generation of performers HAS ALREADY taken over drum corps, and is doing their thing; evolving the activity. It is only cantankerous old people in the audience who think they are somehow in control who are whining about all of this. History tells us that tradition is not the norm; change is.... Does this mean I dig amps? No, not really, but I will say that Ive seen some really creative things done with them, and others really stupid, such as an unnamed corps' rock band... Some of you older guys' concept of what drum corps ought to be (post WWII) is really a drastic change over what it was before the war; so in fact your "tradition" is in fact yet another CHANGE.

We really need to get over ourselves and let these kids have fun and perform, just as we did...

Bill

what you have said is very true. it did change. i guess we were lucky the changes made grew drumcorps. it was a great time and your right we have to let the younger people run it their way. but please don't call all of us older people cantankerous. it's hard for people to except change. when i was coming up the old timers said the sme thig about us. we were killing corps. it's just the difference in generations.

[JimF-LowBari]

what you have said is very true. it did change. i guess we were lucky the changes made grew drumcorps. it was a great time and your right we have to let the younger people run it their way. but please don't call all of us older people cantankerous. it's hard for people to except change. when i was coming up the old timers said the sme thig about us. we were killing corps. it's just the difference in generations.

If the Internet was around a few decades earlier I can picture threads going off about marching bells, no inspection, going to 2v, pit, etc, etc, etc. Heard the "that ain't Drum Corps" bit in the mid 70s and couldn't figure out what the problem was back then. Now there are things I don't like but I won't lower myself to call names, I'll just stay home if I don't find it entertaining enough.

As for Drum Corps era 72-75, my first show was a 5 corps Sr show at Hershey in 1974. Buccs and Cabs were neck and neck so fan interest was high. Figure 9-10K people were at that regular season show as front stands were sold out and any walk ins liek us had to sit in the back stands. www.cabs.com have a vid from that show and you can see a lot of bodies in the back stands. And the ones in the middle were paying fans. *sigh*

[kosovobill]

i had to jump in here. since 1972 you had many jr. corps go under. they were small church sponserd corps . in ny, nj, pa mass and so on there were thousands of jr corps. they are all dead & gone now. and sr corps is losing great corps all the time. so don't tell me the activity is fine. it's not. it's getting smaller. it's all about mega corps with lots of money. i know things will evolve as they always have but i have to tell you as they have we have lost many coprs along the way. and let's not forget the crowds that used to come out to DCA show's for instance. bridgeport....14,000 people. dream an easy 20,000. tournament of drums 12,000-22,000, baltimore 18,000......DCA in rochester 18,000-22,000. is it growing or losing?we all need a reality check here. i know all the apoligist's will jump all over me but these are facts. you can either except the truth or live in a dream . it's your choice. these are the facts and they can't be ignored. the new breed will do as they must but don't be surprised if the numbers continue to drop. it's very sad. prior to 72 was the glory days of drum corps and that is a fact. by 1975 it was starting to wane & wax. tell me how many corps are there now and how big are the crowds? just think about it before you all jump all over me.

Don,

You really need to examine ALL the evidence before you blame DCI for the demise of drum corps. Have you considered the demographics of the population at that time? In the 50s and 60s you had a record amount of people available to march both in senior and junior corps because of WWII and the resulting economic and population boom. Since then most of the WWII generation has passed away, and the babyboomers have not produced as many children. Not as many of the babyboomers march now in All-Age because money, status, power seems to be more important than marching in a drum corps. Those are just the facts..DCI didnt cause any of those things to happen... I am not a DCI lover, but to lay all of this at their feet is just ridiculous....

[ereese]

Don,

You really need to examine ALL the evidence before you blame DCI for the demise of drum corps. Have you considered the demographics of the population at that time? In the 50s and 60s you had a record amount of people available to march both in senior and junior corps because of WWII and the resulting economic and population boom. Since then most of the WWII generation has passed away, and the babyboomers have not produced as many children. Not as many of the babyboomers march now in All-Age because money, status, power seems to be more important than marching in a drum corps. Those are just the facts..DCI didnt cause any of those things to happen... I am not a DCI lover, but to lay all of this at their feet is just ridiculous....

Not to mention the elimination of American Legion, the VFW and all the CYO corps.....oh wait a minute, maybe DCI did have something to do with that......hmmmmm?????