Howdy Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) Yes they do, actually. Man that is completely nuts. Anyway, if you want to keep this chat going please move this discussion over to marching, time to get back to talking about Pioneer. form vs dot: http://www.drumcorpsplanet.com/forums/index.php/topic/143757-dot-marching-vs-being-in-the-form/ 1980 vs 2010 who marched cleaner?: http://www.drumcorpsplanet.com/forums/index.php/topic/143758-1980-vs-2010/ Edited January 14, 2011 by Howdy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemesiscorps Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) Re: Respectfully I disagree. And I am the one who is right. Remember my example about not teaching kids to stay in the forms properly. Go watch Pio on youtube in 08, 09, or 2010 and you will easily see the result of not teaching kids how to march properly. While your spot is very important, were I marching If I were in the middle of a form I would stay in that form even if it ment not being in my proper spot. No judges have drill sheets. A judge might not know if you are in your correct spot, but he will know if you are out of the form every time. A mnm instructor has to train his students what to do in real show situations. This is properly training each student what to do if problems happen in the show [ forms ] , there are things that you must do, and things that you must not do. If a student does not know what to do - how to react when mistakes happen, mistakes will multiply. I sense that you are a good person with good intentions in your posted statements, however, I must tell you that you are not coming off well in this discussion. You've provided strongly committed opinions about a variety of things (some of which you can't possibly have knowledge of), moved the discussion off topic and likely (though perhaps unitentionally) offended people in the process. Examples: 1. You've implied in numerous statements that if one does not have "top 12 experience" that their contributions and quality of instruction are somehow "less than" or subordinate to someone with top 12 experience. One does not need a doctoral degree to know that that is obviously flawed, closed thinking that sheds a rather unflattering light on your own credibility. I find it hard to believe that you don't know of anyone with a credible music education background (not that they would need even that) that isn't teaching sound, fundamental performance technique, some of which is probably identical to what is being taught in a top 12 program. 2. While dismissing the quality of all personnel except those with a top 12 background, you then began to critique and question the qualifications of someone with a top 12 background (fsubone). 3. You cited the corps from Rosemont as an example of what should be done with Pioneer, and when advised of what exactly was taught in that organization by the specific individuals well known for their teaching accomplishments with that organization and the corps from the San Francisco suburb of Santa Clara, you choose to criticize that corps by bringing to light an example of an extremely difficult part of one of the most complicated shows ever put on the field... using a clip that pre-dated finals. Even with all of that, most would agree that that clip shows a high level of visual achievement. 4. By questioning fsubone's specific marching years with his corps, you've now implied that apparently only certain top 12 corps are to be given credibility. 5. Whereas I sincerely want to compliment the work that you do through your ministry, with all due respect, I don't think your website is as great as you think it is. 6. Your statements in reference to yourself seem quite conceited, prideful, and perhaps borderline arrogant, as you have more than once used them to criticize others. Really. I could go on.... Please take a step back and objectively consider how you're being received here, and why. You have a message (or portions thereof) that some may or may not agree with, but imo, much of it is lost in your delivery style. What's up with that? As it stands right now, it appears that Jeff R. is correct. I bid you peace. BACK ON TOPIC Go Pioneer! Edited January 14, 2011 by nemesiscorps 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howdy Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) SCV is a 7th place drumcorps. I provided proof that the dot only philosophy does not work. [ 18.6, 18.4 ] Roman had a chance to bring someone in who won DCI. You know what he did? He turned him down. That is a fact. Why did Roman turn him down? Because if he did Roman would have lost some control. Now Madison will win DCI instead of Pioneer. Edited January 14, 2011 by Howdy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kamarag Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Because we all know that top 12 drumcorps march much cleaner today than they did in say, 1980. Ugh... I'd say today's top 23 march cleaner than the top 12 did in 1980, and they do it with a visual program that's a bazillion times more difficult. I'm glad you agree :) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kamarag Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 SCV is a 7th place drumcorps. I provided proof that the dot only philosophy does not work. [ 18.6, 18.4 ] Nice statistical leap, but there is no corollary. All that proves is that six corps did it better, not that it doesn't work. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howdy Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) I'd say today's top 23 march cleaner than the top 12 did in 1980, <snip> Hahahahhahahahhahhahahhahhahahhahahhahahhahahhahahahhahahahahahahaha... Are you serious? Edited January 14, 2011 by Howdy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kamarag Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) Hahahahhahahahhahhahahhahhahahhahahhahahhahahhahahahhahahahahahahaha... Are you serious? Deadly. In fact, I'm even more sure of my position after watching the corps that placed 11th and 12th in 1980. Edited January 14, 2011 by Kamarag 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scsudrummer Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Deadly. In fact, I'm even more sure of my position after watching the corps that placed 11th and 12th in 1980. Agreed. Taking into account the demand of the visual programs nowadays, today's World Class marches much better than corps did in 1980. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howdy Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) Deadly. In fact, I'm even more sure of my position after watching the corps that placed 11th and 12th in 1980. You make me laugh. Neal Smith is consitered one of DCI's best visual caption heads. North Star in 1980 marched one of the cleanest shows that DCI has ever seen.[ Plus they had one of the best if not the best DCI drumlines ever {from 78-81}] Edited January 14, 2011 by Howdy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kamarag Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 You make me laugh. Yep. I'm both right, and funny. A deadly combination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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