mvbailey12 Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 All in all, am I disappointed that Pioneer did not finish higher? Of course, as I am sure every fan is. BUT, I am very proud of Pioneer starting to make some changes, hopefully, for the better. Whatever happens, Pioneer just needs to continue to look up. This could mean many changes down the road with staff, equipment, transportation, unis, music, themes, etc. I think that most of us would agree that we would just like to see Pioneer continue with forging ahead instead of taking any steps back right now. I know that it is not all about scoring, but, it helps. Even just from a morale standpoint as a member, when you are constantly getting beat up by other corps, it does put a damper on your spirits. What is the next step? How do you go from a year that had so many people looking up and very proud of the kids to, unfortunately coming in last again. Remember, I am just asking questions. I am not blasting anyone. I love Pioneer! I think that they are a great organization and only want the best for them. So, there have been many posts on what Pio should have done this year, those for and against them. But, what do you feel Pioneer really needs to do to, as some put it, to "be competitive"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 I would say a total change of staff is in order !!! How frustrated can the corps director, BoD and President of the corps be to always end up in last place !! Something has gotta change...but that's my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkfdPRphan Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 I think the improvements to Pioneer this year were striking! Great, great job! But, I believe that all of the corps they competed with were playing at a higher level this season.... so Pioneer (as improved as they were) ended up keeping pace. Thats not BAD! Now, Pio, build on these changes. Work on the difficulty of your show - musically and visually, that will bring up the scores. To the person who just wrote to fire the staff, why? Wasnt it a new group that made this years changes and made Pio competitive? ....just take the next step and add to what you did this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guardguy89 Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 I don't think that the staff is the problem in this case Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staxrocks93 Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 I would say a total change of staff is in order !!!How frustrated can the corps director, BoD and President of the corps be to always end up in last place !! Something has gotta change...but that's my opinion. You can have the best staff in the world, but as long as Pioneer remains a "teaching" corps how does anyone expect them to move up much? Come on, having someone audition on snare and not making it and then marching baritone for the summer to give the kid an opportunity to march, the best staff in the world isn't going to make a difference. Alot of the members who march Pioneer would never have the opportunity to if Pioneer wasn't the orgainization they are. Yes, scores matter.......but watching a show come together and the result being very entertaining, is more important than coming in 17th place isn't it? 13th, 17th, 19th or 23rd by a few points whats the difference? One thing I will say is that the equipment, bussess and other internal issues need to improve......but that isn't saying it is going to help make semi's......this is merely to get from point A to B and not wasting time on the side of the road, sleeping in parking lots while all the other corps are safely sleeping on their busses going to their next destination....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Brace Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 I believe Pioneer serves its current mission whether they want that this is their mission is another question. 1. Pioneer fills a void between the upper echelon WC corps and OC corps in that OC corps have limited exposure and limited performance opportunities. 2. Pioneer is a "teaching corps" as some point out, but I believe incorrectly. All corps have instructors so all corps are "teaching corps." Perhaps what is meant by the term is fairly few members age out of Pioneer. Members go on to march in more upper echelon corps when they are able. 3. If what is desired is for Pioneer to move up dramatically in the standings...then the following must occur in my opinion: A. Attract more members. I am talking of fielding 150 members, which translates into over 300- 400 auditions. B. More guard emphasis, with more difficult guard work. (See Madison's dramatic improvement this year) C. Approach the off-season in a different way. Taking each Sunday morning off for church may be a great bonding tradition, but it takes away from rehearsal time which every other corps in the activity takes advantage of. D. Better designed shows. The current show designs are not on par with many other corps in their immediate area that Pioneer performs against most often. For example, look at the design and flow of Colts program and especially the integration of all the areas of performance, battery, guard, horns, pit. It's clearly night and day. Now, who says Pioneer even wants this as part of their mission. If not, they are doing what they need to do to be a one or two year stop on about 90-100 members' journey through drum corps on their way to something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FHdork Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 If Pioneer can become a corps with 60% veterans - many of whom are 3+ year vets, then they'll start to see the improvement. Few staff changes are needed. Brass certainly came up a bunch this season. Excellence is NOT achieve-able with that age group in ONLY one year. Drum corps is very tough - and multiple years of training are required. Even 21 year olds with numerous years of experience will tell you they got better in their final year (especially if they marched with a top drawer corps). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeN Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 Staff and member retention. Having the same teaching staff year to year is a much more powerful tool in the box than having a transient "star" staff. And increasing member retention ... I point again to the DCI member surveys - the higher the average age of the corps, the higher the placing, in general terms. (Only in 2008 did the oldest corps *not* win.) Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 I would say a total change of staff is in order !!!How frustrated can the corps director, BoD and President of the corps be to always end up in last place !! Something has gotta change...but that's my opinion. i think the director also needs to allow the staff to be creative and do their jobs, and loosen the reins a little...and get the kids better vehciles to travel on. doing the southern tour with no AC is, IMO, stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicman1084 Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 i think the director also needs to allow the staff to be creative and do their jobs, and loosen the reins a little...and get the kids better vehciles to travel on. doing the southern tour with no AC is, IMO, stupid. Winner. Up until this year, there was quite a bit of restriction in terms of style. Even this year, when they ventured into different territory, the show reflected HEAVILY on the corps image. Breaking the mold here involves a lot more than just breaking away from a certain style of music, it involves breaking away from the entire image (not behind the scenes, as you obviously want to maintain the integrity of traditions) - something I'm sure Roman isn't ready to do. I'm sure the corps prayer is dear to the members' hearts, but I'll be honest with you, hearing that prayer recited in the show came across to me as, "we know we're a last place corps, but that's ok because it's all about the experience." Hearing people clap for it made me cringe even more, because it seemed like such an insincere sense of encouragement to me. If those words in the corps prayer are true, then it makes me wonder why the supporters on these boards care so much about their placement and keep on commenting about how Pioneer should be beating (insert corps here). Bottom line: If it's REALLY about the experience and just letting members have a good summer and learn a few things, change nothing; if people are going to keep questioning why they don't place higher, then the entire design and performance quality mentality needs to be revisited, and the people who are currently making those decisions should take a back seat, as it's obviously not producing any results. Go ahead and flame me for this... that's fine. I just feel like if people are really going to keep placing emphasis on why this corps doesn't place better, the answer is simple. If placement is really not a concern, as has been stated, then I'm not sure why we keep having these discussions, as many members have already come to Pioneer's support by saying how great of an experience they've had with the organization. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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