Inside the Arc - "The Dut Must Die"

[snaredude08]

I find it interesting that, in this thread, when a percussionist gives their experience-based opinion on why dutting is important, all the naysayers just kind of disregard it, yet when one comes along that is opposed to the dut, suddenly the view is "OMG THEY PLAY DRUMS SO OBVIOUSLY THEIR OPINION TRUMPS EVERYONE ELSE, I WIN."

Here's another thing to ponder. How many of the percussionists that oppose duts played in the era of kevlar? The difference in articulation between it and plastic heads is pretty stark. Or, to put it another way, you can hear two fleas ****ing on kevlar. Trying to get a silent attack on that stuff is absolute lunacy.

And also, without trying to be obnoxious, it is true that, to a certain degree, if you've never spent time playing or teaching percussion, your knowledge is only going to be so good. I mean, how would you feel if I, obviously being a drummer, posted some smug, self-satisfied bit on how brass players these days are soft for using [insert common brass practice here]? You'd roll your eyes, and rightly so. I'm not saying your opinions are invalid, but they certainly carry a good deal less weight than someone with similar experience but in drumming instead.

[Jeff Ream]

Ah Geez Dhutting? a percussion pronunciation snob?

Do you hold your pinky out while you hold your mallets?

D hutting. (picture the British butler's accent - Sir John Gielgud.)

no I don't. But even when I last marched 14 years ago, I know some of the listening and seeing environments I was placed in, without some form of audible communication, I'd have been screwed trying to come in cold.

I'm no snob. But the drills and tempos today aren't close to what was done even 15 years ago, let alone 25 or 35 years ago. I have no problem if a dhut is used, it just does not need to be audible in the stands, let alone up high in the stands.

[Jeff Ream]

hey - you choose to hang around with musicians.

I am a percussionist and a musician.

[Jeff Ream]

I've already addressed why watching the drum major doesn't work. The farther you are from them, the more delay there is between the hands, and the sound from the instrument. Its basic physics. Sound moves more slowly than light. If you were to take modern drill, and try to have every single member play with the drum majors hands, even if they could see the DM, you'd get major timing tears all over the field. This wouldn't be much of an issue if performers stayed in the same general area of the field for the entire show, but that is no longer the case. Again, the environment of today's activity demands more complicated nuance in terms of timing, and asking 15+ members of a section who's instruments basic physics make any dirt painfully obvious to each individually know how far ahead every attack in the show should be as they move across the field at break neck speed, without any communication with each other at all in regards to said attacks is simply not possible. If it were, someone would be doing it by now. We've already established that watching isn't a reliable means of establishing time, so again, the communication has to become audible, especially in the case of the drum line when their drill is often so independent from the rest of the group. In a horn line, there are often files, and forms that put members in a position to see each other. This is not often the case with the battery.

As for the comment about guard, the guard have their own timing systems. I do not pretend to know what their philosophy, but as they are no dealing with sound delay, I would imagine they are different from ours. I do know that most of the guards I have had the pleasure to watch rehearse, including drum corps guards, were counting out loud on the field.

And don't think for a second that brass lines don't have similar forms of communication. For one thing, their breathing is audible if they are doing it correctly.

The fact is, if the "duts" were never heard by the audience, there would be no conversation. Musicians communicate however they have to for the sake of their art. There are tons of things that we do that the audience never knows about in order to create the illusion of an effortless performance. "Duts" are no different. Its no different from me looking up at my bass player and making eye contact when he pulls the time back too much. If people want to be arrogant enough to think that they are a crutch, then I again reiterate my challenge. You go march that drill, and play that music on reefed up snare drums, with absolutely no verbal communication with your section and see how successful you are.

Music at its most base is communication. It is communication to the audience, but it is also communication between the performers. Those of us who are privileged enough to understand the mechanics sometimes feel like a kid who has seen the secret behind a magic trick, which is, again, why the "duts" shouldn't be heard if at all avoidable, but that doesn't mean that people should deliberately make their own lives more difficult because a few people think something is "unnecessary".

Just as a disclaimer, I have the utmost respect for Frank. I simply don't agree with some points in his article. There is a difference between not agreeing with something that someone has to say, and disregarding any experience or expertise they might have. There is also a difference between respecting someone's success, and blindly agreeing with everything they say. Things are not always so black and white, and there are many different ways to do things.

post of this year and the last 3 as well

[N.E. Brigand]

I find it interesting that, in this thread, when a percussionist gives their experience, based opinion on why dutting is important, all the naysayers just kind of disregard it, yet when one comes along that is opposed to the dut, suddenly the view is "OMG they play drums, so obviously their opinion trumps everyone else: I win."

Actually the opposite seems to be true. The percussionist who explained his opposition to dutting at length has been almost entirely ignored by the percussionists who favor dutting, despite another non-percussionist poster twice reposting his comments for response.

[Dennis Argul]

Even if you don't agree with what Frank has to write.....you have to love the way he writes it!

Thanks Frank for making us all think about things a little harder and doing what you can to help us all improve the activity!

Keep it up!

Please!!

Peace,

Dennis

[BozzlyB]

I'm simply saying that Frank's isn't the only opinion that counts on the subject. How many drumlines did the man march in? It's an honest question. If that is his back ground I'll STF up. If he's never marched in a line, then in my opinion, the thoughts of a drummer with one year experience marching corps is more valid based on the context alone.

No takers?

[BozzlyB]

Actually the opposite seems to be true. The percussionist who explained his opposition to dutting at length has been almost entirely ignored by the percussionists who favor dutting, despite another non-percussionist poster twice reposting his comments for response.

Out of all the horn players out there I'm sure I can find a few who think brethe-dah is lame. Those who have marched in a battery stand behind the validity and necessity of dutting by a huge margin.

Edited October 15, 2010 by BozzlyB

[BozzlyB]

Do I smell a dutting poll on the horizon? I think it would be interesting to have people clarify what their instrument background within the poll as well.

[Geoff]

except this crotchety old guy has taught most of us and taught most of the instructors/staff/directors of most of the World/Open class Drum Corps. When Frank talks....you listen.

I've never questioned his experience. Just stating an opinion about how the article comes across.

For what its worth, I do agree with him on dhuts you can hear in the stands. I don't like it at all.

The part of the article I disagree with 100% is the Dr. Beat stuff.