How does this community feel about fielding cymbals?

[Jeff Ream]

While I enjoy watching and listening to a good cymbal line (probably the only reason I'd go watch a percussion field rehearsal actually :) ) , they rarely make me watch them or listen to them during a performance. If you evaluate the decision (to march plates or not) on the basis of their contribution to the entire show vs. the resources they consume (quality cymbal writing and techs are not easy to find) it's not hard to understand why so few corps march a plate line. What's the return on the investment in terms of credit received from the judging panel?

I don't mind a corps marching plates -- but I understand why so few do.

sadly, it seems cymbals are an afterthought in the eyes of the judging community

[Jeff Ream]

I don't recall seeing a mention of smaller pits in the proposal.

[cymtech]

Hey guys!

Theres a lot of great talking points going on in here. Some i agree with and some i dont... but hey, its just an online forum. observation: why is it that most of the people that dislike cymbal lines arent even percussionist? its usually horn players...

Theory: A) Girl cymbal player shot them down for a date. or B) Guy cymbal player stole the cute guard girl

Also, all this talk about how easy cymbals are compared to other percussion instruments... omg. Guys... its a learned skill set. its just like playing a horn or tossing a flag. there is "theory" behind the technique. i think at PC we have like 50 techniques. im serious, we counted one day. do we use all of them in a given show? no... we use about 30-35ish. as far as visuals go, we dont just toss in a random vizh. we actually take the time to define the counts, pathways, etc.

[MarimbasaurusRex]

Explain to me how that's ignorance. Any snare drummers on here who want to explain this to me?

I'll take a stab at this one...

Complexity - A concert percussionist will spend about the same amount of time perfecting a good cymbal crash as a good snare roll. The complexity of good cymbal technique is extremely demanding, not to mention that it requires a tremendous amount of physical stamina in the field context.

Notes - Sometimes playing more notes is actually easier than trying to find the E after 2 and having it line up exactly within the bazillion notes from the rest of the battery or a split melodic part. More is not always harder.

One of the reasons we see fewer and fewer cymbal lines is because it's so very hard to do well. The bar has been set very high and it's hard to compete with the likes of SCV and others. I sadly cut cymbals from my HS line just because I couldn't get enough players who could do it well. And if it's not going to be done well, why do it?

Edited November 6, 2010 by MarimbasaurusRex

[Jerseyboy]

CROSSMEN MARCHING CYMBALS IN 2011.

www.crossmen.org

to apply.

[2000Cadet]

expect in the pit, they can not add musically what they can on the field.

Which is what? Being further away from the stands so you can't hear the crash?

Wow, even I have to admit my statement sounds ignorant lmfao...

[2000Cadet]

I'll take a stab at this one...

Complexity - A concert percussionist will spend about the same amount of time perfecting a good cymbal crash as a good snare roll. The complexity of good cymbal technique is extremely demanding, not to mention that it requires a tremendous amount of physical stamina in the field context.

Notes - Sometimes playing more notes is actually easier than trying to find the E after 2 and having it line up exactly within the bazillion notes from the rest of the battery or a split melodic part. More is not always harder.

One of the reasons we see fewer and fewer cymbal lines is because it's so very hard to do well. The bar has been set very high and it's hard to compete with the likes of SCV and others. I sadly cut cymbals from my HS line just because I couldn't get enough players who could do it well. And if it's not going to be done well, why do it?

Trust me, I get the point. Still, I don't see why the technique couldn't be perfected by the people in the pit.

[Abbevillekid26]

lol @ tekk being a troll or ignorant because he disagrees.

[jplattSCV]

Keep them in the pit. Flashy cymbal line moves were cool when that's all we had for "GE".

If you are going to have a cymbal line, you have to use them both visually and musically. I see a lot of cymbal lines that are lot of flash, but they don't do that much in terms of color. When they play it is usually the same style of crash in various volumes. The better lines make a ton of creative use of styles with the cymbals that is great to hear as well as see.

If a line doesn't have the right direction, they probably should be in te pit.

I love a good cymbal line, but it doesn't bother me at all when all of he cymbal sound comes from the pit.

[Jeff Ream]

Which is what? Being further away from the stands so you can't hear the crash?

Wow, even I have to admit my statement sounds ignorant lmfao...

so you obviously didn't read my earlier post. there is so much more to what a cymbal can do than just crash.

taps, ziechens, crunks, clanks, slide chokes...and the 5000 other variables and options available, do a lot more musically than taking a mallet and hitting a cymbal on a mounted stand.

Ya know, if i made brass comments about technique, not being a brass player, I know you and manyothers would jump all over me. As someone who has played and taught marching cymbals, take my word and the many words of others here with actual experience and background, that really, if you don't understand, dont reply to just the sound botes, read the detailed posts or go find the online materials i mentioned earlier that could truly educate you about something that when done well, is phenomenal and can add so much musically.