Howdy Posted February 17, 2011 Author Share Posted February 17, 2011 (edited) Go to any big DCI show where there are a lot of drumcorps. This time don't just watch the corps, but also observe the FANS. Like it or not, many DCI FANS are bored to tears with a lot of things that drumcorps today are doing just to try to get higher scores. FANS vote, and FANS judge. They do so with their money. Smaller #'s of fans reveal that many fans are not happy with the current direction of DCI. Unless DCI makes changes to win these fans back, I think this trend of less fans at DCI shows is going to continue. Edited February 17, 2011 by Howdy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howdy Posted February 17, 2011 Author Share Posted February 17, 2011 (edited) <snip> This is kind of a goofy question/thought IMO. While I want corps to perform to fans, I also want judges to push each corps to design & perfect a high quality show that has to be held to standards. It's not mystery why exhibitions by corps tend to be a lot looser (sometimes even down-right flat) than judged shows. Having a performance critiqued/ranked/rated drives corps to rise up and put an amazing product on the field for us and I want to keep it that way. Let me guess, you marched. This might be what you want to see. This might be what a lot of people who marched in a drumcorps want to see, but remember, most DCI fans never marched in a drum and bugle corps. I will tell you what the fans want to see, something that is not just like the last few corps they just watched, something that they are familiar with, something that they can recognize. Fans want to be entertained. Edited February 17, 2011 by Howdy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Judges do not always get their scores and rankings right. I may disagree at times with the judges, but by and large they get it right. Why do I say that? Because I understand the sheets and the criteria. I may love a corps who is in 6th place, but I also realize that even if I love the show, they have dirt and issues the current scoring system will take into account. That doesn't mean they are wrong. That means that given the system in place, they got it right, but i really liked the show. More time is helpful. I have seen too many DCI judges sheets with very little writing on them, with "see tape" written on them if anything at all. Those kids have worked their tails off to perform, and they deserve the very best imput that the judges can give them. If you have ever been a judge before you know that more time would help judges. hate to tell you, but as costs increase, you will see DCI go paperless. Wgi is doing it now. Really, after 11 minutes of talking into a tape, do you really need to write a novel on the sheet? I've judged Howdy. I've had to do 27 drumlines in one night. 21 drumlines in 1 afternoon. I made a few quick bulletpoints on the sheet and had time left to wait for the units to be ready. I got it right both times. No. IMO, I'd put critique back at the end of the show so you could discuss those issues more in depth. As for the last two minutes of a DCI show not being judged, I can remember the freedom that I felt marching in exhibition at a marching band contest with the Liberty University Spirit of the Mountain Marching Band in which we were not judged. I was free to perform with entertainment in mind. My performance was better, and far more entertaining. I screamed monster high notes that sent the audience into a standing o that I might not have even attempted had I known we were being judged. it's called an encore. better yet, bring back retreat and let everyone play themselves off the field. Corps can't get the shows they have now clean, and you want to add more time??? Please, whatever kool aid you were given at Liberty, don't offer it to me. I think that this must needed change that will fill up the seats at DCI shows again comes down to one important thing, who do you want corps to perform for the most, the judges or the FANS! I have to be honest....making two minutes of the show anything goes design wise as you call it won't do #### for business. Why? because the other 9 minutes won't amount to much. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Or fans running out of the hot dog lines to see and hear something that won't put them to sleep. two minues alone won't do a ###### thing for business Howdy. Stop looking at it thru the lens of how high you claim to play, and look at the big picture. Corps have 11 minute shows. If you can only entertain for those last 2 minutes, you still fail. the key is to entertain for all 11 minutes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howdy Posted February 17, 2011 Author Share Posted February 17, 2011 <snip> Please, whatever kool aid you were given at Liberty, don't offer it to me. *** Re: No need for inappropriate personal attacks Jeff. *** Judges often get it wrong. DCI judges get it wrong a lot of the time. The problem with putting a critique or encore at the end of every show is that by the end of most shows, most corps are already on the road [kids need downtime]. This is not going to change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I've judged Howdy. What was his score? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Go to any big DCI show where there are a lot of drumcorps. This time don't just watch the corps, but also observe the FANS. Like it or not, many DCI FANS are bored to tears with a lot of things that drumcorps today are doing just to try to get higher scores. FANS vote, and FANS judge. They do so with their money. Smaller #'s of fans reveal that many fans are not happy with the current direction of DCI. Unless DCI makes changes to win these fans back, I think this trend of less fans at DCI shows is going to continue. here, I'll say it slower for you 2 m i n u t e s o f s h o w i s n o t e n o u g h , i t h a s t o b e a l l 1 1 m i n u t e s better? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Judges often get it wrong. DCI judges get it wrong a lot of the time. Incorrect. Given the criteria set in place, ( notice you snipped that part), they get it right pretty much every time. The problem is the criteria in place and what YOU like don't match, so you feel it's wrong. However, 2 whole minutes alone is not the solution. The problem with putting a critique or encore at the end of every show is that by the end of most shows, most corps are already on the road [kids need downtime]. This is not going to change. then the judges need to be prepared the next day to tell the staff what needs to be done, or put it in their tape wrap up. Still won't require more time. wrap ups on judging tapes and writing on the sheets is along the lines of what you tell staffs coming into critique: if it takes a staff 3 minutes to explain their show, they didn't do it right. Well, for a judge, if you need 4 minutes to write your comments on the sheet, finigh your tape, and jot some notes for critique, you didn't do it right. and since I haven't heard you brag about where you judge lately, I'll assume you didn't get it right Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaddyt Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Go to any big DCI show where there are a lot of drumcorps. This time don't just watch the corps, but also observe the FANS. Like it or not, many DCI FANS are bored to tears with a lot of things that drumcorps today are doing just to try to get higher scores. FANS vote, and FANS judge. They do so with their money. Smaller #'s of fans reveal that many fans are not happy with the current direction of DCI. Unless DCI makes changes to win these fans back, I think this trend of less fans at DCI shows is going to continue. You seem to be under the assumption that what the judges are looking for and what the fans want are totally exclusive of each other. I disagree. Judges are fans too. And the logistics of your proposal I think poses some issues. One being, when exactly does the 2 minutes start? Every show is a different length. How will the judges know when to stop judging? Not to mention, how will we know those final two minutes won't factor in their numbers at all? Are we going to beam them out of the venue so they're not able to see or hear any of it? And let's say we work all of those things out.... Are we going to start seeing shows where the last 2 minutes have the corps doing their greatest hits? That'll be monotonous, IMO. Are the closers going to be a little sloppier as the corps will spend time cleaning and refining what IS judged? That'll be crap. I want kick-### drum corps from start to finish. Yes, I might not always love the show. That doesn't mean it's crap drum corps.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howdy Posted February 17, 2011 Author Share Posted February 17, 2011 (edited) You seem to be under the assumption that what the judges are looking for and what the fans want are totally exclusive of each other. I disagree. Judges are fans too. And the logistics of your proposal I think poses some issues. One being, when exactly does the 2 minutes start? Every show is a different length. How will the judges know when to stop judging? Not to mention, how will we know those final two minutes won't factor in their numbers at all? Are we going to beam them out of the venue so they're not able to see or hear any of it? And let's say we work all of those things out.... Are we going to start seeing shows where the last 2 minutes have the corps doing their greatest hits? That'll be monotonous, IMO. Are the closers going to be a little sloppier as the corps will spend time cleaning and refining what IS judged? That'll be crap. I want kick-### drum corps from start to finish. Yes, I might not always love the show. That doesn't mean it's crap drum corps.... It is very simple, we go back to the way we did before. After nine minutes, bang. Trust me, after 9 minutes, shows will only get better. corps will attempt more [ including visually ], corps will give the fans more. Edited February 17, 2011 by Howdy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.