Tom Brace Posted October 1, 2011 Author Share Posted October 1, 2011 Sounds great in theory. However, the usual "punishment" for a corps in that situation is bankruptcy, folding and never coming back. So for those corps, your plan doesn't really provide any additional deterrent against this sort of behavior. Are you saying that there are corps that are financially and organizationally healthy enough to pass all DCI evaluations, except for this stiff-the-staff issue? Well, since is posted in the Open Class forum, most if not all of these corps haven't been through a DCI evaluation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Brace Posted October 1, 2011 Author Share Posted October 1, 2011 I guess I have been one of the lucky ones..in many mnay years I only had 1 corps that didnt pay all they said they would ( one the top 8 this year )ironically this same corps has accepted members who have stiffed winter as well as summer programs....go figure hugh? Maybe it should be another thread BUT I have seen so many programs go under or have so many financial issues due to behavior like this....................Corps..if you say youre going to pay then pay up...........members, pay you #### dues, the drum corps, winter persussion, winter color guard world doesnt need more dead beats ruining the activity. YOU AREN'T ENTITLED!!!!!!! HEHEHEHEHEHEHEHE OK OFF THE SOAP BOX bottom line......don't make promises you can't keep..that goes for corps as well as members Spot on. Also, I have heard of a corps...very recently..who was selling off their horns and percussion...from what I hear...have money in the bank....are running audition camps....charging new kids who audition money for the audition packet, but...still on the last day of September....45 days after finals...have not paid last year's staff. See, I understand the whole contract employee bit. And, I've had jobs suddenly end, but I would always get paid for the work I performed. And it's not ok to go a whole winter camp, all days, and the entire summer with a corps without one word about "not performing up to our expectations" and then stiff the entire staff after the season and pretend like the year didn't happen. And yes, DCI is an association of drum corps, who have an image to protect. When one of their "apples" goes rotten, it tarnishes the image of all. Decisions and consequences. That's what it's about. I believe DCI already has some authority over member contracts and not allowing the member to march somewhere else as long as the member owes their previous corps money. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonnyboy Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 If I was stiffed by a corps I would take them to court ASAP. If you are first in line for money, you will get paid before others should the corps go under. I would not hesitate to win, get a judgement and have the sheriff seize property if needed. If a corps administration lets it get to that point, they have bigger issues. Most corps will pay their bill under pressure, but a few phone calls and complaints is not real pressure. Most tech amounts would fall under small claims, easy to do it yourself. Also, with small claims, common sense and an idea of right and wrong prevail. You won't get a bunch of lawyers yapping about contract law, you will get a judge that will see your contract was for the summer of 2011, and it is now the start of the next season. Corps should not enter into contracts they cannot fullfill, and staff should be wary of vague contracts and unkept promises. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barifonium Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 Remember that parable of the king who forgave the debt....? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audiodb Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 Well, since is posted in the Open Class forum, most if not all of these corps haven't been through a DCI evaluation. That is not correct. The majority of current open-class corps went through new corps evaluations, a standard operating procedure for a number of years now. As far as I know, more of today's open-class corps have been evaluated than world-class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 Spot on. Also, I have heard of a corps...very recently..who was selling off their horns and percussion...from what I hear...have money in the bank....are running audition camps....charging new kids who audition money for the audition packet, but...still on the last day of September....45 days after finals...have not paid last year's staff. See, I understand the whole contract employee bit. And, I've had jobs suddenly end, but I would always get paid for the work I performed. And it's not ok to go a whole winter camp, all days, and the entire summer with a corps without one word about "not performing up to our expectations" and then stiff the entire staff after the season and pretend like the year didn't happen. And yes, DCI is an association of drum corps, who have an image to protect. When one of their "apples" goes rotten, it tarnishes the image of all. Decisions and consequences. That's what it's about. I believe DCI already has some authority over member contracts and not allowing the member to march somewhere else as long as the member owes their previous corps money. you are right on many accounts..... especially an image..as false as it may be sometimes DCI..WGI WOW Especially WGI Loves hiding all the dirty MAJOR secrets..ANYWAY...lol....There is an honor system amoung directors NOT to takes these members making a career of corps and winter program hopping the problem is ( especially if the kid is talented ) directors sometimes ( many times ) dont HONOR the other and take the kid. All I can say is , most of the time if they did it to 1 they will do it to another.It's a huge problem...unfortunately Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MHSmirage Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 If you can't afford to pay staff, don't expect the highest quality of staff. ....you get what you pay for. "doing it for the activity" is great and all, but you must take care of YOU too. I was on staff with a corps that barely had enough food to feed the kids, let alone staff. I was not paid anything for my time and have learned from it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 ..."doing it for the activity" is great and all, but you must take care of YOU too... Ding, Ding, Ding. For example, how is an aircraft company looking out for the best interest of the of safe transportation of the passengers if the company fails to pay the pilots, service crew, mechanics, etc...? The administration, whether an airline company or a drum corps, should look out for the best interest of the corporation and the employees, then the corporation and employees will look out for the best interest of the customers (or performers in the case of a drum corps). That is why there should be a major separation between those taking care of the corporation and staff (first), and those taking care of the artistic endeavors and instruction (second). Taking care of the corporation first allows the corporation to thus take care of the staff, and the staff is thus able to take care of the performers (in that order). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted October 3, 2011 Share Posted October 3, 2011 Remember that parable of the king who forgave the debt....? My understanding of the parable is in relationship to indebtedness of the workers "to" the king and the lack of forgiveness of sin down the line by those who were forgiven "by" the king. So, how does this parable you referenced actually apply to responsibility of proper stewardship (concerning a corps' administration accountability and responsibility to pay for the leasing of buses, the purchasing of food, and the paying of contracted staff)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Brace Posted October 3, 2011 Author Share Posted October 3, 2011 Remember that parable of the king who forgave the debt....? This may be the worst analogy I have read to date on DCP. So, the staff members should be kings about this whole thing? Yeah, the problem with that is many are young and need the summer's wages for school, etc. And age really doesn't matter. If a corps does not honor the contract, then how much faith could anyone have in the corps? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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