Shout out to the 1977 Garfield Cadets

[Bsader]

Boston didn't have any parental involvement. None! We did everything ourselves from planning travel, taking care of equipment, feeding ourselves...everything.. Our Drum Major was our director. With the exception of Tony Smith, Eric Rosen and Jay Murphy it was if the staff were members of the corp. It was a bit like the Lord Of The Flies without the split tribalism. Their was tribalism but we were members of the same tribe and yes, we were hooligans. Boston was as crazy as most people thought we were. '77 show in Bayonne we drive our 2 buses out of the parking lot right to a packy store. 2 wheelers with cases of beer right on to the bus. (We had our own hand picked bus drivers.) Sitting in the front seat was a good friend of mine from Charlestown. He could roll a joint faster than anyone I knew. Rolls a joint passes it back. Rolls another and passes it back and keeps going. It was as if everyone had a beer and was sharing a joint. Now I know this sounds like a war story but it is not. This was what Crusader's considered normal. But it came at a price! The mistakes we made cost us dearly. In 1978 we came in 15th place 1.45 points out of 12th. We had a 44 member all male brass line a smallish all male drum line and without a doubt the largest all female color guard in the country, 10 of whom played brass prior to joining Boston. We had 120 members. We were carrying on the traditions of our past. In fact the 1970 Boston Crusader's, the ones who came in 2nd place in the VFW Nationals had, I believe, a 48 all male brass line. Would 10 more brass players had made the difference? I suppose speculating would be insulting to the Kilties . I will say that in 1974 the 27th Lancer's had only 44 brass and they came in 20th. This is not an insult to 27th as we all know they were kicking Boston's butts back then. In 1978 we had 10 baritones so allowing the 10 young ladies into our brass line would have been like adding an entire Bari line. Traditions are what kept Boston alive but tradition for the sake of tradition is what kept Boston from getting out of it's own way. One last note in the form of myth busting. Many people say that the reason Boston was so small was due to people being too intimidated to join. This maybe somewhat true but not entirely. The large all female color guard I mentioned earlier was comprised of a lot of 15 and 16 year old girls who were not too intimidated to join and once they joined they stayed and don't think stereotypically as in they were tough inner city girls. The majority were from the burbs and is their a difference? We loved them and respected them but...ask most alumni who marched back then and they will tell you the same thing. We ####ed up. Though it is worth noting that our young women wouldn't let any guys in their color guard. They ####ed up as well. The Crusader's finally made the finals in 1999, 21 years later. The question. Would I had preferred more parental involvement and wisdom to show us the error of our ways? No. I can't imagine another Drum Corp having as much fun as we had. It was our form of fun and it was crazy fun.

Edited February 7, 2014 by Bsader

[rayfallon]

Boston didn't have any parental involvement. None! We did everything ourselves from planning travel, taking care of equipment, feeding ourselves...everything.. Our Drum Major was our director. With the exception of Tony Smith it was if the staff were members of the corp. It was a bit like the Lord Of The Flies without the split tribalism. Their was tribalism but we were members of the same tribe and yes, we were hooligans. Boston was as crazy as most people thought we were. '78 show in Bayonne we drive our 2 buses out of the parking lot right to a packy store. 2 wheelers with cases of beer right on to the bus. (We had our own hand picked bus drivers.) Sitting in the front seat was a good friend of mine from Charlestown. He could roll a joint faster than anyone I knew. Rolls a joint passes it back. Rolls another and passes it back and keeps going. It was as if everyone had a beer and was sharing a joint. Now I know this sounds like a war story but it is not. This was what Crusader's considered normal. But it came at a price! The mistakes we made cost us dearly. In 1978 we came in 15th place 1.45 points out of 12th which was occupied by the Kilties and some Corp from New Jersey. We had a 44 member all male brass line a smallish all male drum line and without a doubt the largest all female color guard in the country, 10 of whom played brass prior to joining Boston. We had 120 members. We were carrying on the traditions of our past. In fact the 1970 Boston Crusader's, the ones who came in 2nd place in the VFW Nationals, had a 46 all male brass line which I believe was the norm back then. Would 10 more brass players had made the difference? I suppose speculating would be insulting to both the Kilties and the Cadets. However, I will say that in 1974 the 27th Lancer's had only 44 brass and they came in 20th. This is not an insult to 27th we all know they were kicking Boston's butts back then. In 1978 we had 10 baritones so allowing the 10 young ladies into our brass line would have been like adding an entire Bari line. Traditions are what kept Boston alive but tradition for the sake of tradition is what kept Boston from getting out of it's own way. One last note in the form of myth busting. Many people say that the reason Boston was so small was due to people being too intimidated to join. This maybe somewhat true but not entirely. The large all female color guard I mentioned earlier was comprised of a lot of 15 and 16 year old girls who were not too intimidated to join and once they joined they stayed and don't think stereotypically as in they were tough inner city girls. The majority were from the burbs and is their a difference? We loved them and respected them but...ask any alumni who marched back then and they will tell you the same thing. We ####ed up. Though it is worth noting that our young women wouldn't let any guys in their color guard. They ####ed up as well. The Crusader's finally made the finals in 1999. 11 years later. The question. Would I had preferred more parental involvement and wisdom to show us the error of our ways? No. I can't imagine another Drum Corp having as much fun as we had. It was our form of fun and it was crazy fun. This was written in a state of sleep deprivation and I was going to go back and edit it but I'm to tired and I think it makes for a good ramble. I'm thinking of entering later as it own thread but will listen to any wisdom out their that convinces me otherwise. I'm going to bed.

One of the most interesting (if rambling) posts I've ever read on DCP - self aware but not defensive. I think you may have meant 21 years rather than 11 years later, but that's a relatively small point.

I'm not going to come out in favor of a DCI aged corps rolling joints and passing them back. I sort of hated the role of drugs - even relatively common "recreational" drugs - in a great youth activity. But it existed. Can't undo it or put the horse back in the barn.

But one really important thing came out of those late 70s early 80s BOSCRU corps - the Crusaders honestly, authentically became more sincere in their beliefs in themselves as a group, and their definition of success, than they cared about what anyone outside the corps thought. Other corps (even today) will say that "it's not about making finals - it's about the journey" but would sell their souls to make finals and implode after missing it. For Boston it became more than the "We don't 'GAVA'" cheer that echoed from membership for years.

Don't get me wrong - the 90s BOSCRU corps would have enjoyed making finals - but they wouldn't ever consider letting it change who they were to get it done. I believe this to be the truth, and I feel better for having become a small insignificant part of it.

It was like nowhere else, and a lot of that spirit and esprit d' corps came from the years you marched and the traditions your corps created for future BOSCRU corps.

[Bsader]

In regards to recreational drugs I rarely indulged myself. I drank my Budweiser or my Coors while in Colorado which I eventually switched to Olympia with fellow members of the Crusader's who felt that Coors was overrated. The story about the Bayonne bus trip was just one that popped into my head as I was writing this post. The friend I mentioned from Charlestown ended up spending close to 20 years in jail for multiple charges of armed robbery. His mother once showed up to our practice in Southie with an ice cream truck. When she sold all the ice cream the truck reappeared back to it's rightful owner. Looking back on my days with Boston I remarked to a friend of mine about how we weren't all crazy and mentioned 2 young members of our mellophone line whom I thought seemed like nice kids. He came back at me with, "don't you remember they got arrested and put on probation for mugging that old lady so as to get money to go on tour." These were the ones I thought were nice kids. It was our first night of rehearsal at Boston Latin and the talk was of where we would go afterwards to have a social. Punter's Pub on Hunnington Ave. Turns out Punter's was the Northeast University football teams place and they didn't like these band punks hanging around. They also didn't feel comfortable placing the word band next to the word punk because it didn't jive with the way they chose to view their universe. Anyways, a couple of skirmishes erupted into a short-lived brawl which began after we had stood outside the pub chanting for the team to come outside to fight us. It eventuallycame down to a fight between their starting linebacker and one of our lead soprano's who also just so happened to be a boxer and a lefty. The linebacker was apx. 6-2 230lbs and our lead sop apx 5-8 170 lbs. They let us be after they saw what happened to their fellow baller. I think they assumed we could all handle ourselves as well. Punter's remained our watering hole for many years to come. My point is this. We were the ones basically running the drum Corp and so we were the ones that D.C.I . would have been dealing with. And what would have happened if we did make the finals. We would have been put under the microscope. It was better that we didn't and that we hung out on the dark side of the parking lot and kept to ourselves. Again, these were not so much war stories as they were what we consider normal or somewhat normal events surrounding our days as marching members of the Boston Crusaders. By the way I am a member of Mass Brass and I think you our familiar with a few of my friends. The Captain and Strutta. True? or do I have you mixed up with someone else.

Edited February 7, 2014 by Bsader

[ironlips]

1975 ... was Richie Warga on staff that year as well?

:-)

No. You know perfectly well where he spent that summer, Andy.

It was '77 when I sent up that flare to have him launch the rescue mission to Hackensack.

[rayfallon]

I broke out the calculator and you were right. It was 21 years. In regards to recreational drugs I in fact did not partake. I drank my Budweiser or my Coors while in Colorado which I eventually switched to Olympia with fellow members of the Crusader's who felt that Coors was overrated. The story about the Bayonne bus trip was just one that popped into my head as I was writing this post. The friend I mentioned from Charlestown ended up spending close to 20 years in jail for multiple charges of armed robbery. His mother once showed up to our practice in Southie with an ice cream truck. When she sold all the ice cream the truck reappeared back to it's rightful owner. I remember buying my girl friend Jeannie Martorano an ice cream off of that truck. Looking back on my days with Boston I remarked to a friend of mine about how we weren't all crazy and mentioned 2 young members of our mellophone line whom I thought seemed like nice kids. He came back at me with, "don't you remember they got arrested and put on probation for mugging that old lady so as to get money to go on tour." These were the ones I thought were nice kids. It was our first night of rehearsal at Boston Latin and the talk was of where we would go afterwards to have a social. Punter's Pub on Hunnington Ave. Turns out Punter's was the Northeast University football teams place and they didn't like these band punks hanging around. They also didn't feel comfortable placing the word band next to the word punk because it didn't jive with the way they chose to view their universe. Anyways, a couple of skirmishes erupted into a short-lived brawl which began after we had stood outside the pub chanting for the team to come outside to fight us. It eventuallycame down to a fight between their starting linebacker and one of our lead soprano's who also just so happened to be a boxer and a lefty. The linebacker was apx. 6-2 230lbs and our lead sop apx 5-8 170 lbs. They let us be after they saw what happened to their fellow baller. I think they assumed we could all handle ourselves as well. Punter's remained our watering hole for many years to come. My point is this. We were the ones basically running the drum Corp and so we were the ones that D.C.I . would have been dealing with. And what would have happened if we did make the finals. We would have been put under the microscope. It was better that we didn't and that we hung out on the dark side of the parking lot and kept to ourselves. Again, these were not so much war stories as they were what we consider normal or somewhat normal events surrounding our days as marching members of the Boston Crusaders. By the way I am a member of Mass Brass and I think you our familiar with a few of my friends. The Captain and Strutta. True? or do I have you mixed up with someone else.

Nope - know the boys well. Spent some years both with the kids in the 90s and the Senior Cru after Ed left us.

The senior corps retained (and retains) some of that hard edged 70s Crusader ethos - never saw a group of retired drum corps people that would work that hard in my life - and I worked with a lot of alumni groups.

Between Moran, Mike, and Billy you had a hell of a lot of talent on soprano. You just had to take a mood stabilizer before you went to rehearsal.

Xanax - the recreational drug of alumni drum corps.

[Fran Haring]

No. You know perfectly well where he spent that summer, Andy.

It was '77 when I sent up that flare to have him launch the rescue mission to Hackensack.

IMO, one of the biggest mistakes we (Sunrisers) made the years I was there was not keeping Richie for the 1981 season after he spent 1980 with us He definitely knew his stuff when it came to all things marching/visual.

[Bsader]

By Billy I can only assume you mean Mr. Vallee. We were best friends together in Boston. I use to try to keep up with him as a player but he had so much natural talent. The only reason I had the solo in '79 was because he didn't march that year. He had an amazing sound. All that you need to do is listen to his solo in '77 Samba. We are playing together again in The Legends along with Bobby Hawe and I'm trying to get Kevin Mactaggert, a Lancer legend, to join us. We like to joke with Kevin that he should have marched Boston because he could easily keep up with us when it came to the consumption of the alcohol. By the way Mr. Hawe was the lefty pugilist. This is about '77 Garfield isn't it.

[SuperSaderFan]

Just to clarify some points that Bsader made in an earlier post from my memory bank: The point about alcohol and drugs is overplayed. I can not recall one time that the buses pulled up to a package store to load up the buses. Even though their was not any parent chaperones, the corps was always in the hands of the older members/leaders & staff (and Tony Smith was not the only staff member - Jay Murphy, G Watts, Eric Rosen, Gerry Dolan to name a few). Drugs were not tolerated and if caught there was punishment. It was a different time for the Corps, for those of us who stayed involved for all these years it was a great learning experience. The good was the "Winner never Quits and a Quitter never wins" mentality. It sustained us for years through hard times. It also taught us that it was not a sustainable model. The Corps has a rich 74 year history with good times and bad - each of us take away a memory. I would have preferred to have been a well run organization with less BS that you describe. The process of natural selection worked out well as the bad seeds found their way out of the Corps and the ones who really cared helped make it what it is today - a well run organization that is once again headed in the direction to compete for a national championship.

[craiga]

Just to clarify some points that Bsader made in an earlier post from my memory bank: The point about alcohol and drugs is overplayed. I can not recall one time that the buses pulled up to a package store to load up the buses. Even though their was not any parent chaperones, the corps was always in the hands of the older members/leaders & staff (and Tony Smith was not the only staff member - Jay Murphy, G Watts, Eric Rosen, Gerry Dolan to name a few). Drugs were not tolerated and if caught there was punishment. It was a different time for the Corps, for those of us who stayed involved for all these years it was a great learning experience. The good was the "Winner never Quits and a Quitter never wins" mentality. It sustained us for years through hard times. It also taught us that it was not a sustainable model. The Corps has a rich 74 year history with good times and bad - each of us take away a memory. I would have preferred to have been a well run organization with less BS that you describe. The process of natural selection worked out well as the bad seeds found their way out of the Corps and the ones who really cared helped make it what it is today - a well run organization that is once again headed in the direction to compete for a national championship.

My experiences with the corps may only date back to 1980, but my recollections agree with SuperSaderFan...in fact, the corps actually had rules against things like smoking, eating, and swearing in uniform, which I thought was pretty cool. I was from rural Maine, not the inner city, and when I joined I was immediately embraced by the members and made to feel like family. I made great friends with guys from Dorchester, Milton, Medford, Norwood, and Southie. Yes, the organization was nowhere near what it is today, but those kids had heart (as do today's members), and that is why I still support the corps now, 34 years later.

[rayfallon]

Just to clarify some points that Bsader made in an earlier post from my memory bank: The point about alcohol and drugs is overplayed. I can not recall one time that the buses pulled up to a package store to load up the buses. Even though their was not any parent chaperones, the corps was always in the hands of the older members/leaders & staff (and Tony Smith was not the only staff member - Jay Murphy, G Watts, Eric Rosen, Gerry Dolan to name a few). Drugs were not tolerated and if caught there was punishment. It was a different time for the Corps, for those of us who stayed involved for all these years it was a great learning experience. The good was the "Winner never Quits and a Quitter never wins" mentality. It sustained us for years through hard times. It also taught us that it was not a sustainable model. The Corps has a rich 74 year history with good times and bad - each of us take away a memory. I would have preferred to have been a well run organization with less BS that you describe. The process of natural selection worked out well as the bad seeds found their way out of the Corps and the ones who really cared helped make it what it is today - a well run organization that is once again headed in the direction to compete for a national championship.

With respect to the 77 Cadets, to whose memory this thread was initiated, I do want to add that to a tiny degree I think that we're rewriting a certain amount of Crusader history in a way that loses some essential color.

The corps didn't just weed out "bad seeds" and the history of the corps was not that it was always run like Lloyds of London. The drive to perpetuate the essential Crusader experience got the corps through a couple of periods of less than effective leadership, with Herculean efforts of folks like Joe Ricci (God bless him), Mike Woodall, Jim Cronin and others to correct the course when it occasionally strayed.

And some of those kids that might have been considered "bad seeds" in other organizations and maybe been weeded out, went on to be leaders, and good citizens, in part because of the Crusader experience. And I'm convinced that kids from more privileged backgrounds went on to become even better Doctors, lawyers, etc. in part because of their Crusader experience.

I don't think we need either image of the corps to dominate, not the bus pulling up to the packy (which bothered me too) or the Vienna Choir boys with Steve Jobs leading them.

This has been a gutsy, self-perpetuating organization that has taken a lot of kids with otherwise rough backgrounds, and welcomed kids from rural Maine and other places, and made them all into a family. I don't think that we need to portray it as less than that, in either direction.

It took Giants to keep this thing alive and culturally intact - fortunately they still exist.

Edited January 14, 2014 by rayfallon