Stu Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Just out of curiosity: With the 15/15, how would any corps that you throw out appeal to get back into DCI, or how would any new corps on the rise ever enter the ranks of DCI? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted December 20, 2011 Author Share Posted December 20, 2011 (edited) I don't see the need or benefit for money to flow through DCI to corps, rather than directly from tour co... as bulk of the money would be advanced prior to the tour. If the partner is putting in cash, there is no scenario where it works with DCI as the parent .... it is a non-starter. Partner would want ability for JV management to control outcome. Would you agree with the general statement that all corps, given the same financial resources, will perform at roughly the same level? In the antithesis, your model requires each corps to negotiate directly with the JV partners (primarily the production industry pros). It would make sense that the higher-placing corps will be able to negotiate the higher fees, leaving the lower-placing corps to "make due" and try to compete. That's not much different than the deal they now get from DCI. You're simply shifting the negotiation from DCI to the JV partners. I fail to see how this system would continue to provide the type of performance similarity that your model requires. Whether it's Corps.org negotiating or the individual corps, the money, in your model will always flow to the highest level of performance, leaving the lower-rated corps constantly trying to stay up with the spending of the top corps. Considering the animosity between the top corps and the others it's unlikely that there will be any desire for sharing inside Corps.org; more likely that, in that organization, too, the big shots will want all the nickels. DCI has to act as the intermediary to support the lower-placing corps in their efforts to perform on the same level as the top corps, without interfering with the decisions on scoring, etc. Edited December 20, 2011 by garfield Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 OK. Drum corps grows from the bottom up....not from the top down. Simple enough? Of course, that is a bit oversimplified. Top corps and circuits can serve as role models; they can share knowledge on everything from judge training to cleaning a snareline. I'll bet that representatives of the Blue Devils organization will do good things while in Malaysia. However, in the end (and in the beginning), it will be the people directly involved in these corps/bands in Malaysia and other nations who will pursue the three Ms (money, members and management) necessary to build their programs from the bottom up. It's much like your oak analogy....trees also grow from the bottom up. Without fertile soil, acorns are just squirrel food. drum corps grew with all of the smaller regional circuits. as DCI took them over/pushed them out, the number of drum corps keep dropping. easy enough? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrillmanSop06 Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Reality is that if it was such a great idea the G7 and your investment would have split off from DCI instead of you all attempting to rip out the soul of the activity. And by the way, much better to die with integrity and honor than live with millions of dollars of blood money (which would be the result by killing off so many DCI corps to benefit your arrogance). I hope the voting members of DCI have that integrity to turn down your investment for that very reason. Blood money? We're talking about summer marching band. Calm it down, bro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 High School programs are community-based, do not tour and have different support structures in place. These are a compliment to schools, which have the ability to offer a much different level of engagement with the students. Seen Genesis. Seems they're off to a good start. Not saying they don't have one. I'm only saying that if a tour partner/sponsor comes in, that would likely be something on the table for discussion. Youth at certain developmental stages (not necessarily age, but maturity, personal development, etc.) are really not ready for drum corps... many aren't even ready for school marching band. The great thing is that schools have support structures in place to help youth at certain stages develop in ways that drum corps cannot. With the school programs I had worked with previously, there were several occasions where students were recommended to counselors or school psychologists or peer groups. A couple of these kids later went on to have a great experience in top corps.... but only because they were able to get through some things that only the support structure of the school environment was properly prepared to help out with. I don't really think touring drum corps should be an activity for kids younger than 16, unless they are exceptional. That is a whole other discussion.... but.. my point of view. Anyway, I think lowering tour fees would resolve a lot of issues.... as more kids would have access.... which would increase competition for spots in various corps, greatly improving their performance level. Corps directors and management are out there busting their ### to keep fees down as low as possible... but my view is that the model is wrong. Under the current model, they will never be able to get fees much lower than they are now. So... alternative models should be explored. I'm doubting fees would be lower. it would ust give more money to spend on toys etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Both are local programs, serving primarily the local community and are designed as specific feeder programs for the A corps. I'm definitely an advocate for more local feeder corps as part of a top world class corps... but not so much for stand alone open class corps. I don't really see the point for some of these corps under the current model. If you changed the definition of open class, then stand alone open class corps make more sense. Again, just my opinion, and I accept that you disagree, nothing to get fired up about. yeah BDB stays local Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 (edited) Blood money? We're talking about summer marching band. Calm it down, bro. a) Blood is a figure of speech; and b) Danielray's idea actually would *kill* many corps who have collectively invested millions of dollars into the DCI activity by throwing them out of DCI. So, that monetary figure alone makes this a rather serious issue and not "just summer marching band". Edited December 20, 2011 by Stu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 drum corps grew with all of the smaller regional circuits. as DCI took them over/pushed them out, the number of drum corps keep dropping. easy enough? But this is exactly what Danielray wants; retaining as few corps of the existing top corps as possible so that they get the largest slices of the pie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danielray Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Reality is that if it was such a great idea the G7 and your investment would have split off from DCI instead of you all attempting to rip out the soul of the activity. And by the way, much better to die with integrity and honor than live with millions of dollars of blood money (which would be the result by killing off so many DCI corps to benefit your arrogance). I hope the voting members of DCI have that integrity to turn down your investment for that very reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danielray Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Whether I sound silly or not, the 15/15 idea is just a revised G7 proposal that still dumps **** all over the eight WC corps which will be relegated to OC, and completely kills all DCI support for most of the current OC. Nice ideas for honoring what is supposed to be an activity to benefit all youth who desire to be a part of DCI at some capacity. With this arrogance, even if there is a huge investment from a certain source, it will more than likely go the route of the do-do bird because it will lose the soul of the activity. Don't see any reason it might lose the soul. In fact, I'd love it to get a bit more funky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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