noblegaijin Posted June 5, 2014 Author Share Posted June 5, 2014 You've mentioned Carolina Crown to another poster. Carolina Crown is very business savy. Blue Knights are very business savy. Carolina Crown went out with a plan and executed that plan. They recruited the best staff that they could afford. That staff executed and drew higher and higher caliber members from all over the country. Blue Knights have not done the same over the course of time. They have done this from time to time in certain sections, but haven't gotten all the pieces together at the same time. So, Crown has risen. Blue Knights hovers in the middle of the pack. That's the only way that ANY corps is going to rise to the top. Good points - I agree that staff is the single biggest factor in the corps' success. That said, I don't necessarily believe that they need to court the best talent and have the deepest pockets. Maybe a little cunning and creative thought would go a long way. Maybe that means scouting talent that has yet to enter the drum corps field that they can get at a bargain price. There has to be a way - don't you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noblegaijin Posted June 5, 2014 Author Share Posted June 5, 2014 (edited) Why are you asking us ? With all due respect, your asking us this, seems " insane " behavior to me, given that you allegedly marched there and would have more insights into your questions on BK than those of us unconnected in any way with your former Corps. Wesleyerp DCP long time poster marched there when you did.. why not just take this up with him in a PM message instead of trashing your former Corps like this in public ? Does this seem like a reasonable way to handle your frustrations with your former Corps?.. or a bit " insane " as a recommendation to you ? It is not my intention to trash BK. An astute reader might ask, "why go to the effort to put up such a thoughtful write up?" Are we allowed to have dissenting opinions? Better yet, an opinion at all? If so, I am allowed to state so in a public forum without being accused of hiding behind a coputer screen or trashing my former corps. I want BK to be the best. And it's frustrating to watch the same cycle year after year. What can I say? Edited June 5, 2014 by noblegaijin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liahona Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 Each year that passes, I see the Blue Knights deliver a show that is, for all intents and purposes, clean / solid enough to be considered top 12. One adjective that I have never been able to use when it comes to a BK show (including the year I marched in 2000) is "entertaining". I was a part of the "dark and brooding" indoctrination that is BK - they're keen on proving that they have their own style and possibly more enthusiastic about making the sport "come around" on its collective view on what constitutes a championship performance. This is where an artist loses his identity in his work - it happens at the point where you insist that your audience "just doesn't get it" and belligerently pursue your particular point of view at the expense of its original intent: to edify your audience. An entertainer is beholden to his audience. A presenter doesn't show up at Pepsi and attempt to deliver a presentation on how to drive Coke sales. A magician doesn't walk up on stage and give the audience a talk on blood diamonds. Nor should a drum corps take the field and give the audience its take on a great show iwhile incessantly ignoring years and years of evidence that this style, viewpoint, institution is not considered to be the state of the art. Some at the BK camp perhaps believe that emulating the success of other corps only cheapens its brand. It's a "sellout". It's "admitting defeat". To that, I say "try not to take yourselves so seriously." There is a reason why Olympic swimmers, basketball, football, and baseball players have "fundamentals" -- these are things that tend to yield the best results. Every science has evolved in a similar fashion. Where would we be had a group of rugged sailors not discovered that the world were curved? How about Copernicus' crazy notion that the Earth rotates around the sun? How about transistors before there were integrated circuits or later computers? Is there room for innovation? Did Robert Noyce ignore Shockley's breakthroughs with the transitor before he created Intel? Doesn't the evolution of any art form require the good work that came before the breakthroughs? BK should start from a place that observes the fundamentals. Pick songs that the audience can identify with. Have flashy moments that show of its musicianship and confidence to the crowd. Make someone's pulse exceed 60 beats per minute. Otherwise, you're just performing for yourselves. What's the fun in that? I'm not going to bash at you for calling your corps out. I think I understand where you are coming from in terms of personal frustration, but I think ranting on here about it is really not doing anything good for you or BK for that matter. In the end, it is really not going to make much of a difference anyway. The best advice I can give as a member, supporter, and fan of this activity is just relish all these great performances that all the corps top to bottom give us each summer and stop worrying about competitive placement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 (edited) It is not my intention to trash BK. An astute reader might ask, "why go to the effort to put up such a thoughtful write up?" Are we allowed to have dissenting opinions? Better yet, an opinion at all? If so, I am allowed to state so in a public forum without being accused of hiding behind a coputer screen or trashing my former corps You are absolutely entitled to express your opinions. Which you did. I am also entitled to express mine. In my opinion, your questioning for us seems dopey behavior to me. You'd know your Corps better than anyone unconnected with your Corps would, and as a result, would know the answers to these questions you are asking us in your obvious frustrations with your former Corps better than any of us would. But again, you don't have to ask this of your Corps, you can come on here and be dopey in your behavior in public too. You're entitled to that too, imo. Edited June 5, 2014 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trask Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 Having seen Blue Knights at two shows last season (Minneapolis and World Finals) I can most definitely say that they were a favorite of mine. I was wowed at Minnie and truly became a fan after seeing them at finals. When the 10th place corps on finals night wows me and I fall asleep during the 5th and 3rd place shows, I'm leaning towards the opinion that scores are just a load of malarkey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wesleyrp Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 Um let me get this straight Jeremy, u want BK to be a top 6/World Champ.... Ok perhaps you can help the corps like I do by recruiting and talk to members about staying true to BK each and every year instead of jumping ship to BD or Phantom etc.... You say you're frustrated, u talked to Mark Arnold, u let him know that you find them to be inconsistently consistent by making finals 15 times? You marched 2000? I marched 97 and 98... What made the 6th place finish happen then was a building.... I marched with three 13 year old sops in 97, those kids grew up and stayed with the corps. Retention is everything, and while you're trashing them, THEY RETAINED THIS YEAR!!!! I've heard the whole show. You? It's pretty #### cool and takes on an incredible topic. You've missed the boat on what are corps is all about.... BK is one of the few corps out there that can tackle European Brass Music one year then play jazz, Symphonies, movie music, American folk... The corps style is- Diversity! You have no clue what you're talking about and I'm ashamed you chose to publicly thrash the corps with no knowledge of what's going on. Wow, I hope you enjoy Drums while some of us only dream of going to Denver to support the corps!!! Unbelievable! PS BK is kicking ASH this summer. But guess that's just boring or since they might not be top 6 they should just stay home;) Wes Perkins BK 97 98 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noblegaijin Posted June 6, 2014 Author Share Posted June 6, 2014 I can see that I made the mistake of thinking that drum corps is a competitive activity. Or, wait... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjeffeory Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 (edited) Good points - I agree that staff is the single biggest factor in the corps' success. That said, I don't necessarily believe that they need to court the best talent and have the deepest pockets. Maybe a little cunning and creative thought would go a long way. Maybe that means scouting talent that has yet to enter the drum corps field that they can get at a bargain price. There has to be a way - don't you think? I can agree, but you have to have a confluence of design in percussion, guard, brass, and drill. Then you have to have the proper staff to clean it up enough and the members that are able to perform it. Just look at Crown and their percussion. Almost cost them a win last year. Look at Madison. Building after putting together a great staff. SCV is building after getting all the pieces together. Bluecoats have been building, but then stepped back on visual last year. Phantom won, then fell back partly because of design. Cavaliers were perennial top 3 until they lost one key designer and staff member too many and are building back up. Blue Knights have had and do have great staff, and that's what got them from where they were in the 80s to 90 and beyond ( where they borrowed a LOT of names from the Cadets to get there). They've had more great Cadet staff ( and Star arrangers) recently for a little while, and they have a great percussion staff, but they need to have everything click at the same time to get beyond the top 7 or so corps today and even to climb higher. It takes a LOT of sustained effort. So, get some people who were trained by the previous generation's greats and given them a chance. Crown has on the brass staff, and they have some great designers too ( that have worked with great corps). This will attract more success. I dunno. I look forward to seeing where they can go with this current direction. Edited June 6, 2014 by jjeffeory Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noblegaijin Posted June 6, 2014 Author Share Posted June 6, 2014 Um let me get this straight Jeremy, u want BK to be a top 6/World Champ.... Ok perhaps you can help the corps like I do by recruiting and talk to members about staying true to BK each and every year instead of jumping ship to BD or Phantom etc.... You say you're frustrated, u talked to Mark Arnold, u let him know that you find them to be inconsistently consistent by making finals 15 times? You marched 2000? I marched 97 and 98... What made the 6th place finish happen then was a building.... I marched with three 13 year old sops in 97, those kids grew up and stayed with the corps. Retention is everything, and while you're trashing them, THEY RETAINED THIS YEAR!!!! I've heard the whole show. You? It's pretty #### cool and takes on an incredible topic. You've missed the boat on what are corps is all about.... BK is one of the few corps out there that can tackle European Brass Music one year then play jazz, Symphonies, movie music, American folk... The corps style is- Diversity! You have no clue what you're talking about and I'm ashamed you chose to publicly thrash the corps with no knowledge of what's going on. Wow, I hope you enjoy Drums while some of us only dream of going to Denver to support the corps!!! Unbelievable! PS BK is kicking ASH this summer. But guess that's just boring or since they might not be top 6 they should just stay home;) Wes Perkins BK 97 98 Wes, here's is what I'm talking about - never a finals placing higher than sixth place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wesleyrp Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 How many corps have ever placed above 6th..... No offense but the levels are so much more difficult than when u and I marched.... Finalists are so close in performance level. It's all about retention and staffing which they've got in place. They had transition and a lot of it, but still didn't drop out of finals. I think you have a pretty narrow view of how this works. But again, talk to the staff or Mark. I have 4 or 5 current or former kids marching there and I recruit across the state for them. It's about building a culture, not tearing it down 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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