GUARDLING Posted July 8, 2014 Share Posted July 8, 2014 (edited) Right, DCI is growing its number of teams, numbers of participants, numbers of fans, numbers of sponsors, numbers of revenues, numbers of TV exposure, media coverage,, etc and thats why DCI shouldn't do anything differently. We like the Cadevaliers winning over 80% of the DCI Titles since 1976, and we like the unfettered flow of talent from the competitors below to the Cadevaliers, and we'd be happy as a clam when the Cadevaliers win over 80% of the DCI Titles over the next 40 years too. You're an alum of the Cadevaliers Trifecta, so naturally you love this bizarre system that no other youth sports organization in the entire world would permit... and for obvious reasons. BUT.... we're growing faster than all of them in the numbers of participants, teams, sponsors, TV exposure, revenues, publicity, media coverage, fans, DCP traffic, so what do all these others know, right ? you bring up your cadavalier subject often..Im not quite understanding I guess. I think you can change the sheets, changes judges, change whatever you want , you really dont think a good corps is not going to change to make whatever changes are made to be successful? Nothing would change , and as far as members leaving etc etc you stated in other posts that no matter what the talent level it was about staff and the whos whoi..So I'm not getting your beef. The system no matter what it is will still produce winning corps, winning corps win for a reason and it has nothing to do with how the sheets are or the system. Please no references to sports. the activity isnt the same as any of those things. Edited July 8, 2014 by GUARDLING 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted July 8, 2014 Share Posted July 8, 2014 Right, DCI is growing its number of teams, numbers of participants, numbers of fans, numbers of sponsors, numbers of revenues, numbers of TV exposure, media coverage,, etc and thats why DCI shouldn't do anything differently. We like the Cadevaliers winning over 80% of the DCI Titles since 1976, and we like the unfettered flow of talent from the competitors below to the Cadevaliers, and we'd be happy as a clam when the Cadevaliers win over 80% of the DCI Titles over the next 40 years too. You're an alum of the Cadevaliers Trifecta, so naturally you love this bizarre system that no other youth sports organization in the entire world would permit... and for obvious reasons. BUT.... we're growing faster than all of them in the numbers of participants, teams, sponsors, TV exposure, revenues, publicity, media coverage, fans, DCP traffic, so what do all these others know, right ? The people that run all these world wide organizations don't know what they're doing. We have Dean, Hop, Dave, and Michael C., et al, and most of them have Masters Degrees in Business, Finance, Economics, Management, etc This is summarized from a 2014 WSJ article... Participation Declines: Combined participation in the four most-popular team sports listed above fell among boys and girls aged 6 through 17 by about 4 percent. The population of 6- to 17-year-olds in the U.S. fell just 0.6 percent during that same time period, according to the U.S. Census. Participation in high school football was down 2.3 percent in 2012-2013 compared to the 2008-2009 season, according to the National Federation of State High School Associations. Participation in high school basketball was down 1.8 percent. Little League baseball reports U.S. participation in its baseball and softball leagues was down 6.8 percent. A new survey by the Sports and Fitness Industry Association and the Physical Activity Council, a nonprofit research agency funded by seven trade groups, found that 2012 participation in organized football by players aged 6 through 14 was 4.9 percent below that in 2008. Basketball participation fell 6.3 percent in the 6-to-14 group during that period, according to the survey of nearly 70,000 households and individuals. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corpsband Posted July 8, 2014 Share Posted July 8, 2014 This is summarized from a 2014 WSJ article... Participation Declines: Combined participation in the four most-popular team sports listed above fell among boys and girls aged 6 through 17 by about 4 percent. The population of 6- to 17-year-olds in the U.S. fell just 0.6 percent during that same time period, according to the U.S. Census. Participation in high school football was down 2.3 percent in 2012-2013 compared to the 2008-2009 season, according to the National Federation of State High School Associations. Participation in high school basketball was down 1.8 percent. Little League baseball reports U.S. participation in its baseball and softball leagues was down 6.8 percent. A new survey by the Sports and Fitness Industry Association and the Physical Activity Council, a nonprofit research agency funded by seven trade groups, found that 2012 participation in organized football by players aged 6 through 14 was 4.9 percent below that in 2008. Basketball participation fell 6.3 percent in the 6-to-14 group during that period, according to the survey of nearly 70,000 households and individuals. Stupid facts! Always getting in the way of people's rants :-) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corpsband Posted July 8, 2014 Share Posted July 8, 2014 you bring up your cadavalier subject often..Im not quite understanding I guess. I think you can change the sheets, changes judges, change whatever you want , you really dont think a good corps is not going to change to make whatever changes are made to be successful? Nothing would change , and as far as members leaving etc etc you stated in other posts that no matter what the talent level it was about staff and the whos whoi..So I'm not getting your beef. The system no matter what it is will still produce winning corps, winning corps win for a reason and it has nothing to do with how the sheets are or the system. Please no references to sports. the activity isnt the same as any of those things. I think Brasso gets paid cash everytime he says Cadev...ier. It's the only explanation that makes sense! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted July 8, 2014 Share Posted July 8, 2014 , winning corps win for a reason and it has nothing to do with how the sheets are or the system. I didn't mention anything at all in my remarks here about the judging "the sheets ", so I really don't know what you're talking about now, as it has nothing at all to do with my remarks here on this thread. But MikeD likes it, so you got that going for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted July 8, 2014 Share Posted July 8, 2014 I didn't mention anything at all in my remarks here about the judging "the sheets ", so I really don't know what you're talking about now, as it has nothing at all to do with my remarks here on this thread. But MikeD likes it, so you got that going for you. so why your reference then. 80% and all that stuff about being happy with.....ahhh never mind..thanks anyway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted July 8, 2014 Share Posted July 8, 2014 (edited) This is summarized from a 2014 WSJ article... Participation Declines: Combined participation in the four most-popular team sports listed above fell among boys and girls aged 6 through 17 by about 4 percent. The population of 6- to 17-year-olds in the U.S. fell just 0.6 percent during that same time period, according to the U.S. Census. Participation in high school football was down 2.3 percent in 2012-2013 compared to the 2008-2009 season, according to the National Federation of State High School Associations. Participation in high school basketball was down 1.8 percent. Little League baseball reports U.S. participation in its baseball and softball leagues was down 6.8 percent. A new survey by the Sports and Fitness Industry Association and the Physical Activity Council, a nonprofit research agency funded by seven trade groups, found that 2012 participation in organized football by players aged 6 through 14 was 4.9 percent below that in 2008. Basketball participation fell 6.3 percent in the 6-to-14 group during that period, according to the survey of nearly 70,000 households and individuals. You really don't want to compare the numbers of participants, teams, fans, sponsors, etc from 1972 in DCI to all these sports from the similar time frame of 1972, If you do, you and your handful of syncopants will look entirely foolish to compare the numbers of percentage growth in 1972 to that of 2013 in DCI compared to these sports from the similar 1972 timeframe. You listed a much much shorter window of time( 1-2 years ). None of these sports have lost anywhere near the percentage numbers of participants, teams, fans, etc as has DCI Drum Corps since 1972 when DCI started. Plus, all these sports since 1972 have INCREASED their national media coverage, and ALL of them are receiving world wide TV exposure that dwarfs that of 1972 DCI, by comparison ? DCI used to be on TV, and on live TV, and nationally too. Today ? DCI has no TV exposure for its Championship Finals. If you can't make it out to Indiana, the only way you get to see the show live is by getting a pay for view feed to your computer so you and a few hundred other remaining die hards can catch it your home basement or den now. So PLEASE... don't look so ridiculous in attempting to compare the numbers, nor the percentage drop offs of participants, teams, fans, media coverage, TV coverage of these youth sports from 1972 to today with that of DCI from its inception to today. The numbers are,by comparison, are simply embarrasingly bad. So don't do this to yourself, ( or to others ), by bringing up a snapshot comparison of a 1 year, 2 year period, when the 40 year results are much more instructive and much more revealing in the data's value on who is growing, and who is not on a percentage basis, and these sports are all starting from a point that is light years removed and better from the hard volume numbers in DCI to begin with. Edited July 8, 2014 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted July 8, 2014 Share Posted July 8, 2014 Except of of course if members pay for the right to join just about all other youth competitive sports organizations ( Little League, Soccer, Legion Baseball, Pop Warner Football, Bantam Youth Hockey, AAU Basketball, etc these organizations after they collect your payment, assign you to a team, and you stay put there, whether you or your parents like that team assigned or not. You can always quit the team... some no doubt do, but you don't get your money back. Its the way its been for over half a century, and most don't complain, and these sports are growing, and its competition between teams vibrant and unslotted, and with LOTS of placement movements up and down each and every season in all these organizations.. Pop Warner football...from 2010 thru 2012 declined from 250K participants to 225K. As for Bantam Youth Hockey,. I'd take a look at how their teams are selected via the tryout process each year, at least from a document I just read. Little League membership dropped 24% between 2000 and 2009, according to a WSJ article. In any event, these are irrelevant activities when looking at drum corps. In Little League, for instance, you have to live within the geographic area covered by your Little League organization to even participate. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted July 8, 2014 Share Posted July 8, 2014 You really don't want to compare the numbers of participants, teams, fans, sponsors, etc from 1972 in DCI to all these sports from the similar time frame of 1972, If you do, you and your handful of syncopants will look entirely foolish to compare the numbers of percentage growth in 1972 to that of 2013 in DCI compared to these sports from the similar 1972 timeframe. You listed a much much shorter window of time. None of these sports have lost anywhere near the percentage numbers of participants, teams, fans, etc as has DCI Drum Corps since 1972 when DCI started. Plus, all these sports since 1972 have INCREASED their national media coverage, and ALL of them are receiving world wide TV exposure that dwarfs that of 1972 DCI, by comparison ? DCI used to be on TV, and on live TV, and nationally too. Today ? DCI has no TV exposure for its Championship Finals. If you can't make it to Indiana, the only way you get to see the show live is by getting a pay for view feed to your computer so you and a few hundred other remaining die hards can catch in your basement or den now. So PLEASE... don't look so ridiculous in attempting to compare the numbers of participants, teams, fans, media coverage, TV coverage of these youth sports from 1972 to today with that of DCI from its inception to today. The numbers are,by comparison, are simply embarrasingly bad. So don't do this to yourself, ( or to others ). Where did I compare numbers? Part of the reason they are so different from drum corps is that they are huge organizations with millions of participants, in some cases local-based (Little League, for instance). My post was about the decline in membership to counter your assertion about how they are growing due to transfer policies, thought how you get to point B from your point A is a mystery to me. You keep making these ridiculous comparisons, not me. DCI drum corps in 1972 had 12 members, just fyi. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cappybara Posted July 8, 2014 Share Posted July 8, 2014 Jesus unless we have solid, hard figures on whether DCI participation has fell or not, I think we should stop all the speculation. As for comparing DCI to sports, they're two different beasts. To everyone, DCI is marching band. Marching band is a niche activity for the nerds and geeks alike. If you think people will watch DCI on TV, you're absolutely nuts. As much physical activity is required in DCI, it will never be considered a sport because of its stigma as being something for hardcore band geeks. With the direction music is taking these days, there is an even greater polarization between DCI and the mainstream. Kinda makes all the synths and modern shows seem like a good direction to bring in more people then, doesn't it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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