C.Holland Posted July 17, 2015 Share Posted July 17, 2015 EXACTLY! And it feels like if you're at 70 or less it hurts you to compete in Open Class. I think DCI would rather you cut the fat and go down to soundsport instead of help to build up drum corps. grumble. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted July 17, 2015 Share Posted July 17, 2015 with the numbers of corps shrinking at that time, i think DCI thought it was going to be better to merge div 2 and 3 into one division. Especially when div 2 was getting so small. (less than ten corps) I sense this was for marketing purposes as well, since it appeared to happen as one total change---establishing the World Class (old Div. I) and combining Div II and III into one class---Open. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northwest-MikeB Posted July 17, 2015 Share Posted July 17, 2015 with the numbers of corps shrinking at that time, i think DCI thought it was going to be better to merge div 2 and 3 into one division. Especially when div 2 was getting so small. (less than ten corps) I pose the question of whether the current structure of Open and World Class, has contributed to the demise of the Div II/Div III structure. Specifically, there are number of World Class corps that typically place 18 or below that would be well suited to complete in Div II, if such a division and option existed. Note that “World Class” is only partially a performance class. World Class is also a class of rights entailed in being a DCI member. (Open Class corps are not members.) Those DCI membership rights include access to shows, higher performance fees, and voting rights at DCI. For a drum corps, those membership rights are highly desired. I would rather see a competitive option that allows all corps within a similar competitive range (say Div II) to at times preform together, keeping DCI membership and membership rights as a separate issue. In addition to providing a better competitive experience to those corps, this may make those "Div II" shows more appealing to fans, thus drive more ticket sales and justify performance fees to the second tier corps. This may then create the opportunity for smaller corps to have their own competitive grouping (say Div III). Of course I could be completely wrong. Such past discussions in my own corps have been considered blasphemous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted July 17, 2015 Share Posted July 17, 2015 (edited) I pose the question of whether the current structure of Open and World Class, has contributed to the demise of the Div II/Div III structure. Specifically, there are number of World Class corps that typically place 18 or below that would be well suited to complete in Div II, if such a division and option existed. If recollection is correct, World class corps receive a set performance fee per show, whereas Open class split the proceeds of (the end total) what DCI charges show (TEP's) sponsors for Open class shows throughout the season. In short, Open class corps receives a piece of the pie (at the conclusion of the season) of all the Open class shows they were involved in---World class receive pay based on a set performance fee--per show. It may have changed in recent years---but, then again--maybe not................. Bottom line.............it's all 'bout da money. Edited July 17, 2015 by bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleran Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 (edited) Specifically, there are number of World Class corps that typically place 18 or below that would be well suited to complete in Div II, if such a division and option existed. Don't forget, though, when talking about pushing down those 5-6 corps into a lower division: if such lower divisions remain segregated at most of their competitions (as is the case for most of the 2nd half of the current DCI seasonal structure), then yes, they may be in a more competitive environment, but they venues and crowds they will be performing in/for don't exactly make for the most memorable experiences for the marchers. No matter how the corps are divided up into divisions, I think it's imperative that the lower level corps don't simply get pushed aside and left to fend for themselves. Edited July 18, 2015 by Eleran Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northwest-MikeB Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 If recollection is correct, World class corps receive a set performance fee per show, whereas Open class split the proceeds of (the end total) what DCI charges show (TEP's) sponsors for Open class shows throughout the season. In short, Open class corps receives a piece of the pie (at the conclusion of the season) of all the Open class shows they were involved in---World class receive pay based on a set performance fee--per show. It may have changed in recent years---but, then again--maybe not................. Bottom line.............it's all 'bout da money. Maybe someone in a current Open Class corps could add to the conversation about Open Class show profit sharing or performance fees. My experience is: ...In 2007, my corps sponsored an exclusively Open Class show. There was no profit sharing structure, but then no one else shared in show's loss. ...In 2014, I ask about my corps attending an Open Class show. I was told okay, but that there would be $0 fees paid. Maybe it's different for those corps in Open Class that participate in a show? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northwest-MikeB Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 (edited) Don't forget, though, when talking about pushing down those 5-6 corps into a lower division: if such lower divisions remain segregated at most of their competitions (as is the case for most of the 2nd half of the current DCI seasonal structure), then yes, they may be in a more competitive environment, but they venues and crowds they will be performing in/for don't exactly make for the most memorable experiences for the marchers. No matter how the corps are divided up into divisions, I think it's imperative that the lower level corps don't simply get pushed aside and left to fend for themselves. Yes, I agree. If current World Class corps were pushed into a lower class, and then forced to exclusively compete in that grouping, it would be harmful. The point that I was attempting to make was to allow more mixing of corps, along with providing awards (i.e. winners) within Divisions (or some form of grouping) based on standings, without disrupting an individual corps' status in their class. By strengthening a second tier (e.g. Div II), we then make room to once again create a competitive grouping for smaller corps (e.g. Div III). Yes, I totally agree. The lower-level corps cannot be left to fend for themselves. The question remains, can a positive structure be created for the smaller corps, and if that were accomplished, would it in fact foster the creation of more drum corps? Note that such drum corps may serve younger members and, in many cases, less financially able members. Edited July 18, 2015 by Northwest-MikeB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeWhoWaits Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 Open Class corps are not members of DCI, but must be approved by DCI to participate. Something fishy about that combination of concepts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smj02 Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 (edited) Wow... so many great names on that list. I remember a corps from Japan.... Pride of Soka. Saw them at the 2000 DCI Div. 2/3 championship prelims in Maryland. They had one of the most insanely complex visual shows I've ever seen from a corps, on any level. Great stuff. i believe it was Pride of Soka, and I believe that same year, that received a 2.00 penalty because the corps proper was late to the gate at Allentown. Edited July 18, 2015 by smj02 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
totaleefree Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 Lehigh Valley Knights started out as Chieftains DCA corps who I think won the first DCA Class A title. They were from Allentown PA. Cadets moved to Allentown in 2003 and Knights closed down. I am sure there were probably lots of George Hopkins conspiracy theories then. However with cadets 2 they brought a DCA corps back to Allentown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.