Jeff Ream Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 22 hours ago, MikeN said: I have to disagree - I've seen a ton of shows this year, and I don't see it that way. I see a *lot* of pretty intense movement all across the field. I don't think it's becoming park and bark at all. Mike agreed. since visual starting going to unheard of levels in 82, there have always been "stationary" moments, and some corps had more than other. Now they add in body and stuff that wasnt done in the 80's. But run and gun for 11 minutes is not the flavor anymore, so now people lament the "lack of demand". The key now is showing multiple types of demands, not just the same one over and over and over and over and over... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 18 minutes ago, Bobby L. Collins said: Yeah, I really don't need your history lesson on bugles (you'll find in the days and weeks and months to come that I'm actually a pretty smart guy, and I've already done the research...probably just as much as you, in fact), nor do I need your pedantic insistence on playing devil's advocate for the sake of being contrary. They were marketed as bugles by the companies that produced them, they were called bugles by everyone who played them and listened to them, and even if they stopped being bugles by your narrow definition 25 years before I stepped foot on the field, they were still recognized and regarded as bugles by Drum Corps International right up until George Hopkins decided he didn't want to use them anymore. You will not use semantics or wordplay to question my devotion to drum and bugle corps. END OF DISCUSSION. What I would really like you to do is to read my post on G bugles on the "a question for the purists" thread, because I just don't have time to type all that again. In that post, I agree that not every corps sounded great on bugles, but I go on to maintain that was on the performers and instructors, not the equipment. I even delve into reasons why corps today wouldn't dream of playing on bugles. It's a long read, but you seem to enjoy reading. Opinions are fine, I just chuckle at those who think their era is 'the only' era which really defines an ever morphing activity like this that was actually different before they arrived and is certainly different after they depart. And yes I do enjoy reading, but I do not enjoy thread diving; so post a link to the diatribe you would like me to read and I am sure, by your description, it is not as pedantic as mine. And a rather good movie quote comes to mind, "Lighten up Francis." - Sgt. Hulka Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby L. Collins Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 1 hour ago, StunnedMonkey said: I get that. But for some of us it's like we slipped and hit our head right after the Reds won the World Series in 1976, and woke up 40 years later and asked to watch a baseball game, and the players all had hockey sticks and rode horses,...in a pool. We'd say, what the heck is this? It's baseball. It evolved. Only baseball is fundamentally still the same 40 years later. DCI is not. Drum corps used to be a marching and music activity. Now it's more of a theatrical/visual/dance showcase where music is merely relegated to a support role. I can't imagine sitting down and listening to audio recordings of a modern corps. What would be the point? Again. I don't care what you call them. They sounded different. They were unique. I miss "those instruments that weren't true bugles that sounded so cool and brought fans to their feet." Better? That baseball analogy is a good one. If I were a 20 year old musician approached today and asked to participate in DCI, I would probably snicker and not-so-politely decline. I do a pretty good job looking like an absolute fool every single day of my life. I don't need to pay thousands of dollars and practice hundreds of hours, pushing my body and mind to their very limits in order to achieve the very same result in spandex tights on a football field. And had I been asked to do even 5% of the ridiculous stuff they do in DCI today when i marched, I would have just gone home. Of course, I didn't even like taking a knee during our ballad, or the handful of horn flashes we were instructed to perform. Maybe I was just a stick in the mud back then too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby L. Collins Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Stu said: Opinions are fine, I just chuckle at those who think their era is 'the only' era which really defines an ever morphing activity like this that was actually different before they arrived and is certainly different after they depart. And yes I do enjoy reading, but I do not enjoy thread diving; so post a link to the diatribe you would like me to read and I am sure, by your description, it is not as pedantic as mine. And a rather good movie quote comes to mind, "Lighten up Francis." - Sgt. Hulka I have a sneaking suspicion that you and I aren't going to be friends. And that's fine. I'm not here to be your friend. And if you're not willing to click back one page and hit control + F and type "a question for purists", an action that would take less than 10 seconds to execute , then I'm not willing to consider anything you have to talk about to be worthy of merit or consideration. Edited August 10, 2017 by Bobby L. Collins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 Just now, Bobby L. Collins said: I have a sneaking suspicion that you and I aren't going to be friends. And that's fine. I'm not here to be your friend. A Friend is someone who knows all about you and will stick by your side anyway and will also lay his life down for you if need be. Friends, as in Facebook 'friends', is something else that makes me chuckle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 8 minutes ago, Bobby L. Collins said: That baseball analogy is a good one. If I were a 20 year old musician approached today and asked to participate in DCI, I would probably snicker and not-so-politely decline. I do a pretty good job looking like an absolute fool every single day of my life. I don't need to pay thousands of dollars and practice hundreds of hours, pushing my body and mind to their very limits in order to achieve the very same result in spandex tights on a football field. And had I been asked to do even 5% of the ridiculous stuff they do in DCI today when i marched, I would have just gone home. Of course, I didn't even like taking a knee during our ballad, or the handful of horn flashes we were instructed to perform. Maybe I was just a stick in the mud back then too. The excellent brass players in Here Come The Mummies I think might disagree with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 (edited) 29 minutes ago, Bobby L. Collins said: ... I'm not willing to consider anything you have to talk about to be worthy of merit or consideration. Condescending statements that someone else's opinions are not worthy of merit or consideration is typically an indication of a narcissistic mindset. Just sayin'. Edited August 10, 2017 by Stu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby L. Collins Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Stu said: Condescending statements that someone else's opinions are not worthy of merit or consideration is typically an indication of a narcissistic mindset. Just ssyin'. Well if you're too lazy to click back a page and read, then you're too lazy to have a valid opinion. Full stop. Honestly, I'm not here to argue with your opinions, but rather to simply express my own, which I am going to do whether you like it or not. And if all you can post is snarky, vapid replies devoid of merit or rationale in turn....well, if that gives you something to do, you go for it. Edited August 10, 2017 by Bobby L. Collins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PRPhan4ever Posted August 10, 2017 Author Share Posted August 10, 2017 (edited) Folks .... please, no animosity or denigrating comments! Here we are all equal, alumni, 'friends' (of sorts), adjudicators, teachers and musicians. My posting of this thread was merely to see the 'movement' away from marching drill as opposed to whatever it is being labeled/judged as now. After re-watching the Corps that many feel are Gods of 'creativity & pushing the envelope' I broke the shows of the past 2 years down and timed them as to what was happening IE: Minutes spent marching/playing simultaneously while moving at greater than walking, time spent playing while moving very slowly and time spent playing while stationary whether playing on, under, kneeling, sitting, laying on a 'prop' and... time spent moving while a voiceover/sample or pre-recorded music played and NOT playing. This year far exceeded last year... the time spent 'marching' while playing was at best far less than when there was movement while the battery played and others posed, danced or did misc body mvmnt in the interim. Of the little over 11 minutes, almost the entire 'intro' of one corps is just a few horns while they enter the field & then the ensemble joins in at/around 1 minute. The next two mins is a slow migration into stationary sets of triangles for the next 1.5 mins.... this continues in and throughout the show, and, the time where there is actually fast paced movement while playing is around 4 mins... all I am saying is our beloved activity has become far less concerned it seems with marching or providing 'whiplash drill' or drill that is spellbinding to watch, matches the show theme to a degree, and makes you gasp in awe in wonderment of "How do they/did they move like that while playing all those notes!" and rewarding the theatrical dance, interpretative productions we've seen the past 3-4 years for THAT in it's place. IMHO, I LOVE to watch some of these corps who defy athleticism while playing HUGE intricate passages in brass books while moving, as opposed to look.... we can play multiple toungued 16th notes while walking,sitting, standing etc, etc, etc. By the way, these show(s) NOTICE the S.... have more walking/posing/dancing/sitting/squatting as I alluded to while playing than actually moving and playing. Compare closers of the top 5... you'll see what I mean Edited August 10, 2017 by PRPhan4ever 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeN Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 1 hour ago, Bobby L. Collins said: That baseball analogy is a good one. If I were a 20 year old musician approached today and asked to participate in DCI, I would probably snicker and not-so-politely decline. I do a pretty good job looking like an absolute fool every single day of my life. I don't need to pay thousands of dollars and practice hundreds of hours, pushing my body and mind to their very limits in order to achieve the very same result in spandex tights on a football field. And had I been asked to do even 5% of the ridiculous stuff they do in DCI today when i marched, I would have just gone home. Of course, I didn't even like taking a knee during our ballad, or the handful of horn flashes we were instructed to perform. Maybe I was just a stick in the mud back then too. Sorry you don't like DCI these days. I think that pretty well sums it up. However, based on the successes of the last few years, in auditionees, new corps, increased attendance all across the country and massively increased exposure due to social media, I think DCI has found a pretty good path going forward both in style and substance. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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