ContraFart Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 The only perfect score of the night went to RCC in visual. I think that's ridiculous. I'm not asking for a tick system but why do people think I'm crazy for saying you don't deserve a perfect visual score IF SOMEONE FALLS DOWN???? RCC people are complaining that a single judge sunk them. If they won, Pulse would have had a better argument that a single judge saved RCC. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenoris4Jazz Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 1 hour ago, karuna said: Well said. Just to add to another miscomprehension: the other skater wasn't "perfect" . No performance (musical or otherwise) is "perfect". Human performance is dynamic, adaptive and expressive which by their very nature are contrary to "perfection". I beg to differ. Gymnasts perform routines on the vault which, by definition, can be performed "perfectly." Perfect runup, perfect springboard, perfect tumbling in the air, and stick the landing without a bobble. THAT IS A PERFECT PERFORMANCE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ContraFart Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 1 hour ago, karuna said: Well said. Just to add to another miscomprehension: the other skater wasn't "perfect" . No performance (musical or otherwise) is "perfect". Human performance is dynamic, adaptive and expressive which by their very nature are contrary to "perfection". When you have 2 groups at the very top neck and neck, something like a big fall should be a factor in the outcome. The fact that the group that had the major mistake still got a perfect score in visual IMO is wrong. I wouldn't care if the perfect score was in GE visual, but it makes no sense that the only perfect score of the night happened to be in visual performance and it happened to go to the group where there was a major fall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 (edited) 55 minutes ago, ContraFart said: When you have 2 groups at the very top neck and neck, something like a big fall should be a factor in the outcome. The fact that the group that had the major mistake still got a perfect score in visual IMO is wrong. I wouldn't care if the perfect score was in GE visual, but it makes no sense that the only perfect score of the night happened to be in visual performance and it happened to go to the group where there was a major fall. if all things were completely the same and equal you would be right and it could make a difference, BUT if they aren't even slightly then yes even a fall could render a so called perfect score, well actually not perfect but the highest score. Remember judges only work with so many numbers which is why maxing a number out doesn't mean perfect only that you run out of numbers. Not debating who should have been higher than another just how it possibly could happen. Also a " Major " error or mistake may not be considered major if it didn't contribute to other issues at the moment. Edited April 25, 2023 by GUARDLING 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 (edited) 12 hours ago, Tenoris4Jazz said: He didn't just have Pulse in 1st... he had them in first by a couple of points! That looks and smells really fishy, especially since Carmenates had RCC ahead in composition by 2 points where Howarth had them BEHIND by 2 points. That would have to be one of two things: judge disliked the music or the arrangement of RCC, or REALLY loved the stuff Pulse played. Similar thing happened to PR in '89. The percussion judge at finals had judged them one other time all year and both times gave them significantly lower scores. actually he had Pulse up by .8. the other judge had RCC up by .1. Average it and Pulse wins the sheet by .35 now look at the example I gave. visual judge 2 had MCM .1 over United. visual judge 1 had MCM up by 1.55 over United. averaged a .825 win on the sheet for MCM. and overall MCM beat United by .65. a far more obvious call than Pulse winning. Pulse was was at worst 3rd in ordinals and the spreads tight in all. RCC had some 4's in ordinals, and not just music...cause the music judge that had them 4th in performer had them 2nd in book. Phantom 89....can't complain about the percussion score. live and the recordings spell it out Edited April 25, 2023 by Jeff Ream Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 7 hours ago, TheOneWhoKnows said: I've been the lone judge that has called a show before. More than once actually. I can say as an adjudicator, I'm never intentionally trying to call a show, but in applying the criteria and what I saw that particularly night, I gave the scores I felt were justified and it has called the show in the end of it. I can also say that no judge ever actually wants to be the one that ends up calling a show. When you see the example provided, the sores being that close, the judges are saying either one of the top 2 could have won any given night. But on this night, Pulse won. Remember scores are a point in time, they aren't indicative of a larger success of a group. I think it's why it's more wise to award the caption awards at DCI based on the average and not the finals night score. and with a double panel, no judge is looking at the exact same thing the entire show. and WGi is very judge your sheet and the show of the day. Recaps aren't made public til after finals. I actually saw someone get called out by Mark online for posting their groups recap for their round....violation of 8.2 in the rulebook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 6 hours ago, ContraFart said: How on gods green Earth did RCC have one judge give a perfect visual score, WHEN A BASS DRUMMER FELL ON HER A$$??????? By definition it was not a perfect performance. a 10 is not perfection. i tmeans they maxed out the sheets criteria Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 3 hours ago, greg_orangecounty said: Right!? Where's the Tic system when you need it. whose tic is the right tic? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ContraFart Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 30 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said: a 10 is not perfection. i tmeans they maxed out the sheets criteria Can you really max out a visual sheet if you fall down? This isn't the GE visual score, it's the visual performance score. Is it really that far out to say you can't max out a sheet if you make a major error? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ContraFart Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 1 hour ago, GUARDLING said: if all things were completely the same and equal you would be right and it could make a difference, BUT if they aren't even slightly then yes even a fall could render a so called perfect score, well actually not perfect but the highest score. Remember judges only work with so many numbers which is why maxing a number out doesn't mean perfect only that you run out of numbers. Not debating who should have been higher than another just how it possibly could happen. Also a " Major " error or mistake may not be considered major if it didn't contribute to other issues at the moment. So if the judges only work with so many numbers, could it be possible the judge had that 20 on the sheet before RCC took the floor? I kept on hearing over and over again in 2015 that BD won because they had the better show of the night. Why doesn't it apply with this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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