scheherazadesghost Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 Asking v-s's to have made the right choice to correct the violations or protect others verges on victim blaming... or at very least contributes to its normalization. We are often not in the state of mind, nor do we have the capacity or social support to always do this. Educational spaces should know this and take it upon themselves to respond accordingly to accusations. Culpability (not legal, but actual.) I'll leave this here for further reading: https://www.sace.ca/learn/victim-blaming/ 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mello Dude Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 1 minute ago, Waxman said: I actually think BD's path forward here is pretty clear. Regardless of how any investigation will play out, this person can no longer be a contributing member of the corps; think about what this would look like for the remainder of the season. You'd have conflict within the corps between this person and their peers, and you'd have conflict between this person and the staff. You'd have parents calling up BD to ask them why their child is living with a predator. You'd have journalists showing up to rehearsals trying to cover the story, and people filming and harassing this person in the lot. Even if this person were hypothetically completely innocent of any wrongdoing, the remainder of the season would be a terrible experience for them and everyone they're marching with. The best immediate action the corps can take is to send this person home. AND...set yourself up for a HUGE lawsuit. No you are putting the cart before the horse. Everyone is innocent until proven guilty. I don't want to consider living in the hell where someone can simply accuse and do this to anyone. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scheherazadesghost Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 5 minutes ago, Waxman said: Even if this person were hypothetically completely innocent of any wrongdoing, the remainder of the season would be a terrible experience for them and everyone they're marching with. And don't get me wrong, this potentiality really really stinks. But as I argued earlier in this thread, the adverse affects of a false accusation are not the same as denying a victim who is telling the truth. Not by a long shot in most cases, based on statistical and all available qualitative data. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mello Dude Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 2 minutes ago, scheherazadesghost said: Asking v-s's to have made the right choice to correct the violations or protect others verges on victim blaming... or at very least contributes to its normalization. We are often not in the state of mind, nor do we have the capacity or social support to always do this. Educational spaces should know this and take it upon themselves to respond accordingly to accusations. Culpability (not legal, but actual.) I'll leave this here for further reading: https://www.sace.ca/learn/victim-blaming/ Sorry, you don't get to be the in house expert on someone asking a question if someone followed procedures that they signed when they joined BC. If they (BC) don't know HOW can they do anything about the situation? I REFUSE to let you lord over people asking questions that need to be asked. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waxman Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 1 minute ago, Mello Dude said: AND...set yourself up for a HUGE lawsuit. No you are putting the cart before the horse. Everyone is innocent until proven guilty. I don't want to consider living in the hell where someone can simply accuse and do this to anyone. You are innocent until proven guilty in a court of law, and yes I 100% am on board with that. I'm not passing judgement here because I don't know these people and I wasn't there. I'm not a lawyer but I seriously doubt that you could successfully sue the Blue Devils for sending a member home; members get sent home all the time. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cappybara Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 Just now, Waxman said: You are innocent until proven guilty in a court of law, and yes I 100% am on board with that. I'm not passing judgement here because I don't know these people and I wasn't there. I'm not a lawyer but I seriously doubt that you could successfully sue the Blue Devils for sending a member home; members get sent home all the time. Agreed. The lawsuit would be thrown out, a private organization is not a court of law. With that said, I find the idea of just throwing individuals out who are accused without any sort of process quite ridiculous 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mello Dude Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 1 minute ago, Waxman said: You are innocent until proven guilty in a court of law, and yes I 100% am on board with that. I'm not passing judgement here because I don't know these people and I wasn't there. I'm not a lawyer but I seriously doubt that you could successfully sue the Blue Devils for sending a member home; members get sent home all the time. In this country you can get sued over making a sandwich. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scheherazadesghost Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 3 minutes ago, Mello Dude said: AND...set yourself up for a HUGE lawsuit. No you are putting the cart before the horse. Everyone is innocent until proven guilty. I don't want to consider living in the hell where someone can simply accuse and do this to anyone. We are not in the court of law. These are private organizations that can remove people for any reason they like. And defamation only has standing when the accuser is lying. Going public like this is not usually what liars do. It's what desperate victims do when they feel they have no other recourse. Fear of retaliation and defamation are a big reason it's all gotten this bad. I'm willing to discuss those situations, but there are for more situations sitting in my inbox and files that point to there being unchecked predators than false accusations. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scheherazadesghost Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 2 minutes ago, Cappybara said: Agreed. The lawsuit would be thrown out, a private organization is not a court of law. With that said, I find the idea of just throwing individuals out who are accused without any sort of process quite ridiculous This activity has a storied history of denylisting members for far less. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waxman Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 Just now, Cappybara said: Agreed. The lawsuit would be thrown out, a private organization is not a court of law. With that said, I find the idea of just throwing individuals out who are accused without any sort of process quite ridiculous What would that process look like? I'm not really sure what tools they have at their disposal that would allow them to verify sexual assault allegations during the final weeks of a drum corps season. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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