Visual Design Impact on the Masses

[Matt_S]

Well now, I'm not saying eliminate tosses. I like the effect of a great line toss as much as anyone, and I want to see those stay. The only thing I question is why we're still tossing rifles. Malibu mentioned the weight as being one reason, but we don't need a rifle per se to achieve that. We've already ditched real rifles, these days we pretty much toss and spin blocks of wood to begin with, so why stick with the rifle shape?

[Orpheus]

We've already ditched real rifles, these days we pretty much toss and spin blocks of wood to begin with, so why stick with the rifle shape?

Same reason we wear uniforms and silly hats with feathers in them, play on bell-front brass instruments, and sing our corps song before we hit the field.

[Matt_S]

Heh, touche

[HornlineDiva]

I guess guard caption heads choose to use rifle-shaped objects to spin because that is what they are familiar with.... there would be slight differences in hand work and whatnot, and unless the tech/instructor had experience with that shape, it would be hard to teach. It's just easier to teach what you know.

Plus, I'm sure custom "rifles" would be costly.

One of my best friends is a guard choreographer in Indiana, and he told me once that he spun things very similar to the green "rifles" they used in Blast!. I love the look of those things, but he said they were difficult to spin because of very, very slight differences in weight and hand placement. It took adapting, and that takes time that most groups just don't have, when they could just be using equipment they're already proficient in.

I'm going to throw something out there.... why on earth do we use sabers? I just don't think they're worth the time it takes to teach them. They're fantastic for winter guard, but you can't really see them on a football field, especially in the box. I love rifles, and I think they offer a nice masculine vibe to counter the femininity of flag work, but I just don't like sabers in drum corps. That's just my opinion, though.

[visualjellyfish]

I guess guard caption heads choose to use rifle-shaped objects to spin because that is what they are familiar with.... there would be slight differences in hand work and whatnot, and unless the tech/instructor had experience with that shape, it would be hard to teach. It's just easier to teach what you know.

Plus, I'm sure custom "rifles" would be costly.

One of my best friends is a guard choreographer in Indiana, and he told me once that he spun things very similar to the green "rifles" they used in Blast!. I love the look of those things, but he said they were difficult to spin because of very, very slight differences in weight and hand placement. It took adapting, and that takes time that most groups just don't have, when they could just be using equipment they're already proficient in.

I'm going to throw something out there.... why on earth do we use sabers? I just don't think they're worth the time it takes to teach them. They're fantastic for winter guard, but you can't really see them on a football field, especially in the box. I love rifles, and I think they offer a nice masculine vibe to counter the femininity of flag work, but I just don't like sabers in drum corps. That's just my opinion, though.

I agree with your earlier statements.

But I can answer your questions about sabre as a person who loves to spin it. From the box, you can see sabres if they are taped. And the color guard eye can see them from afar when they are not taped (but I defintely see your point!)

I know that I spin sabre for the challenge. And truthfully, sabres are just as good of an example of femininity in color guard as flags IMHO (but that's a whole 'nother touchy subject.) Sabres are the other weapon. A piece of equipment with some balls...and the most difficult to master. You can't just muscle it around like a rifle and get away with some points. Your body must look good too...meaning because the sabre is so much thinner and smaller, more of the body is seen...and the body that is seen must look good (and in an ensemble...must be similar.)

But to stay on topic...I think we spin sabre and won't give it up because we love it for its challenge and beauty.

[deftguy]

I guess it's because I never stopped doing guard. I either, march, judge or teach and have been every year since 1975. NO, I wouldn't say I'm an accomplished dancer but I do try in order to "keep up with the Jones." Not only that, but being an indoor guard judge as well as a visual judge, I have to open my mind to many possibilities.

I know guys that marched with you in Cavies and they are still out on the floor.....doing what all the other guards are doing too. I bet you could do it too if you tried. B)

Actually Malibu, I did try. I was good at the movement half because in the Cavaliers that was what we were all about, movement with good equipment work. But actual dance modern or ballet was not meant for weight lifters who's body structure and proportions does not lend itself to great lines. Also, because of my weight, putting all of my weight on one leg and stay in balance is pretty hard, and something I have to continually work on. Dancing is not fun, movement is king to me, good equipment work rules them all.

[palladio]

To me, it all pretty much comes down to tradition, and why bother changing something that has been extremely successful in the last several years? Because we stick to rifles and sabres, another piece of equipment being introduced really brings a special touch to that unit as is. Therefore, if every single colorguard out there had different pieces of equipment instead of the traditional, it becomes a lot less impactful to see a foreign object on the field.

I am a big fan of innovation and change, but I love the preservation of the weapons as-is. It becomes something to look at objectively when comparing units, as well. Such as, when I think of Blessed Sacrament, I think of their very solid sabre line. When I think of Northern Lights, I think of how successful their all-rifle features are. But I can also think of how Pacific Crest's winterguard used coat racks very effectively to illustrate their Vivaldi's Winter theme, and it's not something you see every day.

Edited October 17, 2005 by palladio

[SBrancheau]

Hey Matt, why are drum corps playing contras instead of Sousaphones?

I agree with deftguy...it's all about the equipment work for me. I could give a rat's *** whether the guard can arabesque into a tendu. That's for indoors, where there aren't holes and dips in the marching surface.

When the emoting and ballet troupe entered the field disguised as a "guard" is when I left.

That goes for high school guards, too.

[visualjellyfish]

Color guards emoting began the moment that first guard decided to slice into different planes and add a little bit of fluidity into their work. Ballet dance technique was added later...and for that matter not all that artfully. Dance within drum corps and color guard has become its own form of dance...that has is intentions rooted in formal dance technique...but not so solidly that color guards could be called technically proficient. This is where I think one problem lies. Not only can injuries occur due to incorrect training...but ineffetiveness in performance.

I only wish that I could perform high mark time, right shoulders and slams in contemporary drum corps. I'm sure I'm not alone in that. But as a contemporary performer in the activity, I have to accept that I can't "march" like my brothers and sisters in the corps proper, and that I must be able to dance.

But I have to stick up for what dance adds to performance value. With a stiff body and face, how far can a color guard go in portraying dismay, anger, joy...and other more complex moods? They color guard's job is to enhance visual performace. We have come far from our roots...but I can't agree that equipment work is all that much more important than the movement of the body in contemporary guards.

[palladio]

I only wish that I could perform high mark time, right shoulders and slams in contemporary drum corps. I'm sure I'm not alone in that. But as a contemporary performer in the activity, I have to accept that I can't "march" like my brothers and sisters in the corps proper, and that I must be able to dance.

As someone who did a lot of this in their show this summer, I'm someone who tends to cringe at the thought! :P

But I have to stick up for what dance adds to performance value. With a stiff body and face, how far can a color guard go in portraying dismay, anger, joy...and other more complex moods? They color guard's job is to enhance visual performace. We have come far from our roots...but I can't agree that equipment work is all that much more important than the movement of the body in contemporary guards.

They can't. Because, as I've been able to tell, emoting wasn't the point when it was slams and double-time.

Have you ever encountered injuries to to insufficient dance training? I only ask because I've actually never really encountered them myself, and I've been actively involved since 99 (not long at all, I know), but I've actually never seen it.

However, I do agree with you that colorguard dance has become it's own, in a way. It blends all kinds of styles and just kind of makes some things up. I can't even count how many times I've heard one of my instructors say something along the lines of how "This isn't real dance, it's guard-dance."