Making vocals work in drum corps...

[bawker]

"Ave Satani", eh, ~G~?

Man, that would be one ###### show. :)

[arrangerx]

Wordless vocals as a color. . . (Metheny, Vangelis, Enya, countless others)

Poetry that helps define an idea. . .

Classic quotes that instantly define the nature of the performance. . .

These all have yet to be explored in Drum Corps.

We've heard amateurish attempts at narration. . . and semi-amateurish singing with words. . . and the first attempt at something effect-oriented with the young lady in the Cadets pit last year.

Drumspeak is hardly new to the music world. . . and will run its course in DCI before moving on to the next cool thing (percussion ALWAYS has the next big cool thing just around the corner!)

Think color. . . think blend. . . think message. . . and voice will make sense.

It took a few years to figure out Bb/F. . . and a few to see how the pit could be expanded, posted and blend in to the overall production. Voice will make the transition. . . because the people who arrange and compose for drum corps are good (or even great) musicians, with the drive to make it work.

Anyway. . . needed to flush those thoughts out of my brain before moving on. . .

Edited February 2, 2006 by man of the ages

[GMichael1230]

Yes, the vocals need to be undefined. They need to enhance, or back up the main reason we are there, never overpower the brass or percussion or take the place of playing. dont say "aqua" set the mood, working in tandem with the bras line and make us feel "aqua" ......give us goosebumps, dont male us feel we are at amatue night at the eighth grade play.

~G~

[Sideways]

Scouts '93 was an incredibly well integrated vocal. Boston in 2000 fit in great with that show. VK '88 during the percussion feature!!! #### I didn't even mind (not necessarily saying I liked it...) BD's narration that much this past summer since their was some serious #### going on underneath it.

[felixh]

Well.. as a trained and semi-professional singer, I'd only argue the level of excellence and execution with you.. and that could take years. I will say this, however: It takes upwards of ten years to properly train a voice to that level of execution and excellence you expect out of drum corps.. I believe there are members who are at or approaching that point and utilizing them in conjunction with brass and percussion -- not as a featured effect but as an additional effect -- could be quite stunning and out of this world ground-breaking.

We haven't seen it yet. Doing what's been done so far is just dipping the toe in the pool (with the possible exception of the Bluecoats this past year .. I thought the tabla {sp?} was fantastic).. and quite honestly I think what has been done so far has also been quite predictable. Hey.. let's sing some cool broadway harmonies.. hey.. let's rap.. hey.. let's drumspeak (and yes, I know the tabla could fall into that category.. I don't consider it part of that category because it expanded my knowledge of an idiom I thought I was pretty well versed in).. hey.. let's narrate. All done relatively well -- even though there were hiccups now and then.. but all done effectively within the context of the shows they were a part of, IMO.

I'd prefer to see some corps.. or some composer out there.. actually compose something utilizing voice as though it were an instrument in the choir of "voices" already on the field. Think like Copland. Even his folk songs were written in a way that the voice is treated like one of the instruments.. it's not music accompanying voice.. it's voice as part of the composition -- it's more of a "duet" between orchestra or ensemble or piano and voice. Make it so the voice is incorporated into the composition and adds a texture to the music -- almost so that I wonder to myself "what instrument is doing that?" but in a good way -- and make it so that my focus is NOT drawn from the overall production to watch one solo singer/speaker or a small singing/speaking ensemble. I would find THAT ground-breaking.

That's why I'm so fond of the Bluecoats' use of tabla.. I didn't find myself watching the pit when they were chanting.. I didn't have my attention pulled away from the rest of the corps while they did their thing.. I looked.. but they were still playing so I could go back to just hearing it and watching the rest of the show.

In other words.. treat vocals in drum corps as a tool, not a gimmick.

Stef

Keeping in the spirit of the thread and with tongue in cheek I say Stef has the best response so far..."I'd prefer to see some corps.. or some composer out there.. actually compose something utilizing voice as though it were an instrument in the choir of "voices" already on the field. Think like Copland. Even his folk songs were written in a way that the voice is treated like one of the instruments.. it's not music accompanying voice.. it's voice as part of the composition -- it's more of a "duet" between orchestra or ensemble or piano and voice. Make it so the voice is incorporated into the composition and adds a texture to the music." ....although I NEVER agree with Stef, I do agree that if a masterful composer can somehow weave the vocals into the overall musical production I indeed would lend and ear...it would have to be tasteful and not akward.... B)

[bawker]

Wordless vocals as a color. . . (Metheny, Vangelis, Enya, countless others)

Poetry that helps define an idea. . .

Classic quotes that instantly define the nature of the performance. . .

Think color. . . think blend. . . think message. . . and voice will make sense.

It took a few years to figure out Bb/F. . . and a few to see how the pit could be expanded, posted and blend in to the overall production. Voice will make the transition. . . because the people who arrange and compose for drum corps are good (or even great) musicians, with the drive to make it work.

Anyway. . . needed to flush those thoughts out of my brain before moving on. . .

I appreciate the expert input.

Wordless vocals...the more I think about it, the more it could be a nice enhancement.

I grew up with the alternative music of the 90's (dating myself here :P ), and a big part of some of it was something called "dreampop" with bands like Slowdive, My Bloody Valentine, Lush and so on ( which I alluded to earlier in another post), which featured a lot of wordless vocals mixed...almost submerged...within the instruments on the tracks.

If I had a sound clip I would link it, but if anyone remembers back that far, there's a song called "Light From A Dead Star" by the band Lush (album's called Split) that totally conveys what I'm getting at.

I see this and the whole Enya, Vangelis, Metheny (Mcferrin, even?) as something that could work...and work well within the confines of the idiom. That also brings in a lot of the choral works out there, given you have talented enough kids. That's a big key in general, that we get performers that match those on snares and trumpets with their talent...otherwise the product comes off as, well, like you said, "amateurish".

Poetry....quotes...well, time will have to tell with those with me. Those appear (at least IMO) to not be as seamless to intergrate into a show without destroying the moment you've built. The connection with the audience is a fragile thing, and these seem like they're too intrusive to that.

...but that's why I started the thread...to see if maybe they can't be in the future.

B)

Edited February 2, 2006 by bawker

[GMichael1230]

Use music of groups like "Swing out Sister" or "art of noise" .......design whole shows around that !!!

~G~

[Morgoth Bauglir]

For any of this to work, we are going to need real vocalists. We have plenty of high school and college horn players and drummer trying out on their instruments in drum corps. Corps are going to need to go after true vocalists to set the same standards. That means no more pit or horn members being the vocalists. It just sounds bad. I would hate to see the soprano soloist or some guard chick start trying to rip notes on a marching snare drum for part of the show. Corps will need to audition specifically for vocal musicians with real vocal instructors to make the cuts and teach throughout the summer. If the whole corps is going to do those non-word vocal sounds for anything more than a quick effect, they need to have a professional teaching them how to do it as well.

The same thing with electronics. Now that all this is here, it needs to be done well. DCI really got themselves in deep when they allowed this stuff. And for the next decade or so we are going to have a lot of corps fumblinging around with bad ideas presented poorly, until they can really get some experiance. Corps have been using brass and percussion for years, and have got it down. Vocals and electronics are new and are gonna keep sounding bad for a while. I just hope it turns out to be worth it.

[GMichael1230]

For any of this to work, we are going to need real vocalists. We have plenty of high school and college horn players and drummer trying out on their instruments in drum corps. Corps are going to need to go after true vocalists to set the same standards. That means no more pit or horn members being the vocalists. It just sounds bad. I would hate to see the soprano soloist or some guard chick start trying to rip notes on a marching snare drum for part of the show. Corps will need to audition specifically for vocal musicians with real vocal instructors to make the cuts and teach throughout the summer. If the whole corps is going to do those non-word vocal sounds for anything more than a quick effect, they need to have a professional teaching them how to do it as well.

The same thing with electronics. Now that all this is here, it needs to be done well. DCI really got themselves in deep when they allowed this stuff. And for the next decade or so we are going to have a lot of corps fumblinging around with bad ideas presented poorly, until they can really get some experiance. Corps have been using brass and percussion for years, and have got it down. Vocals and electronics are new and are gonna keep sounding bad for a while. I just hope it turns out to be worth it.

Thats why I said it will never work. Dream and suggest all you (we) want but the bottom line, its drum and bugle corps. Kids try out or desire to play drums or brass, or spin equipment, not join a glee club.

~G~

[bawker]

Thats why I said it will never work. Dream and suggest all you (we) want but the bottom line, its drum and bugle corps. Kids try out or desire to play drums or brass, or spin equipment, not join a glee club.

~G~

...but if there is an active pursuit of the vocal major by audition ( instead of like G-Cym said, just working with whatever ya got), then the talent level will increase.

I'm going to hope that's the case with the Cadets this year. Frankly, given what we expect from the other members of corps, it darn well should be the case across the board.

You're certainly right, though, G....Finals isn't the local high school production of "Grease" or "Brigadoon" for mommy and daddy; it's about nailing it to the wall every night.