mikemey Posted September 8, 2005 Share Posted September 8, 2005 it was reassuring to see how fast that second ambulance responded for the Cab member. although, i dont know if anyone else noticed (or was as angry as i was) when some type of field official tried waving off the ambulance as it came in the gates and it proceeded to fly across, not next to but ACROSS the field with its sirens blaring and lights flashing during the renegades performance. you think someone in that type of possition (the driver) would realize that if someone is waving him off thats gotta mean he's not needed. as far as driving across the field with sirens and lights on, yes it could have been an emergency more important than interrupting a show, but what about the risk of running someone over???? wreckless, irresponsible, and disrespectful to say the least! i will give my compliments to the renegades for not letting it interrupt their performance, you guys did a great job, and i cant wait to see what you bring to the table in '06 ! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> They are trained that they are to follow the last instructions they received via their dispatch center. If they're told to slow down, they slow down. If they're told they're not needed, they go home. In any event, there should have been a Moosic cop in touch with the Rig. I wasn't there, and didn't see it. However, any bystander's actions to slow them down or stop them will generally be disregarded. They have no way of knowing who or what this person is doing, and, if they follow this person's direction, and, for whatever reason, the patient is hurt worse because of it, the EMT's on the rig are liable. Did they have to come screaming down the back gate and onto the field? Probably not. They should have been extra cautious given the nature of the event. But we don't know what they were told, and, given the circumstances of the evening, probably decided that they would rather be loud than invisible. One other point. They (The ambulance) was coming in from behind the stadium, with the majority of the performers backs to them. Perhaps they didn't want anyone hurt by them, which is why they rolled with the sirens blaring. Not cool for the spectator, but not cool either if a performer got hit because the rig was there and nobody knew it. DCA shouldn't have let the Renegades go on until the Cabs member was properly tended to. But that's my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbriggs Posted September 8, 2005 Share Posted September 8, 2005 Meatloaf was Friday night. There was an AED there and it was used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomPeashey Posted September 8, 2005 Share Posted September 8, 2005 wow... where to start... this thread is just abound with rumors guesses and misinformation... first of all - DCA was not responsible for the medical support - the sponsor was and the DCA officials were surprised that the fulfillment of their contract could have happened without an actual ambulance. The contract reads "adequate emergency medical services" as for all the crap about PA requiring medical services - what they require were there... however, someone decided that they should be situated in the stadium first aid room. DCA was told that it was a cold night minimizing the chances of heat prostration and that there were a lot more people in the stands than on the field. Most of us would disagree and ALL of us would disagree after what happened - BUT - there was no choice but to run the show and hope they were right... second - what's all this defibulator stuff... the ems brought the defib unit onto the field long before the ambulance arrived... probably within 2 minutes of his going down... they were thumping him right in front of all of us... how would DCA owning an amateur unit have bettered that? so let's review what REALLY happened... EMS was located in an inconvenient spot for members on the field - I agree however... facts are: A nurse was performing cpr within seconds A medical doctor from the stands joined her within seconds The EMT's from the first aid room brought a portable professional defib unit onto the field and it was used numerous times... The first ambulance arrived and more defibulation occured. no response The Medic unit arrived and another defibulation unit was used... to no avail... I hope that if I ever have a massive heart attack I have this kind of care and chance at life... fact is... he never had a chance and all his friends know it. Our fondest condolences go out to the Kilties and Joel's family... I'm told by all that he was a great guy... As for the Cab guy... it was simple hyperventilation and was diagnosed as such immediately... the person in the audience who called 911 should be told to let the professionals decide next time... and as for the JOCKEY driving the ambulance.... my brother - who is the President of a PA Ambulance Club and an instructor for EMT's and drivers... said he would fire the guy instantly... he was far more of a danger than a simple case of drum corps hyperventilation. out of respect to Joel "Lothar" Magnuson, his family and the Kilties - let's drop this right now and let them grieve... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill_VA Posted September 8, 2005 Share Posted September 8, 2005 I must agree with Tom Peashey. Someone was with Joel as soon as humanly possible. Both persons were seasoned professionals and all that could be done for Joel was done. It was stated to me from a cardiologist that if you have an arrest your chances of survival are near zero (defib or not -- Ambulance or not). It was litterally the longest 40 minutes of mine and I am sure the rest of everyone elses life. I am 48 years old, and to see this happen around me shocked me to my core and it took a lot for me to hold it together during and after the ordeal. I honestly cannot remember the last time I felt this level of sadness and despair. My deepest condolence to Joel's family and to the Kilties Organization!!! It must be noted that the EMS folks were in the stadium! They came down as fast as humanly possible once they knew of the situation. They had all of their equipment with them. It is understandable that everyone who was present to the situation wanted every possible support for Joel to be there instantly. But how long do you think it would have taken to get the proper medical personnel to him if he was at a practice field or not anywhere near the stadium? As for the Cab member who needed some support, HE said he did not want any ambulance or extra support (he knew what the problem was) but the EMT overreacted when calling in the Ambulance, so it was natural that the Ambulance driver might be a little too reactive to the call. It was tragic, sad, and a little scary situation. We have not had a medical situation anywhere like this in DCA's history (as far as I know). Let's not overreact and allow the organizations review the situation and determine the best course of action (if needed). Just my opinion! Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
84BDsop Posted September 8, 2005 Share Posted September 8, 2005 If any corps ends up having a portable defib unit at practices because of this, at least some good will have come out of it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loud_lancer Posted September 8, 2005 Share Posted September 8, 2005 Did they have to come screaming down the back gate and onto the field? Probably not. They should have been extra cautious given the nature of the event. But we don't know what they were told, and, given the circumstances of the evening, probably decided that they would rather be loud than invisible.One other point. They (The ambulance) was coming in from behind the stadium, with the majority of the performers backs to them. Perhaps they didn't want anyone hurt by them, which is why they rolled with the sirens blaring. Not cool for the spectator, but not cool either if a performer got hit because the rig was there and nobody knew it. Well, I was on the field and can tell you that those of us in the hornline had no idea there was an ambulance coming at us, siren and all. All our auditory focus was on the music. (Think about it. Renegades hornline vs. pitiful siren. Who's louder? ^0^ ) I didn't know about the ambulance until I'd turned in the drill and saw it in the endzone. It's entirely possible that it could've hit us if we had marched into its path. I understand it scared the heck out of our honor guard captain watching it drive right towards them -- and knowing they can't move. But hey, we're used to chaos, as someone pointed out. Although we were relieved that we didn't get penalized for having electronics & motor vehicles on the field. As a result, Lee's already thinking on how to have the Goodyear Blimp "accidently" land in our show next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camel lips Posted September 8, 2005 Share Posted September 8, 2005 My recollection of the events are a bit different from what I am reading here.I am sure there will be more information forthcoming in the future. As to the second ambulance coming on to the field???? I will never second guess those guys.WE don't know what they were told.They had a call of a man down to answer to.Let us remember they just got through answering a call of a man that died on the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF-LowBari Posted September 8, 2005 Author Share Posted September 8, 2005 Tom, thank you for the response it was more detailed than I could hope for. The purpose of this thread was to try to get real information and counteract the guesses that have been going on since. IMO, your post has done that so I will request to have this thread closed. But I do want to clear up a point about the siren being used coming thru the back gate of the stadium. From where we sat we could see that the ambulance was making a blind corner and couldn't see what (or who) might have been on the other side. Same reason sirens are used at intersections, warning to anyone who can't see them coming. Thanks to all for the information, hope this helps someone else in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camel lips Posted September 8, 2005 Share Posted September 8, 2005 Tom, thank you for the response it was more detailed than I could hope for. The purpose of this thread was to try to get real information and counteract the guesses that have been going on since. IMO, your post has done that so I will request to have this thread closed. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I don't see any reason to close this thread.Tom's viewpoint was simply his observations of that night. Perhaps there are other people out there that know more about this and just haven't chimed in on it yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-horns Posted September 8, 2005 Share Posted September 8, 2005 (edited) Tom, thank you for the response it was more detailed than I could hope for. The purpose of this thread was to try to get real information and counteract the guesses that have been going on since. IMO, your post has done that so I will request to have this thread closed. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I agree. Out of respect for the Kilties organization and Joel's family, please close this thread. Edited September 8, 2005 by G-horns Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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