scottgordon

I don't need to recognize the music, nor do I expect to. Most of my favorite shows contained music that I learned from seeing the corps. What I object to are the arrangements, in which the pieces are chopped up so much to fit the visuals that the musical forms are incomplete and don't get a chance to start, develop, and finish naturally. There also isn't as much groove - as though repetition (essential for a good groove) is believed to reduce demand. As a musician, I know that building a good groove is one of the hardest things to achieve. I hardly ever hear it in drumcorps anymore, although it was a hallmark of corps in the 70s and 80s - a corps could whip a crowd into a frenzy just like a good southern church choir with a groove that would build and build. Sure it wasn't as clean as today, but in that way it was a more intense experience. Just my opinion.

I never marched corps. But I was a rabid spectator starting in the early 1970s. There is no question that the corps today are excellent, work harder than ever, are more professional in their efforts, and are amazing technically. Sadly, I am just not moved by the music these days. The visuals are awesome, no doubt. But I always went for the music, and I'm not saying that it's "bad" today... it just doesn't attract me. It's arranged differently - around the visual design rather than to stand on its own. That's the way it is, which is fine, but unfortunately it doesn't do it for me. The music today in corps is very, VERY interesting. But it doesn't make me cry like the music did in the 70s and 80s. I miss that. So I don't really go to shows anymore. Well, I do go to DCA finals... the quality isn't as high as junior corps, but it's more musically inviting to me. Please understand that I'm not passing judgement. You asked, and I'm answering honestly. If junior corps thinks that it is going in the right artistic direction, they have every right to their choice - after all, they're the ones putting in all the effort and the money. And should the pendulum ever swing back to music-based show design, I'll be back.

Just out of curiosity (and this is just another rhetorical question) - how do we know that? What you say may be (I'm guessing probably is) true now. But how would we know that going into the future? Is there any oversight or data collected on injuries? (I actually don't know the answer to that question - just asking)

Thanks for taking the time to post with your firsthand experience. Although I'm not sure what specifically you are recommending relative to the original post... are you saying there /should/ or /shouldn't/ be a plan for stopping a show if a member is seriously injured?

But most other athletic activities change their rules from time to time to make them safer. The uneven parallel bars (in gymnastics) completely changed the orientation of the bars after the routines were becoming too wildly unsafe. Rules in football are being continually modified, such as with regards to the amount and type of contact allowed. Are you saying drumcorps should never change its rules in the interests of safety?

This is a different question, but... presuming that drills continue to evolve in the direction they have, would the activity eventually reach a point where the rules would have to be changed - because being competitive means designing shows that are too dangerous?

But this is a completely different situation. A medical emergency in some random scenario, like on a roadside, is impossible to predict and prepare for. At a big drumcorps show there is an ambulance and medical folks on hand - there is a presumption that medical assistance might be needed. Having a situation at a drumcorps show where judges or non-medical staff end up moving an injured person could indicate that the event was inadequately prepared for something they should have been prepared for and could have easily dealt with properly. I'm not sure your average judge or jury is going to be entirely sympathetic with the claim that it is impossible to stop a marching band show because it would be too dangerous to do so (rightly or wrongly).

What if it wasn't a leg/knee injury, but a blow to the head? or neck injury? In such cases, intervening quickly and properly is crucial. The judge isn't a medical professional. In any athletic endevour - and DCI shows these days are certainly athletic - there needs to be appropriate medical procedures in place in the event of participant injury. Just having whomever happens to walk by providing diagnosis, or even worse moving an injured person, is a lawsuit waiting to happen. It sounds from the posts on this thread that this is a conversation that is long overdue.

How about if the corps, as part of the show, were to actually hypnotize the audience, or the judges? If the former, they could get the fans to cheer their corps and boo the other corps. If the latter, they could get the judges to give them higher scores.

Laser light show, fountains, robots, holgraphic marching members... it's all inevitable.

One possible way around this would be to put both the audio and video on separate tracks, un-synched, on the DVD. Because, it is getting easier and easier for consumers to synch up different tracks themselves. (This doesn't always work with the CD, because some of the CDs have been time compressed).

In my opinon, corps today makes you think, but corps 30 years ago made you cry.

Maybe this is a stupid question... why doesn't BDC appear in the DCI rankings? Haven't they competed in a couple of Open class contests?

It's interesting how people can fill 24 pages of posts discussing what a corps is doing, what makes them great, what their faults are, what place they are going to come in, their fans, their detractors, etc. etc., and pretty much never mention anything about the music they play. I wonder if some people get so wrapped up in the competition that they don't stop and consider whether or not they enjoy the music.

VIP seating was $30. Indeed, the stadium is among the worst, if not the worst drumcorps venues I've ever been in. Sight lines are poor, with low seating. The sound is without question the worst, with even big corps sounding anemic. My fiance said there were 3 toilets total. Getting around is difficult with only a couple of narrow staircases out of the stands -- I'm amazed it passes fire code. And the scaffolding supports look like they could collapse at any minute. The only good thing was the variety of food was reasonably interesting, and parking was excellent. But for enjoying the shows, ugh. I also heard that the university made things difficult beforehand with a lot of rules - for example, the corps weren't allowed to roll the keyboards on the track. And then after all the grief they don't even turn the lights on. Sac City College, who used to host Sound Expo, by contrast, has one of the best drumcorps stadiums anywhere. I'd love to see the Moonlight Classic go there. All the corps sounded huge!

I am a professor at Sacramento State University (the host campus for this show), and I have to say that this sort of thing happens all the time here. The more sophisticated and expensive things get here, the more beaurocratic and unreliable they also have become. I frequently run evening and weekend student events in which the promised A/C doesn't materialize, or the parking passes don't show up, or the building doesn't get unlocked. And then nobody can do anything about it because everything has to be scheduled in some computer weeks in advance. Parking costs SIX TIMES as much here as at the local JC's, and yet parking service here is non-existent. Don't get me wrong, I love Sac State. But honestly, I'd never hold a major external event on this campus - you just can't trust that the basic deliverables will be there. I would be much more confident with any of the neighboring junior colleges, or even a high school.

Looking back on high school band, we had something that happened every year that I now wonder whether or not it was hazing. I don't think so, but in hindsight, I can see how hazing can grow out of something small and develop in an insidious way. Here's the story... Every year the jazz band went to the Reno Jazz Festival. Rather than stay in a hotel, we stayed in someone's home. That's right, the whole band - slept on floors throughout the house. Five of us were assigned to sleep outside in a trailer the homeowner had. One of the guys had to go to the bathroom, so he left the trailer and went in the house. The rest of us, in the meantime, found these foam rubber baseball bats in a closet in the trailer, and hid them under our sheets. When he returned and had stripped to his underwear, we (pretending to be asleep), jumped out of our sleeping bags and "attacked" him with the foam bats. We had no intention of hurting him, just surprising him. Quite to OUR surprise, he ran outside of the trailer, at which point, we promptly locked the door. Through the window, we said we would let him back in if he ran once around the block. Again, we had no intention of holding him to this (Reno in March still has snow on the ground). But to our surprise, he immediately took off around the block. When he returned, we felt so bad for him, that we each took turns running around the block in our underwear too. Needless to say, the next day the whole band learned of what we did. The next year, everyone wanted to be assigned the trailer... and the proviso was that anyone assigned to the trailer would have to make the trip around the block. What makes it "not-hazing" - I think - yet - is that so many people wanted to be in the trailer specifically so they could be one of the ones to go through the famous run around the block. Of course, anyone assigned to the trailer that had already done the run, didn't have to do it again. This to me was all great fun, and a great bonding memory. But I could see how such innocent fun could grow little-by-little if not kept in control, and eventually become hazing. I wonder if a some hazing rituals start this way. The other, even more memorable story of those trips, was that a neighbor of that house had a full-size lion as a pet, which owner took for walks around the neighborhood every morning. I mean full-out huge lion - big mane and tail, the works. It was very old and docile. This was a normal residential neighborhood! The kids noticed the lion and immediately went to see it - the owner allowing the kids to pet it. The band director nearly had a heart attack when she looked out the window and saw the band kids petting a lion... I learned that years later - she said the first thing that went through her mind was: "my career is over".

What a great find! Outstanding!

Didn't say I agreed, just said I thought it was funny. That's funny too!

Oh, and the funniest quote I heard: The guy sitting next to me said he stopped going to DCI shows about 5 years ago, when DCI had become "navel gazing".

Old thread, but I thought I'd follow up... Had an awesome time at my first DCA championship. Everyone was nice, and it was so SO fantastic to see and hear all-acoustic in your face drumcorps again -- first time in how many years now? I enjoyed everything, if I had to list the most memorable moments, then: - Minnesota Brass, wow! The best drumcorps show and performance I've seen in several years, period! - Empire Statesmen, haven't seen such an extreme high energy hyped show since... hmmm, maybe ever? - Caballeros Alumni, now THAT is drumcorps! I could watch them over and over. - Caballeros Sr. - best guard uniforms of the night. - I loved how so many of the drum majors addressed the crowd. - Bridgemen, loved the donuts as distraction for the policeman. :) - Retreat - when they announced Tampa Bay and the first thunder clap hit as if on cue. - Dinosaur ribs... but it was the spicy catfish and cajun corn that I'll never forget. It was great seeing everyone appreciating the effort all corps were putting in to entertain the crowd. DCI has become so dour, this was really fun. I'll be back.

I'm not sure about the Legacy series, but since they were taken from television broadcasts that involved DCI, it is possible that the rights already existed because of that (that's just a guess I pulled out of my a**). As far as a bunch of corps deciding to do tunes for which synch rights would be impossible, that is HIGHLY unlikely. That scenario ignores the fact that securing synch rights for DCI is very much in the corps best interest, because the corps ARE DCI. It would be very odd for corps to shoot themselves in the foot en masse that way.

This is exactly what the drum corps in Africa strive to do (I think they are called the Field Bands, or something like that). But I don't think it would work in DCI these days, because establishing a groove isn't rewarded. In fact it might even cost a corps points because I suspect it wouldn't be considered as demanding as changing time signatures every few bars. Too bad, because establishing a powerful groove is one of the defining characteristics of great music, and one of the most difficult things to achieve. I'd love to see it return to junior corps. It would also be incredibly fun to perform.

It's a reasonable thought but it's just not that simple. Very often the copyright holders respond extremely slowly. The copyright firm working with DCI is very experienced and very good at knowing which pieces are likely to receive the ok, and which ones may be a problem, and the likely price point(s). In some cases you never hear back, because some copyright holders just don't think it's worth their time to respond. Some purposely don't respond, because it's cheaper to do nothing and wait to pounce on you if you hit it big. Very often you go with the most likely outcome and put an appropriate amount of money in escrow for when (and if) the official ok and price comes through. As mentioned earlier, sometimes the granting of rights changes, throwing another monkey wrench into the picture. These days, it's pretty remarkable that they're only losing of a tune or two every couple of years. DCI and the corps are doing a very good job in this area, in my opinion. They were certainly helpful to us in facilitating the release of the 1972 and 1974-76 material.

I was there... it was suddenly so dark you couldn't see your hands in front of your face. The corps volume immediately went UP, as they obviously were hyped to show off. As the corps started wailing, the crowd went nuts. Apparently, staff members were having heart attacks running along the sideline trying to get the corps to be safe - no rifle throwing, etc. I'll never forget it.