queenanne_1536

Exactly! That is why I put the spreads in my previous post between SCV and 2nd place - to show that although over a week period their score dropped 0.6 the spread between them and Blue Devils was consistent to where it had been. But, an increase in score is, or should be, indicative of improvement.

After seeing them live, I do think they can beat BK, Regiment, Blue Stars and Crossmen which would put them as high as 8th. Will they beat them all? I think it's doubtful. I think it's a lot to ask for a corps that hasn't ever made finals to make that kind of jump, but I think JW is a genius and he knows how to propel groups forward (look what he did at SCV). It's going to be exciting and I'd love it if they placed 8th or 9th. I still think of that group Blue Stars have the most room to grow.

You forgot to add "whoever wins the political game" to your statement. :)

Well we'll just have to agree to disagree. I'm really ###### off that I had to practice so much when I marched. Had I known we could have gone up 12 points without improvement, I would have protested practicing.

Well said. I saw SCV live a few times that year, including semis and finals, and they were remarkable. It was such a powerful and emotion performance, especially on finals night. Sitting in the stands, I didn't know who the judges were going to give it to out of Garfield and SCV. They were both just so good. Santa Clara was just powerful and exciting, and Garfield was graceful and exciting. It's one of my favorite years ever. It's too bad Regiment had a rough run finals night, as 10th to 3rd (in semis) was pretty remarkable.

I think it's likely to be (in order of placement last year) 1. BD 2. SCV 3. Crown 4. Cavies 5. Bloo 6. Boston 7. Cadets 8. BK 9. Regiment 10. Blue Stars 11. Crossmen 12. Mandarins Those are my picks for the top 12.

My problem with the Mason era is they did the same thing that they did at Star ('87 - '89) - designed shows that couldn't sustain placement through finals. That was very frustrating.

If the judges think the yellow footwear doesn't work, they will tell them. I personally like it. I thought the uniforms were stupid when I first saw pictures of them, but they work. Along with SCV this Blue Stars show is my favorite of the season.

I was there too, and if you're going to make statements, you have to back them up with stats. There was not a three week period, or any period, in July where SCV stagnated. They got a 81.7 on 7/3 (their first show in July) and a 94.3 on July 30th (12.6 point improvement over the month). Blue Devils, over the same period went from a 79.6 to a 92.1 (an increase of 12.5) Garfield Cadets over the same period went from a 79.4 to a 90.9 (an increase of 11.5) Phantom Regiment over the same period went from a 83.7 to a 91.9 (an increase of 8.2) I'm using those to illustrate there was nothing out of the ordinary about Vanguard's improvement throughout July. It is in line with everyone else. Also, when you start ahead of course other groups are going to close the gap. It happens every year. Here's Vanguard's journey through July 1987 (with the 2nd place corps and distance). 7/3: San Diego, CA: 81.7 (2.8 over BD) 7/4: Los Angeles, CA: 82.9 (2.1 over BD) 7/5: Fountain Park, CA: 85.7 (2.2 over BD) 7/11: Sacramento, CA: 86.6 (4 over BD) 7/12: Santa Clara, CA: 87.0 (1.9 over BD) 7/17: Stockton, CA: 88.3 (2.1 over BD) 7/18: Concord, CA: 91.6 (3.1 over BD) 7/25: Boulder, CO: 91.0 (2.2 over BD) 7/27: Omaha, NE: 92.7 (8.2 over VK) 7/28: Bettendorf, LA: 93.3 (8.8 over VK) 7/29: Columbus, OH: 94.1 (3.4 over PR) 7/30: Erie, PA: 94.3 (9.5 over VK)

Right. They are amazing.

YAAAS MELLOS!

Yes, very true. SCV had very very strong finishes in 2016 and 2017, as well as 2011, 2012, 2013 and 2014. That is the trend.

No, that was not clear. I don't know where you are coming up with this stuff. Both performed to win. Both were exceptional. It was probably my favorite top 2 ever, along with last year's top 2. Losing by 0.1 is hardly playing not to lose. Garfield was exceptional. It happens. It was a beautifully crafted show and I can understand why the judges wanted to reward it so well.

I'm saying it's absurd for two judges to give 10.0s in a caption when the defending champion (in that caption) has yet to perform. He left no room for the Blue Devils percussion to come in over them had they been better. It was poor numbers management. Absolutely no one is perfect - not even 2014 Blue Devils. It's impossible. Was Garfield's percussion a full 0.5 better than SCV? I don't know, but the percussion judges did a #### job with numbers management, and that #### job could have impacted the outcome. They tied in Visual and Brass. If Garfield had won both of those captions and had won the whole thing by more, I would have nothing to say on the topic. I think both Garfield and SCV were spectacular in '87 and those two shows remain in my top 5 favorites to this day. I will not say Garfield didn't deserve the win, because the show was legendary. If SCV had won I would not say they didn't deserve it either. It was extremely close and the numbers went in Garfield's favor. They were both worthy of a championship, but you don't shell out a 20.0 with one corps left, especially when that corps is the defending percussion champion. That's all. Merely I'm arguing to prove the point that SCV hardly has a history of fast starts, slow finishes, and no improvements in July. Those statements are absurd.

In 1999 they tied for 1st place at finals, after being behind in quarters and semis.

I marched '85, '86 and '87 (not SCV) and you're wrong. In 1985 Blue Devils hammered them in June. They ended up passing Blue Devils and beating Garfield at DCI East, and eventually finished 2nd at finals. That's hardly starting strong and peaking in July. In '86 the only corps that beat them was Blue Devils and the only corps that they didn't beat was Blue Devils. So, they started right behind BD and finished right behind BD (with a very comfortable margin over 3rd place Cavaliers 97.0 to 95.7. In '87 they were undefeated and lost finals by 0.1. That is hardly peaking too earlier or starting strong and fading. Furthermore, a F'ed up percussion judge arguably cost them the title in '87.

Even if the boy scouts were changing to Scouts America they wouldn't need to change their name. The Scouts aren't affiliated with the boy scouts.

Where is this supposed history of starting strong and not being able to finish? I can think of two years since I joined the activity (in 1984) where perhaps SCV started strong and faded - 2007 & 2015. I wouldn't even call 2015 a spectacular fade. It's not like they came out in first and finished 5th. At highest during that year, they were probably 4th. And, to be clearer, when I said beatable I meant at finals. Not today.

Yes, thank you. So ridiculous that they couldn't manage their numbers correctly given they do it every year.

This may be the best comment I read this season. They should have done "I, Tonya" instead of "Heart & Soul."

Drums on the Ohio 6/27 Corps Score Cavaliers 1 Cavaliers 71.1 Phantom Regiment 2 Phantom Regiment 66.3 Blue Stars 3 Blue Stars 64.9 Colts 4 Colts 61.2 Genesis 5 Genesis 56.0 Music City 6 Music City 47.5 Deadline: June 27, Wednesday 6:00pm ET Innovations in Brass - Pittsburgh 6/28 Corps Score Bluecoats 1 Bluecoats 73.0 The Cadets 2 Boston Crusaders 71.5 Boston Crusaders 3 The Cadets 68.3 Madison Scouts 4 Madison Scouts 63.3 Spirit of Atlanta 5 Spirit of Atlanta 62.7 Pioneer 6 Pioneer 50.0 Deadline: June 28, Thursday 5:30pm ET DCI Central Indiana 6/29 Corps Score Carolina Crown 1 Carolina Crown 72.4 The Cavaliers 2 Cavaliers 71.9 Phantom Regiment 3 Phantom Regiment 67.3 Blue Stars 4 Blue Stars 65.6 Madison Scouts 5 Crossmen 65.4 Colts 6 Madison Scouts 64.2 Crossmen 7 Colts 62.1 Genesis 8 Genesis 57.0 Deadline: June 29, Friday 5:00pm ET Drum Corps at the Rose Bowl 6/30 Corps Score Blue Devils 1 Santa Clara Vanguard 73.9 Santa Clara Vanguard 2 Blue Devils 72.8 Blue Knights 3 Blue Knights 67.7 Mandarins 4 Mandarins 65.9 The Academy 5 The Academy 63.4 Pacific Crest 6 Troopers 61.1 Troopers 7 Pacific Crest 58.6

Have fun and please report back if you can. Didn't know it was an exhibition. Are you going to the show tonight?

Thanks. Appreciate that. Sometimes it's hard to know on here. Yes. I can point out a great example last year of where more made it worse, but I won't :) I'm really excited this year. Haven't been this excited since 2012.

I sat by a bunch of alumni last night, and they said the closer was going to be added for Pacific Procession. I mean who really knows, but I would tend to believe a big group of alumni would be a good source of information.

That makes sense. Yes. I actually didn't mind that part and I usually hate singing. The whole show was so good that the signing didn't really bother me.