Has DCI been a success or failure?

[BayonneBum]

I guess it's an era thing.

I always thought the corps who were heavily music and not enough visual as kind of not getting what drum corps was actually about.

Any group of quality musicians can sound great standing still. How do they sound while moving? To me...that's what matters. Movement makes drum corps to me. The music is important but the movement is of equal importance.

If I want to pay for a group to arc up and play...I'll plunk down my dollars for the Chicago Symphony (Solti era thank you). I go see drum corps because they move.

Thanks for the reply. I was afraid I didn't make a valid point, even though this is the effect modern DC had on my participation as a fan.

But please understand, I'm not against the visuals or the rapid movement. I'm a big 27th Lancer fan, and they were pretty much State of the Art in the early 80's (along with the usual suspects - BD, Santa Clara, Phantom, etc... who all could really march a challenging drill for that era). But I also came away huming English Folk Suite (I think that's the name of their opener in 1980), and Open Wide, etc. Get my drift.

Actually, I'm greatly impressed by the ability of the modern performers, both musically and athletically. What is a bit of a turn-off (strong word, but I can't think of an alternative right now) is the lack of identifiable and accessible musical pieces, and the ballet like guard work with all the emoting.

Granted, I'm a city kid that's rough around the edges. And in the interest of full disclosure, I see almost no modern shows except the very few times I catch finals on TV. But I can get my family and friends that are not familiar with DC in the least to take a listen to the recordings of the past, and the watch the Legacy DVDs. A few years ago (I think it was DCI's 1st year on ESPN2) I told a few of my co-workers to check out finals. The next day at work, I was almost embarrased. (Harsh, I know. But true). I thought my male co-workers saw me in a different light. LOL

But there was little I could take away from the experience, much less so for my co-workers. Someone on this thread lamented the fact that show programs used to detail facts about the modern corps and shows, and things to look for in the shows; a mini education to prepare. My experience is that it's completely necessary. It wasn't always that way.

I'm from Bayonne, and the Bridgemen's Tounament of Stars show usually kicked off the DC season for many of the local top corps. I'm sure, but not positive, that quite a few folks that were not DC fans (no friends or family involved in DC) would attend the show and enjoy themselves. I did, before I marched the Bridgemen's feeder corp (the Kidets) and Bridgemen.

I snuck in to see the unveiling of the new uniforms in 1976 (like I said, I was a 12 yr old city kid then. My 1st DC show), and really enjoyed all the shows. And it was a big deal for all of Bayonne as far as I could tell (police escort and everything). Point being, I can't imagine 12 yr olds (or most folks that are not "fans") sneaking in to see a Junior DC show now. And if they did, would they attempt to sneak in the next year. LOL

Hope I didn't offend, but I'm sure I did. Just trying to be honest.

[Tom Brace]

I may be off in my recollections, so I hope someone chimes in with the correct info if I am. But didn't those Orlando years include free usage of the stadium, and reduced costs that eventually helped get DCI out of the red and into the black?? If so, despite lower attendance (2003 attendance was actually pretty good), those years would have to be considered successful, no?

The cooperative effort with Disney began during the 1995 season. I remember the Disney types in their stadium suite in Orchard Park. Then Mickey showed up and I said, "What hath thou wrought?"

But, I do believe the years in Orlando had significant less overall expenses for DCI's operations. I think Jackson may go down in history as the worst location for a finals competition.

As far as the regional competition argument goes. No one has ever offered significant information as to why regional competition is superior. Corps still travel. The travel distances for many corps have not significantly changed in 40+ years. Again, I would point to the Casper Troopers as one example who traveled to Wisconsin, Illinois, Missouri and Texas back when I was a kid in the 1960s. Extended travel for some corps has been a model for longer than DCI was around.

It may be a geographic argument at best. Our country is a big one and when there were tons of corps from Pennsylvania eastward, one could expect a jampacked schedule night after night with not much travel between venues. There are still those occassions in the Midwest as well. For instance, a show in Normal, IL was followed by Des Moines the following evening....an easy ride for most corps. But, I do remember late last decade and earlier this decade of a whole series of 4 corps shows on the east coast. Cadets, Crossmen, Magic and Crown....night after night.

At least the Midwest could mount a 7-8 corps show.

[MikeD]

But please understand, I'm not against the visuals or the rapid movement. I'm a big 27th Lancer fan, and they were pretty much State of the Art in the early 80's (along with the usual suspects - BD, Santa Clara, Phantom, etc... who all could really march a challenging drill for that era). But I also came away huming English Folk Suite (I think that's the name of their opener in 1980), and Open Wide, etc. Get my drift.

Actually, I'm greatly impressed by the ability of the modern performers, both musically and athletically. What is a bit of a turn-off (strong word, but I can't think of an alternative right now) is the lack of identifiable and accessible musical pieces, and the ballet like guard work with all the emoting.

I too was a huge 2-7 fan, going back pre-DCI, when I marched with Garfield, and really before that when I was in a little Garden State corps (see my sig for marching years).

Personally, I have loved the drum corps of EVERY era, from my first show in 1964 through my latest one in 2008. Is the music accessible? Sure it is. You are not seeing much in the way of Stockhausen or Babbit or Cage or...pretty mainstream stuff IMO.

As for emoting and dancing guards, that is a huge plus IMO in the visual presentations of today. Not that my day was bad...it was great for it's day. Today's guards though, have goen so far past the old days in how they integrate their marvelous equipment work with using their entire bodies to convey the emotional content the designers are trying to convey.

I'm from Bayonne, and the Bridgemen's Tounament of Stars show usually kicked off the DC season for many of the local top corps. I'm sure, but not positive, that quite a few folks that were not DC fans (no friends or family involved in DC) would attend the show and enjoy themselves. I did, before I marched the Bridgemen's feeder corp (the Kidets) and Bridgemen.

I snuck in to see the unveiling of the new uniforms in 1976 (like I said, I was a 12 yr old city kid then. My 1st DC show), and really enjoyed all the shows. And it was a big deal for all of Bayonne as far as I could tell (police escort and everything). Point being, I can't imagine 12 yr olds (or most folks that are not "fans") sneaking in to see a Junior DC show now. And if they did, would they attempt to sneak in the next year. LOL

Hope I didn't offend, but I'm sure I did. Just trying to be honest.

Any honest opinion should be respected on DCP, whether a person agrees with it or not.

Don't forget, that when you were sneaking in to see the banana unis in 1976...and loved them...lots of older fans were saying that it was not Drum Corps at all to wear such costumes. I thought they were great unis (I was at that show too as an audience member), and even more important the corps was EXCELLENT that year...with a great show.

Bottom line is...you like what you like, and no one should have a problem with accepting that.

Just don't expect everyone to agree with your assessment (though many here do).

[BayonneBum]

Thanks Mike D. I appreciate reading everything you and all the posters have to say. It really keeps me informed about the activity that has meant so much to me and to all of us. I hope you see that I, and folks that feel as I do (if there are any), are torn. With all the entertainment options available to us today (not to mention the ridiculous work schedules that some of us have to endure), I feel bad that I don't support the activity that I've come to love. But there are only so many hours in a day, and days in a life. Maybe I'll have time in the future to be a more active fan (with all the job loss going on these days, there may be plenty of time to educate myself enough to enjoy this wonderful activity). LOL

[Martybucs]

Don't forget, that when you were sneaking in to see the banana unis in 1976...and loved them...lots of older fans were saying that it was not Drum Corps at all to wear such costumes. I thought they were great unis (I was at that show too as an audience member), and even more important the corps was EXCELLENT that year...with a great show.

Bottom line is...you like what you like, and no one should have a problem with accepting that.

Just don't expect everyone to agree with your assessment (though many here do).

Who were they?

I want names and addresses.

I remember lots of people laughing at them, but not a single person saying it was not drum corps.

[MikeD]

Who were they?

I want names and addresses.

I remember lots of people laughing at them, but not a single person saying it was not drum corps.

Oh, that was pretty common at that time in my area. Even then, there were those who used to claim this or that wasn't Drum Corps when something new came along.

[rut-roh]

Who were they?

I want names and addresses.

I remember lots of people laughing at them, but not a single person saying it was not drum corps.

One of my old teachers and (he claims) many of those who he marched with back in the 50's and 60's cited the 1970's Bridgemen as one of the main reasons they stopped following drum corps. Didn't like the non-military costumed look ("You'd never catch us wearing that crap on the field!"), didn't like the schtick ("Fainting on the field??"), and basically thought they bast ardized the activity forever.

I didn't agree with him, but hey, that's what he believed. Everyone, it seems, has a tipping point.

[Martybucs]

One of my old teachers and (he claims) many of those who he marched with back in the 50's and 60's cited the 1970's Bridgemen as one of the main reasons they stopped following drum corps. Didn't like the non-military costumed look ("You'd never catch us wearing that crap on the field!"), didn't like the schtick ("Fainting on the field??"), and basically thought they bast ardized the activity forever.

I didn't agree with him, but hey, that's what he believed. Everyone, it seems, has a tipping point.

Hearsay - not admissible.

[Martybucs]

Oh, that was pretty common at that time in my area. Even then, there were those who used to claim this or that wasn't Drum Corps when something new came along.

Who?

[Matt_S]

Hearsay - not admissible.

Ha! Everything on a discussion forum like DCP is hearsay, by definition