MikeD Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 There were changes from 1969 to 1979 for certain. Those changes have been mentioned on this thread. Corps moved from end zone starts to mid field starts. But that is a positional start. We have positional starts of various degrees today. IMO.... The changes to permit ciorps to start and end anywhere they wished was a HUGE change in visual show design concepts. Changing the KEY on a bugle is change, yes. But changing the fundamental instrumentation where VOICE is added, ( for example ) is a much, much larger alteration to the activity. Voice was already legal in the timeframes we are comparing. I'm surprised that a few people on here can't at least admit that the fundamental change in instrumentation allowed in the activity is striking, and far surpasses any of the mostly cosmetic changes that took place in the 70's. People hold differing views on things. I don't expect you to agree with mine. In DCP we just give our views. I happen to think you are wrong, but that's just MHO differing from yours. When we amplify sound, add voice, maybe add other instruments, piano, sax, etc, these are sweeping changes..... one poster above mentioned the changes in the " shows performed " or where a Corps began their show positionally on the field. Is this the same degree of change as adding ( say ) Voice ? If so,, well then, we simply disagree when we say that the changes in the activity in the decade of the 70's is far greater than the changes we have had in the last decade. Adding voice where there was none is a larger change than giving the person a mic. Same with the mallets...adding mallets in the first place is, IMO, a large change than merely placing a mic nearby to make them sound better. Additionally, in the 70's, many of the complainers still went to the shows. They would gripe. But the shows still had appeal to them. Today, we frankly have LESS complainers at shows. You cant' really know that. You can hold that viewpoint, of course, but that is just an opinion, as is mine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hrothgar15 Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 The only new instrument permitted in the last 10 years is the electronic keyboard. Singing and speaking were already legal, so that is not new. There was a full range of horns in G...the same basic voices are there inj multi-key. Nothing new there. Miccing a mallet instrument makes it sound better and makes for better performance, but it mics did not legalize any new instruments. So no, they are not a big deal IMO. I'm not stretching anything. Allowing more members to play existing instruments isn't all that large a change either, nor is permitting someone to adjust the levels from the sideline...again, IMO. Are you really arguing that a trumpet in Bb is the same instrument as a soprano bugle in G? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 Are you really arguing that a trumpet in Bb is the same instrument as a soprano bugle in G? It provides the same voice in the brass choir. Are you disgreeing with that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kusankusho Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 Are you really arguing that a trumpet in Bb is the same instrument as a soprano bugle in G? Mike only sees difference when he wants to see them, Hrothgar. For example, he sees drum corps and band as the same thing – no difference. But adding woodwinds would be an improvement because it would be different from today. But there would still be - no difference….. I hope you can follow this logic of his because it’s kinda obscure to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 (edited) Are you really arguing that a trumpet in Bb is the same instrument as a soprano bugle in G? Mike is saying that adding a mallet to the percussion useage, or where a Corps starts their show on a field, etc is the same degree of change as adding Voice, or changing the Key in the brass instrument, etc It's difficult when he can't see the DEGREE in the change, but...... it is what it is......and he's certainly entitled to his opinion that " the changes that took place in the decade of the 70's is far greater than in any other era, before or since. ". ( since Drum Corps began in the 18th century, that's a far reaching historical comment, but hey, it's what he believes. ) Edited March 13, 2009 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kusankusho Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 (edited) So - let me summarize this thread, if I may… The central premise here is that if DCP had been around in the 70s, the supposition, purely speculative, is that lots of people would be complaining about the changes of that time. This would prove that A - people have always complained about changes B - the changes we're seeing today are of a comparable magnitude to the changes we saw back then C - things are really quite fine as a result. All this proven by a hypothetical projection of what people would say on DCP had it existed 30 years ago. Therefore those of us complaining about amps etc have no reasonable leg upon which to stand. Well - if so, how is it that repeated actual, real, non-hypothetical, non-speculative polls that say the exact opposite are dismissed by the "new is better" crowd as irrelevant because it's DCP and nothing here means anything because it's not a sampling of the full drum corps audience? Just curious why you think you can have it both ways... Edited March 13, 2009 by kusankusho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 So - let me summarize this thread, if I may…The central premise here is that if DCP had been around in the 70s, the supposition, purely speculative, is that lots of people would be complaining about the changes of that time. This would prove that A - people have always complained about changes B - the changes we're seeing today are of a comparable magnitude to the changes we saw back then C - things are really quite fine as a result. All this proven by a hypothetical projection of what people would say on DCP had it existed 30 years ago. Therefore those of us complaining about amps etc have no reasonable leg upon which to stand. Well - if so, how is it that repeated actual, real, non-hypothetical, non-speculative polls that say the exact opposite are dismissed by the "new is better" crowd as irrelevant because it's DCP and nothing here means anything because it's not a sampling of the full drum corps audience? Just curious why you think you can have it both ways... Lance asked a hypothetical question, and the rest of the thread is people discussing their own POV in answering him. He asked what might have been happening on a 1979-DCP in discussing the changes of the 70's. What is so difficult to understand about that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kickhaltsforlife Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 Lance asked a hypothetical question, and the rest of the thread is people discussing their own POV in answering him. He asked what might have been happening on a 1979-DCP in discussing the changes of the 70's. What is so difficult to understand about that? Absolutely nothing.. the problem is that people get so upset about people not having the same opinion as them... and you Mike, often happen to have the opinion that is "out there" And there is nothing wrong about that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kusankusho Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 Lance asked a hypothetical question, and the rest of the thread is people discussing their own POV in answering him. He asked what might have been happening on a 1979-DCP in discussing the changes of the 70's. What is so difficult to understand about that? We have a term in karate, and I'll probably spell it wrong - tai sobake. It translates to "body shifting" - as in changing position to avoid a blow. You'd be an expert. So I guess we have to be very clear here..... Are you trying to say you don't believe the complaining would be as loud in a hypothetical 1970's DCP? Are you trying to say you wouldn't point to that as support for your position? Are you trying to say you haven't dismissed every poll here that has trounced your suppositions by as much as 90%? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AverageJoe Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 What is with DCP and hypothetical time travel questions as of late? It this community becoming more sci-fi obsessed than it was before. I'm not sure our bando image can endure this increase in prepubescent thought any longer. I make a motion to ban hypothetical time travel threads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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