rudi man Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 I am totally sure that other corps will help them out. Academy in past years has show such gratitude towards others corps. Maybe the cost of insurance wasn't worth it. I don't know what they have or don't have and I am not going to second guess them. I am sure there was a good reason for it. A good place to look for the ATV would be in Glamis, CA. That is not far across the border from AZ, and they is where all the sand dunes and ATV's are. Although, this time of year, not as many as when it is winter and much cooler. Seems to me that the insurance would be worth it now . The should go and buy a used cheapo lawn tractorand a used cheapo flat trailer to tow behind , it will still cost some money but nowhere near $12,000 and get some freakin insurance !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bandmom333 Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 OK...I am not sure, but can a corp insure something that does not belong to them?? According to The Academy website, this utility vehicle and trailer were loaned to them by a "generous family"...I fail to see, in this scenario, how the corp could be blamed.. But regardless of the fault, as a proud parent of a Teal Sound member, I remember last year how the drum corp community rallied around Teal Sound, and kept them on the road...However unfortunate the details are, this corp is in need of something crucial to their tour's success... I have donated what I can to the cause...If everyone that reads this does the same, The Academy will be able to get on with the summer tour... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudi man Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 Thanks "dad". We wouldn't have to help keep bailing out corps if they took care of business before these things happen. Insurance is the difference between needing our money and not. It's unfortunate, but I am not giving up my hard earned money when they couldn't even get insurance. Look, my dad sold insurance for a living and I know how easy and affordable it really is to get it, so I have no sympathy. Lack of proper planning, and it sucks the kids have to suffer. My heart goes out, but not my money. I already give as an alumni to both corps I marched, which happen to be run very well. I don't have enough for everyone , but go ahead and bail out all the corps you like. It's a free country.. You have your opinion, I have mine. Philanthropy is a worthy cause for those who really need it. How about sending money to starving kids in Africa if its really that important you, instead of a drum corps that doesn't cross their t's and dot their i's. Nothing against Academy, Teal Sound or any other, but it's just the fact of taking care of business ahead to avoid needing our charity every time this kind of thing happens. BTW, I donate all the time... thanks.. Please don't confuse emotion with having good business sense. These corps should count their lucky stars they have guys like you who will take up their cause and donate at the drop of a hat. I just can't. Got a family, house payment and all that real life stuff, you know... I could'nt have said it better ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmfootworks Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 (edited) Easy. This topic has turned into a bash Academy for no insurance. That is what is dominating the topic. I remember the outpouring of help for teal last year. Where is it for Academy? Again, none of you are running this corps so you don't have a clue what their situation is. Stop trying to act like you can run this corps better than Mark Richardson. Every corps' situation is different from the next corps. Even if you disagree about the insurance, I am sure every corps has made their share of mistakes over the years. Also, Academy has shown such great gratitude to other corps and helped them out when they were in a bind. The same corps some of you folks donate too. Remember that. So long as people are posting in a civil manner, they can speak about anything relevant to the original topic. The original topic was of the news item of Academy's misfortune. Several posters expressed surprise that the corps carried no insurance on the stolen items, and that's about the extent of it. Then you came along and started lecturing everyone about how they should be rallying to help Academy. You could have no knowledge of whether more people reading about this here have intentions to do so. Just because they aren't publicly stating it doesn't mean that they aren't planning to do something charitable. I take strong exception to your characterization of those simply expressing surprise at the lack of insurance in this incident as a matter of bashing Academy. Yes, it's the old bashing charge, just as if someone says they dislike something about a show, then they are "bashing the kids." Shame us with guilt so we don't discuss what is too painful for some to listen to, right? I guess what puzzles me most about your post is the stark contrast to your recent thread about why you thought rifles should be banished from drum corps because marching members didn't treat them with respect. You went on at length about this even though people patiently tried to explain to you that they were just pieces of wood. When you persisted in your quest for an answer to why we should possibly use air blades rather than rifles (under the reasoning that other things have gone by the way over the years to be replaced by other things, and because marching members weren't treating rifles with respect), people made the earnest effort to explain that perhaps we just like rifles and there is no need to change. Why do you not have the same level of "respect" (insurance) for corps equipment here as you did on your thread about rifles? And why can you argue ad nauseam on something about which no one agrees with you on one thread, yet request that the thread be shut down here simply because some people don't see things the way you do and aren't saying what you want to hear? Isn't this a sort of bashing of another form? Edited July 3, 2009 by dmfootworks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trumpetcam Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 (edited) I apologize if people have gotten offended, but it's hard to read these threads about this and absolve all responsibility from the corps. cfrey71, since you feel so strongly and it moves us, I will donate a little myself. I actually have a former student helping out on staff and have spoken to him about this. I will still stick by my stand and even though Mark has obviously done a wonderful job directing the corps, perhaps the insurance aspect could have been avoided. I hope you can at least agree with me on that. And please don't get so offended and try to close a thread. We are all emotional creatures and your heart is in the right place, but don't let that get you too much. Hopefully this can amend some of our earlier discussions and reestablish civility in our quest to help Academy out. Good luck to Academy and I sure hope the hornline doesn't have to carry all the pit equipment on the field all summer! Now that would be a pain! Edited July 3, 2009 by trumpetcam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crfrey71 Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 I could'nt have said it better ! Donated $75 online just now. Here is the online form which you can make donations to. https://www.arizonaacademy.org/donate/form.php Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoonHill Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 OK...I am not sure, but can a corp insure something that does not belong to them?? According to The Academy website, this utility vehicle and trailer were loaned to them by a "generous family"...I fail to see, in this scenario, how the corp could be blamed..But regardless of the fault, as a proud parent of a Teal Sound member, I remember last year how the drum corp community rallied around Teal Sound, and kept them on the road...However unfortunate the details are, this corp is in need of something crucial to their tour's success... I have donated what I can to the cause...If everyone that reads this does the same, The Academy will be able to get on with the summer tour... I routinely get "additional insured" coverage and "loaned vehicle" coverage for locations containing things that don't belong to my company, or vehicles that we're not outright renting. The AI notes are simply a matter of course, not an increase in rate, and the LV coverage is usually a pittance. Note: this isn't saying that Academy should have had such coverage, or anything like that. I'm not even certain such things are applicable in a non-profit organization situation. I'm just saying that such things do exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crfrey71 Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 I apologize if people have gotten offended, but it's hard to read these threads about this and absolve all responsibility from the corps. cfrey71, since you feel so strongly and it moves us, I will donate a little myself. I actually have a former student helping out on staff and have spoken to him about this. I will still stick by my stand and even though Mark has obviously done a wonderful job directing the corps, perhaps the insurance aspect could have been avoided. I hope you can at least agree with me on that. And please don't get so offended and try to close a thread. We are all emotional creatures and your heart is in the right place, but don't let that get you too much. Hopefully this can amend some of our earlier discussions and reestablish civility in our quest to help Academy out. Good luck to Academy and I sure hope the hornline doesn't have to carry all the pit equipment on the field all summer! Now that would be a pain! I appreciate that! I try to do what I can to support the drum corps activity. What bothers me is that everyone seems to forget that all of us make mistakes, even people at the most successful and highest positions. Our organizations don't get any federal bailouts, etc... I just saying that we should reserve judgement until all the facts are known. Regardless, my point was this corps has shown tremendous gratitude helping other corps out and this time, it is them that needs a little help. I just try to keep things simple. I am sure the Academy will appreciate your gratitude very much! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newseditor44 Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 IBTC... which is sad seeing as though this started as a legit thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 (edited) I've got to chime in here.1)I presume a trailer needs to have insurance to be on the road. Are any of you aware that most vehicles don't carry "theft" insurance? The trailer won't magically be replaced if there is insurance on it. That's not how insurance works. 2)Does anybody know what it costs to have insurance on an ATV? I'd love for someone in the insurance business to chime in. I'd wager the cost of getting a title from the registry and plates and insurance (for what is technically a recreational vehicle and doesn't require any of those things) is probably near the cost of the vehicle itself every three years or so. The monthly premiums for insurance coverage that you know-it-alls are asking for on a $5000 vehicle probably equal about $5000 every three years. (That's about $140/month...does anybody pay that?) Perhaps the administration figured they would save money by not purchasing the insurance if they were not required to do so. I don't know many ATV riders that carry the same coverage, plates, etc on their ATV that they have on their family sedans....do you? Please eloquently refute my statement and support it with facts if you can. A couple of things : Not sure what the current value of the ATV is, but the reported loss of $12,000 ,if accurate, means the premiums paid for coverage would never have been close to this on an annual basis for many years. Also, insurance premiums paid could have been deducted as an expense more than likely. Finally, insurance also provides liability protection to the owner in the event the ATV causes unintended negligence ( ie, an accident ) that results in injury toward another(s). To avoid exposing the owner to out pf pocket expenses toward the insured party, insurance is recommended for the owner of a ATV....... as well as for the obvious theft protection with the ATV that we apparently had here. There is also the question here as to whether insurance on a policy written covers a loan by the owner to another entity. It may or may not. An Insurance company sets premiums based upon the anticipated risk and use by the owner. Once the ATV is loaned it is often unclear to the Insurance Company who the recipient is and how they intend to use it, where it is used, the location, and so forth. This is why some policies written have either an exclusion written to deny coverage on " loaners ", or the policy includes broader coverage that allows " loaning " in which case the annual premiiums for such optional coverage ( if even available ) would be considerably higher as the risk is higher to the Insurance Co...... Anyway, there could be any number of reasons there was not insurance coverage for this incident...... It's too bad though. Edited July 3, 2009 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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