lp1955 Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 (edited) Muchachos and Bridgemen had a hard time bouncing back from the DQ'sThe others - $$$ - same as it ever was. That's why DCI now requires WC corps to be financially stable. Was not the case in the 70s, 80s or even 90s. The Bridgemen had no problem bouncing back 3 years later we came in 3rd the best placement ever for the corps. It was the money that finally did them in. Edited July 3, 2009 by lp1955 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 (edited) Since the inception of DCI over 35 years ago, 85% of the DCI Titles have been won by one of 3 Corps..... BD, Cadets, Cavs. The question before us then should be: 1) can Crown win a DCI Title ?........................................ I'd give it a 25% chance. 2) can Crown win a Title more than once ?........................I'd give it a 10% chance. 3) can Bluecoats win a DCI Title?..................................... I'd give it a 10& chance 4) can Bluecoats win a DCI Title more than once?................I'd give it a 3 % chance 5) will the Blue Stars and/ or Boston catch Crown and /or Bluecoats next year.....I'd give this a 30 % chance. In summation, I believe that if Crown does not win a Title this year that it is slightly more likely that either the Blue Stars or the Boston Crusaders will catch Crown or the Bluecoats than it will be for Crown or Bluecoats to win a Title by beating the combination of BD, Cadets, Cavs, Phantom Regiment, SCV. Edited July 3, 2009 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 Muchachos and Bridgemen had a hard time bouncing back from the DQ'sThe others - $$ - same as it ever was. That's why DCI now requires WC corps to be financially stable. Was not the case in the 70s, 80s or even 90s. actually, Bridgemen did quite fine for several years after the DQ 1978 5 1979 6 1980 3 1981 6 1982 8 1983 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCSU_Crown Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 It's impossible to say where Crown or Coats would be 10 years from now. Just think 11 years ago Bluecoats missed Finals and only 7 years ago Crown missed Finals. Also remember, 10 years ago, the Madison Scouts were a perennial Top 6 corps, and if you were to tell me then that they were going to miss Finals a few times and struggle to get into the Top 12 in the ensuing decade, I would have called you crazy! Exactly. And being a member of that Crown team that finished 16th, I can barely believe my eyes now when I seeing these scores, and how far we've come in 7 years! It truly does go to show that anything can happen in DCI. Well, except for electronic instruments. I mean, that'll never happen, EVER. ...Oh, wait.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trumpetcam Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 (edited) I think both corps certainly have the design team and instructional staff to be and stay top 5. They also have the membership talent. It appears that both corps have great organizational strength and are financially sound. I think it would be wonderful to see both Crown and Bluecoats in the top 3 at the end of this season. DING DING DING! We have a winner! The financial where with all and organizational structure has everything to do with it. I could not follow DCI at all, and look at how well Crown is run and their business model, and guess that they would be a top 5 corps. Same with Cavies and BD. It can't be overstated how important that is. Even above staff and talent IMO. You see, money makes the world go round. It buys a great staff, and with that comes noticeable improvement, and with that comes talent, and with that comes high level success. Same in all sports and successful businesses worldwide. It's very simple and Crown and Bluecoats have it absolutely figured out. Just go look up Kevin Smith and Ted Swaldo and their business backgrounds. No surprise they are super successful with guys like that running the ship. IMO, Blue Stars are the next group I see this model taking shape and achieving high level status in a few years. If I was to start a corps, the first thing I would do would be to hire a corps director who is in charge of the physical corps and an executive director who only deals with running the business side of the corps. It's the very reason why some great musicians fail as band directors; a lack of good organizational or business skills. It's my number one beef with music education training, no courses in business or management. Unfortunately, music is only about 30% of what you do as a band director or corps director. Good business=successful corps. Plain and simple. Edited July 3, 2009 by trumpetcam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 (edited) DING DING DING! We have a winner!The financial where with all and organizational structure has everything to do with it. I could not follow DCI at all, and look at how well Crown is run and their business model, and guess that they would be a top 5 corps. Same with Cavies and BD. It can't be overstated how important that is. Even above staff and talent IMO. You see, money makes the world go round. It buys a great staff, and with that comes noticeable improvement, and with that comes talent, and with that comes high level success. Same in all sports and successful businesses worldwide. It's very simple and Crown and Bluecoats have it absolutely figured out. Just go look up Kevin Smith and Ted Swaldo and their business backgrounds. No surprise they are super successful with guys like that running the ship. IMO, Blue Stars are the next group I see this model taking shape and achieving high level status in a few years. If I was to start a corps, the first thing I would do would be to hire a corps director who is in charge of the physical corps and an executive director who only deals with running the business side of the corps. It's the very reason why some great musicians fail as band directors; a lack of good organizational or business skills. It's my number one beef with music education training, no courses in business or management. Unfortunately, music is only about 30% of what you do as a band director or corps director. Good business=successful corps. Plain and simple. Until Crown or Bluecoats win a Title, this is just happy feet, happy talk, sunshine, and lolipops. Don't get me wrong, I'd like to see someone new at the top. That's why it was refeshing to see Phantom Regiment win last year. But PLEASE lets not go overboard here in July on 2 Corps that havn't finished in the top 3 in their history yet for heaven's sake, let alone win anything. Edited July 3, 2009 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DcFr3aK Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 Until Crown or Bluecoats win a Title, this is just happy feet, happy talk, sunshine, and lolipops. Don't get me wrong, I'd like to see someone new at the top. That's why it was refeshing to see Phantom Regiment win last year. But PLEASE lets not go overboard here in July on 2 Corps that havn't finished in the top 3 in their history yet for heaven's sake, let alone win anything. Well just because they're new to the top ranks, does that make it impossible for something like that to happen? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 (edited) Well just because they're new to the top ranks, does that make it impossible for something like that to happen? It's not where you start, it's where you finish. Before we canonize a Corps, lets have them finish in the top 3 for once, then we'll go from there. Right now all we know for certain is that these Corps MIGHT have a chance to crack the top 3 for the first time in their history..... maybe even higher. Beyond that, it's not quite the 4th of July 2009 and we have a ways to go still before either of these Corps can show us they have what it takes to be " new to the top ranks " ( top 3 ) for the first time. and once there...... can they replicate a top 3 finish again in subsequent years ? History says... " No ". But we'll just have to wait and see. But finishing in the top 3 is what the truly GREAT Corps do........ year, after year, after year, etc Edited July 3, 2009 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DcFr3aK Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 It's not where you start, it's where you finish. Before we canonize a Corps, lets have them finish in the top 3 for once, then we'll go from there. Right now all we know for certain is that these Corps MIGHT have a chance to crack the top 3 for the first time in their history..... maybe even higher. Beyond that, it's not quite the 4th of July 2009 and we have a ways to go still before either of these Corps can show us they have what it takes to be " new to the top ranks " ( top 3 ) for the first time. and once there...... can they replicate a top 3 finish again in subsequent years. History says... " No ". But we'll just have to wait and see. But finishing in the top 3 is what the truly GREAT Corps do........ year, after year, after year, etc But that's what I'm getting at. Why is it not possible with the momentum and this amazing show they have that they can win without cracking the top 3 earlier in their history? That's all I'm saying! I know there is still a ton of time left in this 3 month game! I'm just a Crown fan and a guy who ALMOST always sees life with a "glass is half full" mentality! I love the fact that it is a possibility, and would be soo thrilled if it did end up happening! But if they got second or third, I'd still be more then happy! These men and women are working their butts off for us to have these debates! As long as I remain a Crown fan, the glass is always going to be "greener"!?! GO DRUM CORPS! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShortAndFast Posted July 3, 2009 Share Posted July 3, 2009 Something I'd like to see for the heck of it (though I don't want to do it myself), a breakdown by placement of the number of different corps that have ever reached that placement. It'd be interesting to see, for example, the difference in the number of corps that have reached fifth versus sixth. Your wish is my command. Since 1972: 41 Finalists 37 Top 10 corps 31 Top 8 corps 24 Top 6 corps 21 Top 5 corps 16 Top 4 corps 12 Top 3 corps 11 Top 2 corps 8 Champions Since 1984: 25 Finalists 22 Top 10 corps 18 Top 8 corps 15 Top 6 corps 12 Top 5 corps 9 Top 4 corps 7 Top 3 corps 7 Top 2 corps 7 Champions Since 2000: 17 Finalists 15 Top 10 corps 13 Top 8 corps 11 Top 6 corps 9 Top 5 corps 7 Top 4 corps 5 Top 3 corps 4 Top 2 corps 4 Champions It's actually surprisingly linear until you get to the top 3. Almost everyone who makes the Top 3 eventually wins a title. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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