Jeff Ream Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Here's what we know:Percussion was right behind Crown coming into Finals. One guy fell. Percussion dropped A WHOLE POINT to 7th place. here's what the word is from several people there....yes the kid fell and some bumper cars happened. while they may have rebounded visually pretty quickly, the hands didn't. and as a result, there's the score drop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrinkinOuttaCups Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Wait, wait, wait. Cadets made finals? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
84BDsop Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Remember, they once had half their corps go down in a show (Whitewater '84), and still got a perfect marching score.So I doubt it. Not half....8-9 at most, if I remember the answer when I asked a former member. The perfect marching score at that show, however, is true...shocked the heck out of us AND Regiment (we were standing near each other and the staffs both got to that caption at the same time) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rd_Star_Brigade Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Not half....8-9 at most, if I remember the answer when I asked a former member.The perfect marching score at that show, however, is true...shocked the heck out of us AND Regiment (we were standing near each other and the staffs both got to that caption at the same time) Thats because ticks and falls are not part of the overall score when the judges judge the show. Consistency is. Crossmen, early season of 08 comes to mind. There were a lot of falls, and overall they were penalized for it. But, the reason behind that was that the corps was struggling consistently with their marching and maneuvering. Thus, the score reflected that. Its like '89 BD. The corps was not penalized for the infamous fracked solo, as this was merely a tick by an individual and not a judgment on the corps proper's technique, performance, and the design of Wayne Downey. Ticks suck, but they happen. Why penalize a corps for making them when it is a game of any given sunday? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RegimentContra94 Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Thats because ticks and falls are not part of the overall score when the judges judge the show. Consistency is.Crossmen, early season of 08 comes to mind. There were a lot of falls, and overall they were penalized for it. But, the reason behind that was that the corps was struggling consistently with their marching and maneuvering. Thus, the score reflected that. Its like '89 BD. The corps was not penalized for the infamous fracked solo, as this was merely a tick by an individual and not a judgment on the corps proper's technique, performance, and the design of Wayne Downey. Ticks suck, but they happen. Why penalize a corps for making them when it is a game of any given sunday? So execution judges are supposed to judge the intent? That doesn't make sense. If things are performed as intended, ticks don't happen. No performing group is perfect execution wise, except for 89 Regiment, but you have to absolutely count off for lapses in execution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rd_Star_Brigade Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 So execution judges are supposed to judge the intent? That doesn't make sense. If things are performed as intended, ticks don't happen.No performing group is perfect execution wise, except for 89 Regiment, but you have to absolutely count off for lapses in execution. Ticks are not relative to the level of performance and capability of design. That is why the tick system was done away with and has been dead for over 25 years. Falling can be attributed to environment as well. This would make a penalization and judgment levied upon a corps unfair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 No, we learned early last season that falling down does not cost you points. Some on here also said that falling down but getting up quickly and/ or smoothly can actually provide youu style points with the judges due to agility and dexterity demonstration. For example, a Corps last season on a rainy slippery field in June in a competition in New England had several members fall down during the show. They got points for this by executing a return to formation gracefully and separated themselves point wise over a Corps that unfortunately had no opportunity to demonstrate such agility, as no one from their Corps fell down during their performance. As a result, their overall Vis. Perf. score and Ge. Vis. score went down from the previous night, and they lost by a wider margin to the fall down, get back up gracefully and with aplomb Corps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 (edited) So execution judges are supposed to judge the intent? That doesn't make sense. If things are performed as intended, ticks don't happen.No performing group is perfect execution wise, except for 89 Regiment, but you have to absolutely count off for lapses in execution. We have also learned that " holes" in a line due to missing members also have no negative effect on scores. On the contrary. " Holes " in line can provide extra points. But only if the Corps has a good " reputation" for exeecution. For example, when a Corps has a " hole " due to missing member(s) judges are instructed to envision in their mind that there is, in fact, a member in that " hole". The judge then assumes the member from the corps with a reputation for execution would have executed the visual move and therefore in the judges eye, the visual move is to be " seen " as executed and completed, and not visually flawed due to the missing member (s) creating a " hole " in the visual formation. Thus, we see Corps with " holes " not having visual scores impacted. It is believed by some that the day will come soon when a creative Corps might decide to bench a performer or two that have repeatedly failed to execute their visual moves in order to increase their score through " hole " institution. More than one observer has even opined that such creative use of " holes " has already been implemented.... and successfully. But this is pure conjecture and can not be fully substantiated. Edited November 17, 2009 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimott01 Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Sorry, but to the original poster, but that fall was way worse than you can see from the high cam. I saw it live, before, during, and after the fall, and it was a tragic mess. The original faller missed a direction change and got his foot stepped on by the guy on the end next to him. Once the first guy fell, the end guy fell over him and then got back up and kept going. Bass 1 kind of tripped over the dude on the ground and Bass 2 pretty much marched over the dude. Finally, the guy scooted himself backfield and away from the rest of the bass line. Once he was back up he was chasing the rest of the snare line trying to get back into his spot, but the other snare guys had closed his hole and there was no where to go, so the guy followed the line standing behind where his spot is supposed to be. After maybe 10 more seconds of this, the dude literally put his hand on the arm of the end dude and moved him over and got back into his spot. For the remainder of the tune, intervals were everywhere, guys were bumping into each other, and I saw at least two breaks, one from center for at least 8 counts. Drum judge caught all those ticks and there was dirt everywhere, everywhere! I'm sure that getting dropped one point to 7th in drums had something to do with that, and something to do with 3rd place. But don't take it from me, I just teach drum corps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bccadet09 Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 I was wondering when somebody would mention the fall from finals night... Here's what I know (from an 09 member standpoint).... Did we have an awesome performance on finals night? Absolutely. In fact, we completely blew it out of the water on finals night, through all ends, and I felt it everywhere. Did I see the fall from the snareline? No I did not, although I have seen a fall in the drumline before and it wasn't on finals night.... Now, in regards to the drumline, I talked to one of the members once we got back to the housing site after finals. He told me the finals run was very consistent overall despite the fall. Oh well, **** happens. But it was still an awesome night. We also had a very tough musical book, not in terms of technicality, but in terms of playing as an ensemble. So we had more issues to clean rather than just drumline. That could have also put us 4th place music. All I can really say is again....OH WELL. We can't do anything about it, and I've learned last summer that debating and complaining over this wouldn't help the situation. It's a part of history and we have to just enjoy the shows as they are. That's just my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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