Could the new pre-show rule lead to woodwinds?

[perc2100]

Uh...symphonies have tubas. Rock bands have used any and all instruments as long as there have been rock bands if they want to.

Or....continue to attract new people.

And sometimes you can make it better.

lol. I saw Korn in concert once when I was in college and they were touring off of their first album (actually, they were an opening band for Danzig). They began the show with the lead singer playing a bagpipe solo. Want to know something funny? The crowd LOVED it and ate that up. Speaking for myself only, I dug the fact that the band was doing something unique and setting themselves apart from other bands of their genre.

[perc2100]

question...why does drum corps have to be more inclusive for other people?

do you see metal bands opening up and letting saxes in? do you see symphonies opening up and letting contras in?

no.

this continued ######## belief of some that drum corps has to be all things to all people does one very bad thing....

continue to push people away.

given how we have seen no attendance numbers for 2008 and 2009, I can't honestly believe all the new toys are really dragging that many people in the door to make up for those leaving.

sometimes you can tinker with something good and truly #### it up

I know the recent attendance figures (or lack there of) are fun for people to constantly throw around on here. But the lowest attended Finals in the Dan Atcheson era (and the shows almost immediately preceding this tenure as DCI Ex. Director), were in 1993 and the Orlando years: years before any key brass, mic's, and synths.

I guess what I'm saying is there are a plethora of factors that contribute to both high and low attendance. I think it's kind of presumptuous to correlate synths/mic's, etc. with (potential) lower attendance. IN 2008 we had the cluster f*@& of the finals location shuffle, and last summer finals occurred during a pretty hefty recession. I'm not trying to make excuses, and if there is any proper evidence proving the cause and effect of the 'new toys' effecting attendance, I'll change my opinion. The other thing to consider is that up until the mid-90's DCI did not officially take an attendance at Finals, and any numbers released to the public were at best a close estimate and at worst outright BS (yea, I know I throw that out about as much as you bring up the lack of released attendance for 08 and 09).

[Jeff Ream]

Uh...symphonies have tubas. Rock bands have used any and all instruments as long as there have been rock bands if they want to.

Or....continue to attract new people.

And sometimes you can make it better.

and in the eyes of many...this isn't making it better Mike. it's turning them off and pushing them away.

[Jeff Ream]

I agree with this in the sense that it's almost silly for a corps to have a crazy over-produced pre-show just to do that. It would seem illogical for corps to sink resources into equipment that takes up valuable truck storage space and maintenance for something not judged anyway.

But as I've mentioned before, if a corps' staff and design team spend too much time designing/cleaning a pre-show at the expense of their competitive show, then that is the fault of the staff/designers and not the system.

true...staff must take responsibility.

or...they'll just keep changing the rules to make up for their lack of responsibility. Not like we haven't seen that pattern in the last 7 years

[Dave]

3. many corps do not pay for their instruments,

Name one.

You'll be up for a while figuring that out, because it's a trick question: no one gets equipment for free; it's a long-standing drum corps myth. Sponsorships don't = free instruments, they = package deals (which even now are starting to become too much for companies to handle financially) and the corps' image in advertisements. You especially don't get woodwinds for free; I can tell you from experience that the cost factors on woodwinds are higher than brass, significantly so, and especially from companies like Yamaha and Conn-Selmer. Setting aside the raw foolishness of taking woodwinds outside into the beating that drum corps put their equipment through every day, the cost alone of outfitting a corps with instruments makes this untenable. But then, that hasn't stopped any other change down the pike, so I suppose it's silly to expect it would stop this one.

[Jeff Ream]

I know the recent attendance figures (or lack there of) are fun for people to constantly throw around on here. But the lowest attended Finals in the Dan Atcheson era (and the shows almost immediately preceding this tenure as DCI Ex. Director), were in 1993 and the Orlando years: years before any key brass, mic's, and synths.

I guess what I'm saying is there are a plethora of factors that contribute to both high and low attendance. I think it's kind of presumptuous to correlate synths/mic's, etc. with (potential) lower attendance. IN 2008 we had the cluster f*@& of the finals location shuffle, and last summer finals occurred during a pretty hefty recession. I'm not trying to make excuses, and if there is any proper evidence proving the cause and effect of the 'new toys' effecting attendance, I'll change my opinion. The other thing to consider is that up until the mid-90's DCI did not officially take an attendance at Finals, and any numbers released to the public were at best a close estimate and at worst outright BS (yea, I know I throw that out about as much as you bring up the lack of released attendance for 08 and 09).

well, you see more and more people on here saying why they aren't going to more than just the echo dome. I agree the economy had to play a part. But, we all know if the numbers were better, DCI would trot them out in a second.

as for before the mid 90's..I'm guessing they had to keep count for tax purposes, but never bothered to keep good records of it internally

[MikeD]

well, you see more and more people on here saying why they aren't going to more than just the echo dome. I agree the economy had to play a part. But, we all know if the numbers were better, DCI would trot them out in a second.

as for before the mid 90's..I'm guessing they had to keep count for tax purposes, but never bothered to keep good records of it internally

This 'more and more' that post are still just a very tiny drop in a big bucket...and some that say that also say they'll make sure to attend a big regional, so even there the net loss is small if any. Unless they do post numbers, you have no way to know anything at all about them...and even if they did and they were lower....no way of knowing why, esp in this economy.

[MikeD]

and in the eyes of many...this isn't making it better Mike. it's turning them off and pushing them away.

But, as always, 'many' in these posts means nothing as compared to the total audience.

[MikeD]

true...staff must take responsibility.

or...they'll just keep changing the rules to make up for their lack of responsibility. Not like we haven't seen that pattern in the last 7 years

Ummmm...we haven't.

[Jeff Ream]

however Mike, you see even more of all ages say if woodwinds are added ( to the show that counts, but some to preshows) they're done too.

why keep adding things that only seem to push more and more people away?

DCI has done enough damage with Indy and the dome. Eventually, someone's gotta have some common sense and say "um, we're pushing people away"

not that I expect that to happen anytime soon, but then again, I may already be gone for good when they decide...and many others may be with me.