WOOHOO Posted October 28, 2010 Share Posted October 28, 2010 That's just it, Lance. It's NOT a BD-bashing thread no matter how much some wish it to be and pull it in that direction. My opinion is that one of the ways I know drum corps is dying is when show designers feel justified in making the fans feel uncomfortable instead of entertained. That's just my opinion (but I can give empirical evidence that drum corps is dying by simply counting the number of corps today v. a decade or two or three ago). It just so happens that it was BD's designers who endeavored to make me feel uncomfortable so they are the pinpoint of the discussion. But when a fan (me or others) points out their dissatisfaction with "uncomfortable" show programming a group of unabashed BD-honks tries to re-identify the source of my dissatifaction to something akin to ABBD. I'm comfortable enough in my own skin to say "I'm tired of BD always winning!" if I actually felt that way. When I define the source of my dissatisfaction I'm told that I don't really understand why I didn't like BD's show and, regardless of my well self-examined rationale that formulates my opinion, that I really didn't like the show because of some ABBD nonsense, or regional factors, or that I'm a dino and can't grasp current fads, or the activity has simply left me behind and I'm not cogent enough yet to realize it. Every time I think we've moved away from the ABBD mentality, "they" pull us back into it ($1 to the Corleones). I hate lima beans as much as I love asparagus not because I don't understand lima beans. I know you don't feel this way, but there are plenty of people are entertained by being uncomfortable. I know you aren't one of them, but if you don't like the shows that do make you feel uncomfortable, why not focus on the shows that do make you feel comfortable? They exist too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musclebud Posted October 28, 2010 Share Posted October 28, 2010 I Love this posting...... time to treat Drum Corps like Granny and PULL THE PLUG. But not to kill it this time but to save it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plan9 Posted October 28, 2010 Share Posted October 28, 2010 Have I lost the whole direction of this discussion, or are you saying that the only emotion you get from the B.D. 2010 show is discomfort - that it just makes you "uncomfortable" from start to finish?Fred O. Absolutly not! The beautiful moments of release/resolve with la Suerta and Laura are how you know where you were. It's an emotional ride designed to challenge your ears and eyes. Like the brief resolve to Laura at the end, you would expect it to carry out to the end (expect being the opertative word), but it only visits the phrase and than releases to an obscure and dissonant cresendo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted October 28, 2010 Share Posted October 28, 2010 (edited) I know you don't feel this way, but there are plenty of people are entertained by being uncomfortable. I know you aren't one of them, but if you don't like the shows that do make you feel uncomfortable, why not focus on the shows that do make you feel comfortable? They exist too. Maybe this is an "Aha" moment (or a "Woohoo" moment) because I'm going to admit that there is a possibility that someone in the stands, on any given show night, came expressly because someone else told them that some drum corps are adopting a show design that's intended to agitate instead of entertain. It certainly is possible that drum corps could become the Blair Witch of art entertainment and attract fans who are entertained by 11 minutes of discomfort. To the extent that such programming draws fans not otherwise inclined to attend a drum corps show I can hardly complain about the tactic. But just as Maplethorpe's "PissChrist" exhibit, I see those attracted to an "Evening Extravaganze Of Dissonant Chords And Discomfort" not as the future broad appeal of Drum Corps Major League. Yeah, it's probably just me, but I see the mass of fans falling within one standard deviation of what drum corps fans have always been. Now don't get me wrong; I think dissimilarity among all the corps' productions, and not the "Standard Template" of the current success model, is what keeps the activity (and DCP discussion) interesting. But, for me (and yes, it may be just me), if 6 of the top 12 on finals night adopted the '10BD model of "dissonant discomfort" in their show programming I'd be much less inclined to attend the show. Give me a plate of asparagus with a few lima beans thrown in and I'll probably eat. But give me a plate of lima beans with a few stalks of asparagus tossed in and I'm more inclined to push away the plate and go look for some good waffles instead. Edited October 28, 2010 by garfield Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WOOHOO Posted October 28, 2010 Share Posted October 28, 2010 Maybe this is an "Aha" moment (or a "Woohoo" moment) because I'm going to admit that there is a possibility that someone in the stands, on any given show night, came expressly because someone else told them that some drum corps are adopting a show design that's intended to agitate instead of entertain. It certainly is possible that drum corps could become the Blair Witch of art entertainment and attract fans who are entertained by 11 minutes of discomfort. To the extent that such programming draws fans not otherwise inclined to attend a drum corps show I can't hardly complain about the tactic.But just as Maplethorpe's "PissChrist" exhibit, I see those attracted to an "Evening Extravaganze Of Dissonant Chords And Discomfort" not as the future broad appeal of Drum Corps Major League. Yeah, it's probably just me, but I see the mass of fans falling within one standard deviation of what drum corps fans have always been. Now don't get me wrong; I think dissimilarity among all the corps' productions, and not the "Standard Template" of the current success model, is what keeps the activity (and DCP discussion) interesting. But, for me (and yes, it may be just me), if 6 of the top 12 on finals night adopted the '10BD model of "dissonant discomfort" in their show programming I'd be much less inclined to attend the show. Give me a plate of asparagus with a few lima beans thrown in and I'll probably eat. But give me a plate of lima beans with a few stalks of asparagus tossed in and I'm more inclined to push away the plate and go look for some good waffles instead. Do you think that happened last year, or has any chance of actually happening? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted October 28, 2010 Share Posted October 28, 2010 (edited) Do you think that happened last year, or has any chance of actually happening? Obviously No, it didn't happen last year else we'd have many more Dissonant Discomfort comments directed at corps other than BD. And I have little faith in what "I" think will happen in the future. I never thought A&E would be adopted widely, that random drawing for finals wouldn't work, that G to Bb was important, that mallet players weren't heard with proper technique, that 13 to 11 1/2 was a good thing, that 150 from 130 actually made financial sense, or that we'd have a G7. And the camel's nose intentionally looks unfamiliar the first time it peeks under the tent, so I think it's entirely possible that the Dissonant Discomfort programming template could certainly take hold. Edited October 28, 2010 by garfield Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WOOHOO Posted October 28, 2010 Share Posted October 28, 2010 Obviously No, it didn't happen last year else we'd have many more Dissonant Discomfort comments directed at corps other than BD. And I have little faith in what "I" think will happen in the future. I never thought A&E would be adopted widely, that random drawing for finals wouldn't work, that G to Bb was important, that mallet players weren't heard with proper technique, that 13 to 11 1/2 was a good thing, that 150 from 130 actually made financial sense, or that we'd have a G7. So I think it's entirely possible that the Dissonant Discomfort programming template could certainly take hold. I don't think so. I didn't see BD trying to change the way drum corps is and was, I think they were just trying to do something new. If other corps are going to try and mimic that style, thinking that was why they won, then they will be in for a rude awakening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumno5 Posted October 28, 2010 Share Posted October 28, 2010 Absolutly not! The beautiful moments of release/resolve with la Suerta and Laura are how you know where you were. It's an emotional ride designed to challenge your ears and eyes. Like the brief resolve to Laura at the end, you would expect it to carry out to the end (expect being the opertative word), but it only visits the phrase and than releases to an obscure and dissonant cresendo. Oh, I agree with you, most definitely - I loved their show. I was posing my question to the poster (audiodb, I think?) who alluded to uncomfortable being "the only emotion evoked by the show." I'm wondering whether he's talking about B.D. 2010 in particular, or making a broader generalization. Fred O. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumno5 Posted October 28, 2010 Share Posted October 28, 2010 Let's recap:1 - Thread is about why drum corps is dying... 2 - Some suggested .... 4 - References were made... . I responded... 5 - Off to the races Off to the races indeed - this thread has become quite a wild ride! Thanks to everyone for the invigorating discussion. regards, Fred O. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audiodb Posted October 28, 2010 Share Posted October 28, 2010 Have I lost the whole direction of this discussion, or are you saying that the only emotion you get from the B.D. 2010 show is discomfort - that it just makes you "uncomfortable" from start to finish? I was only alluding to the reactions of others. The show didn't make me uncomfortable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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