Questions for the Dinos!

[DAvery]

Here is what I remember about the "pit".

1978 Kilties were the first to use concert tympani. I do not think there was a rule against grounded instruments. There was a rule against wheels on the field. The Kilties rolled the tympani out and then removed the wheels. I know Guardsmen used some concert percussion in 1979, but I can not remember if they had wheels or not. I am also not sure when the "wheel" rule was eliminated.

Before 1982 (I think) all concert percussion instruments where on the field. That's when the actual "pit" was created.

[lindap]

...Never was a huge fan of concert numbers. I found most of them to be very boring. There were a few exceptions...1971 2-7's Chicago medley being one GREAT concert number.

During more than 'a few exceptions' and as a drum major for 7 years, concert numbers weren't boring to me; it was a showcase of sound, that often expressed the emotion of the day, concert changed from contest to contest. Concerts were special for me, it's hard to explain in words.

The people that seemed bored during concert were the guard, standing still making sure their heels were together, no space between the fingers, standing straight while it was raining or windy; the flag was stuck to your shako, plume or face. There was nothing you can do but puff with a big breath and try to gently push the flag off your face while the judge wasn't looking ;-)

[wvu80]

And don't get me started on clean = loud. That is utter balderdash.

Oh, you can argue with me and win. I'm just a fan.

But you'll have to argue with the Bridgemen. I'll try to do some research to see where my fading memory has taken me, but back in the day of those great drum lines they started a tune with a simple roll-off (I think Barnum and Bailey's Favorite, but I'm also thinking 1980 at Huntington, WV). It was done PERFECTLY together, and to this day it is the single loudest thing I've ever heard a battery do. Of course they played it hard, but they played it together which is what made it so loud.

I guarantee you a perfectly played drum lick is MUCH louder than a garbled one.

Come to think of it, you could probably argue with my addled memory and win on that count, too.

Edited September 5, 2010 by wvu80

[scouttimp]

Here is what I remember about the "pit".

1978 Kilties were the first to use concert tympani. I do not think there was a rule against grounded instruments. There was a rule against wheels on the field. The Kilties rolled the tympani out and then removed the wheels. I know Guardsmen used some concert percussion in 1979, but I can not remember if they had wheels or not. I am also not sure when the "wheel" rule was eliminated.

Before 1982 (I think) all concert percussion instruments where on the field. That's when the actual "pit" was created.

Correct me if I'm wrong- didn't Garfield have the first completely grounded melodic ensemble (bells, xylo, vibes, marimba and timps) in '81?

Then, in '82, everyone used grounded instruments, but on the field, with the "pit" being created in '83.

Man, that 27 timp line could play, no?

[tommytimp]

Correct me if I'm wrong- didn't Garfield have the first completely grounded melodic ensemble (bells, xylo, vibes, marimba and timps) in '81?

Then, in '82, everyone used grounded instruments, but on the field, with the "pit" being created in '83.

Man, that 27 timp line could play, no?

Garfield had three marching instruments (actually bells, vibes, and xylo) sitting on horn cases down front, with a timbale setup and five grounded marching timps. Five players. A few other corps used their marching keys and had legs on them-Avant Garde and Bridgemen come to mind. Spirit had concert timps, concert vibes and concert xylophone, so if we must, I'd call them the first grounded melodic ensemble. But yes, your memory is correct re: Garfield. But the "pit" off the field was created for the 82 season.

Bridgemen 81:

Garfield 81:

Spirit 81:

And here is a sample pit from 82, VK, down front and off the field:

And oh my yes, those 27 timp lines were the shiznit. I wonder how long those guys were together.

Here's 1981:

And 83, which I like to call "Charlie Poole's Hit-n-Crank Timpani-porium:"

For obvious reasons, I'm glad this thread has turned into a de facto discussion on the history of the pit. I could talk about this stuff all day, but hopefully these photos will help answer some questions.

[MarimbasaurusRex]

Here is what I remember about the "pit".

1978 Kilties were the first to use concert tympani. I do not think there was a rule against grounded instruments. There was a rule against wheels on the field. The Kilties rolled the tympani out and then removed the wheels. I know Guardsmen used some concert percussion in 1979, but I can not remember if they had wheels or not. I am also not sure when the "wheel" rule was eliminated.

Before 1982 (I think) all concert percussion instruments where on the field. That's when the actual "pit" was created.

Indeed there was a rule against grounded instruments. Corps that did it took a penalty. Grounding during concert was allowed. Kilties did it because they didn't have enough players and felt the penalty would be offset by a better GE score for having tympani versus not having them. (I was the melodic perc instructor for Blue Stars in 80 and 81 and had to learn the rule book.)

[Blackstar]

This thread reminds me of a thread on a firefighter discussion board I'm on. ""We talk about riding the back of the engine and wearing hip boots and the guys freak out. Only difference is that we know things are easier now and we did it better back then

[DAvery]

Indeed there was a rule against grounded instruments. Corps that did it took a penalty. Grounding during concert was allowed. Kilties did it because they didn't have enough players and felt the penalty would be offset by a better GE score for having tympani versus not having them. (I was the melodic perc instructor for Blue Stars in 80 and 81 and had to learn the rule book.)

I went back and looked at the recaps for 78 KIlties and 79 Guardsmen, both corps I know used grounded instruments. It seems that both corps, as most BITD, had penalties through out the season. For example in 1979 10 of the 12 finals coprs had a penalty.

I remember seeing the Kilties at the US open in 78. They did wheel the tympani out and then removed the wheels. I asked a couple of people why and they said having wheels on the field was against the rules. Ironically, this was the only show from 78 that I could find where the Kilties to not get a penalty.

When did the rule change to allow gounded instruments?

[Tim Coffey]

Spirit 81:

Twelve snares (w/side bongos!). Seven each tenors and basses. Now that is what I call a battery!

(And they could throw down the notes too)

[mobrien]

Pits were first allowed over the front sideline in 82 - I recall that Phantom was considered very innovative because they had 2 sets of concert tymps - one at each side of the pit.

Cavaliers also had two sets of tymps (a set of four and a three) in the pit in 82 (mirroring their split sets of tenors, high and low). For whatever reason, Cavaliers still marched the keyboards, however.