chaos001 Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 One of the things I have stated over and over again in my periodic rants about DCI over the years was that for a long time now it has not been about the activity but about protecting the lucrative gigs of a handful of people in the activity. I think its safe to say that opinion is being confirmed by the current goings on. They created a model that only they prospered from, which worked to the detriment of the activity as a whole and now after essentially running DCI through a titular sanctioning board, they are trying to make the ludicrous assertion that it is not them who have been running things at all and brought the activity to this pass. Frankly I believe DCI should expel Blue Devils, Cadets, SCV, Crown, Bluecoats and Phantom and go about the business of rebuilding the activity into something the fans can enjoy again. The previously named corps would be free to go pursue financial rewards for their managers under the guise of a youth activity, but at the same time its clear their 501-3© status should be revoked. DCI has to be reformed into an organization that rules out suiciding itself in pursuit of goals that are not the interests of the most amount of participants and fans. Get out the professional pageantry folks now. But if you expel them, DCI won't survive. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Freedman Posted November 19, 2012 Author Share Posted November 19, 2012 Dan is doing a great job keeping the entire activity financially sustainable; he also knows that the demise of the activity would come if the performance, touring, artistic demands/expenditures overwhelmed the potential revenue sources. Moreover, he realizes there are people within the world of drum corps who overestimate their, and the activity's, importance within the real world of entertainment; and that an activity cannot grow past that interest level without inevitably collapsing in on itself. Therein is the cavern of contention within the activity because the G7 directors apparently think that they are, or can be, on the entertainment and revenue level of U2. So, Dan not only has my support as a fan, but he also appears to have the backing of all corps directors outside the G7. I agree that Dan seems to have key strengths as a leader of DCI, but I also agree that those strengths may not be up to the task of saving DCI from the G7. I can see two ways the G7 can destroy DCI: 1. Music in Motion shows (or whatever it's called) draw off just enough support for drum corps that the touring model finally collapses for all other corps, which thus go extinct. 2. See 1. I think my thought was that it could be intentional or unintentional, but either way the result is the same. RIP DCI. Since this is a thread about evidence, I would still like to see evidence that the G7 have considered the complete replacement of DCI with MiM. So far we have the unconfirmed emails showing a splinter drum corps league (possibly Music in Motion) but not, say, the discussion of the possibility of those shows increasing in number to the point where it would be a complete rival league, or even the suggestion that DCI 'can't survive'. Such evidence may not exist, but if it does, it is critical that we see it... I'm still processing the evidence we have. It's pretty bad. I'd like validation of the email. I suppose I could throw it at Hop, or one of the others and see if they deny it. If they don't, that's essentially an admission. If it's valid, it's essential that Dan sees it. It may be the thorn that wakes the dragon! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soccerguy315 Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 I think it's not overstating things to say that Blue Devils, Cadets, SCV, Cavaliers, Crown, Phantom are the most influential groups in the marching arts activity. Phantom is very lucky they are still in existence, after their recent financial issues. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaos001 Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Phantom is very lucky they are still in existence, after their recent financial issues. The debt was mostly from the '90's. Things got a lot better after Seidling and Valenzuela took over. However, the debt had compounded and needed to be handled. It was and they have moved on and have been turning a profit for years now. I think that they joined the G7 just to stay alive. Either go with them or die with the remaining in DCI. At least that's what I want to believe. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Freedman Posted November 19, 2012 Author Share Posted November 19, 2012 But if you expel them, DCI won't survive. I disagree. There are so many niche sports and activities like DCI. And in each of them, the fans seem to come for the top acts. But it's really the activity itself that draws them. Here are the scenarios: 1. DCI kicks out G7, which still exist as Music in Motion: DCI has a huge challenge in leveraging fan loyalty to keep the fan base. My guess is, DCI survives, but loses some revenue. 2. DCI kicks out G7 before it has time to consolidate into Music in Motion: Tragic for those 7 corps (since they fail in this scenario), but the fans dutifully follow the best of the rest as the new top acts. Of course, the G7 staff and members promptly migrate to DCI, and the non-G7 corps are better than ever! The fans are happy. In a way, it's our own loyalty to the G7 corps that keep us (and possibly Dan Acheson) from acting against the G7. But if we are more loyal to the kids in all the drum corps than to our memory of these few corps, then who are we to protect the G7 leadership from killing their own corps, if that's what they are hell-bent to do? Did that make sense? As to whether they COULD expel them... now that's an interesting question. Thoughts of court costs and huge lawyers fees dance not-like-sugar-plums through my head. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soccerguy315 Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 1. DCI kicks out G7, which still exist as Music in Motion: DCI has a huge challenge in leveraging fan loyalty to keep the fan base. My guess is, DCI survives, but loses some revenue. 2. DCI kicks out G7 before it has time to consolidate into Music in Motion: Tragic for those 7 corps (since they fail in this scenario), but the fans dutifully follow the best of the rest as the new top acts. Of course, the G7 staff and members promptly migrate to DCI, and the non-G7 corps are better than ever! The fans are happy. In a way, it's our own loyalty to the G7 corps that keep us (and possibly Dan Acheson) from acting against the G7. But if we are more loyal to the kids in all the drum corps than to our memory of these few corps, then who are we to protect the G7 leadership from killing their own corps, if that's what they are hell-bent to do? Did that make sense? so... perhaps the best play is for DCI to kick them out ASAP? If these corps are going to leave, it might be best for the rest of DCI to get rid of them while they are weak and can't do as much damage to DCI. just throwing that out there. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HockeyDad Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 So I think I've lost my place in this thread. Are we now back to boycotting the G7? If they took their ball and bat and would just leave, already, then I'd know for sure what shows to not attend. It's hard to do, however, when they're half in and half out of dci. You can't have it both ways, fellas. Well maybe they can if Dan keeps giving into them. Man up, Dan, do what's best for those corps NOT trying to trash you. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnZ Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Alleged email and related discussions have been removed 1. posting email was contrary to the Community Guidelines. 2. authenticity cannot be verified (not really relevant - see #1). thanks all. z Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Freedman Posted November 19, 2012 Author Share Posted November 19, 2012 so... perhaps the best play is for DCI to kick them out ASAP? If these corps are going to leave, it might be best for the rest of DCI to get rid of them while they are weak and can't do as much damage to DCI. just throwing that out there. I'm no expert on rebellions, but it seems to me that you have to be willing to get hurt in order to defend yourself. DCI must be willing to lose the G7. Once they face that fact themselves they can make it clear to the G7, and then it probably won't be necessary. If the email is valid, a split seems inevitable if DCI allows the TOC shows to continue. If the board simply stops the TOC shows (for 2014 if it's too late for 2013) then the G7 whines and DCI is hopefully saved. It may also be necessary to create a new rule that DCI corps may not participate in shows not authorized by DCI (or "non-DCI shows which appear to be essentially composed of DCI drum corps" or some such). This would force the G7, in order to split at all, to create enough shows to sustain them entirely, which seems unlikely. If they can, then they would probably have done it eventually anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Boo Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 I figured it was probably a business decision. Perhaps that is similar reasoning for the G7 corps who have entertained to notion of exploring other avenues of performance/revenue making outside of DCI. I suspect that it would be a tenuous correlation between the G7 and the combine, but maybe food for thought... Thanks for the clarification. I think I vaguely remember your DCI article; any chance you can put up a link to the article for us? Sorry my first response to you got accidentally deleted along with the related discussions to the posting that could not be verified and was contrary to Community Guidelines. If you e-mail me your address, I'll return the e-mail with a link to the article. boomike@aol.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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