World wide block on DCI DVDs/CD...?

[N.E. Brigand]

I believe the copyright rules are kind of funky when it comes doing an arrangement of an arrangement: it's my understanding that if you are doing an arrangement of a piece that someone else already arranged, you need to only get permission for the original piece, and not the arrangement.

Complicated, I know. Essentially, I think Blue Devils ONLY need to get permission for Rite of Spring, and the arrangements (the "Rewrite of Spring," or the jazz arrangement of "Rite of Spring"), unless featuring original work that is of such significance to warrant its own copyright claims, are fair game.

There was a recent controversy when the Fox TV show GLEE used an incredible folksy arrangement of "Baby Got Back" originally arranged, produced, and recorded by Jonathan Coulton. When Glee decided to use his arrangement, they ONLY needed to get permission from Sir Mix-a-lot, even though they blatantly ripped off Coulton's arrangement. Coulton didn't even KNOW Fox was using his piece: they didn't even give him a "we're going to be using your arrangement on our program on this date" type of notification! Unfortunately for Jonathan Coulton, there was no legal recourse because he only did (a highly entertaining and original) cover song, and since Sir Mix-a-lot got his royalty and gave permission Fox was in the clear.

If that's the case, then Blue Devils only need to get permission from Stravinsky's estate, though that might be different international rules. Or perhaps the other artists have original content BD used that I'm not familiar with.

Anyway, legal mumbo jumbo of the day...

Interesting. Here (pdf) is a U.S. government document on copyright of derivative works like arrangements. From that document, it appears that Coulton ought to be able to copyright his arrangement. However, according to this article, it seems that the license that Coulton received was limited and did not allow him to copyright his own work:

A compulsory license includes the privilege of making a musical arrangement of the work to the extent necessary to conform it to the style or manner of interpretation of the performance involved, but the arrangement shall not change the basic melody or fundamental character of the work, and shall not be subject to protection as a derivative work under this title, except with the express consent of the copyright owner.

(In fact, as that article notes, Coulton may have violated the terms of the license by arranging "Baby Got Back" so differently from the original.)

So as far as Blue Devils' show, it would matter what kind of permission Sebesky received from the rights holder of the original "Rite of Spring", and whether it allowed him to copyright his work or not.

[N.E. Brigand]

Perhaps other nations should loosen up their ridiculously strict copyright laws? (Well, U.S. copyright terms are already ridiculous: thank you, Disney. So perhaps the international codes should be termed "absurd". Nothing should be under copyright a century after its creation.)

[Michael Boo]

Am I the only one that can't find the International tab?

What a slap in the face this is to "Non US" people - thanks DCI!!!! I feel the love!

Mike

It's not a slap to "non-US people" at all. A slap would be to not even offer a disc. DCI can't legally do what is illegal to do.

DCI.org > Shop (Upper right corner) > 2013 Audio/Video (International Option Preorder is the bottom option)

Edited September 11, 2013 by Michael Boo

[shhmatt]

Perhaps other nations should loosen up their ridiculously strict copyright laws? (Well, U.S. copyright terms are already ridiculous: thank you, Disney. So perhaps the international codes should be termed "absurd". Nothing should be under copyright a century after its creation.)

Their system is just different, it is not really better or worse. There are works that are public domain outside of the US, that are still under copyright in the US. The Rite of Spring just happens to fall into the class of works that are public domain in the US and not outside the US. In just 8 years, The Rite of Spring (along with all of Stravinsky's works) will be public domain in Canada, the EU, and Japan (assuming that international copyright laws don't change by then)

[jjeffeory]

Am I the only one that can't find the International tab?

What a slap in the face this is to "Non US" people - thanks DCI!!!! I feel the love!

Mike

Here is the page with all the DVDs. The international version is the third one to the right: http://www.dcistore.org/2013-Audio_Video/products/74/

Here's the resulting page if you click on the link mentioned above:

http://www.dcistore.org/2013-DCI-Top-12-DVD-International-Option-Preorder/productinfo/DVD13T12ITP/

[jjeffeory]

Their system is just different, it is not really better or worse. There are works that are public domain outside of the US, that are still under copyright in the US. The Rite of Spring just happens to fall into the class of works that are public domain in the US and not outside the US. In just 8 years, The Rite of Spring (along with all of Stravinsky's works) will be public domain in Canada, the EU, and Japan (assuming that international copyright laws don't change by then)

Gotta follow the Berne Convention and the Buenos Aires Convention...

I bet DCI isn't even considering selling a different version to South America where Stravinsky's work is probably in the Public domain because they signed onto the Buenos Aires Convention instead of the Berne Convention.

[Guardguy89]

Here is the page with all the DVDs. The international version is the third one to the right: http://www.dcistore.org/2013-Audio_Video/products/74/

Here's the resulting page if you click on the link mentioned above:

http://www.dcistore.org/2013-DCI-Top-12-DVD-International-Option-Preorder/productinfo/DVD13T12ITP/

Thanks - but honesty I'm not shelling out over $100$ for a DVD missing the Blue Devils. Guess I'll just buy it next summer at a show in the States. That should solve it.

Later,

Mike

[skywhopper]

If that's the case, then Blue Devils only need to get permission from Stravinsky's estate, though that might be different international rules. Or perhaps the other artists have original content BD used that I'm not familiar with.

Except that Rite of Spring is public domain in the US, thus no need to get permission from Sebesky or Brenzel either then?

Edited September 12, 2013 by skywhopper

[Pete Freedman]

Except that Rite of Spring is public domain in the US, thus no need to get permission from Sebesky or Brenzel either then?

According to N.E. Brigand's post, it would likely depend (in part) on the kind of license that Sebesky and Brenzel purchased.

This brings up all the arrangements sold by drum corps arrangers to bands. If this information is correct than the drum corps arranger can only charge for the rights to their arrangement if the corps purchased the correct license. Granted, sitting there transcribing the arrangement off of Fan Network would probably be a challenge, so just buying it makes sense for that reason alone. Still, I wonder how many people buy these arrangements without knowing whether they really have to.

[Pete Freedman]

It's not a slap to "non-US people" at all. A slap would be to not even offer a disc. DCI can't legally do what is illegal to do.

DCI.org > Shop (Upper right corner) > 2013 Audio/Video (International Option Preorder is the bottom option)

Don't you mean expensive?

It would be nice for DCI to have written a news article acknowledging the problem so the OP wouldn't have to go to another source (DCP) to answer a question about DCI.