Im sorry DCI, you need to fix the scoring again

[GUARDLING]

Many great points.

The boxes are for the staff to address things in the show.

You've never found it irritating to get comments saying you're in one box only to be scored in the next lower box? I've heard that one many times from others.

....and no Blue Devils (especially, 16 and counting) are going to figure out what it takes to do well under whatever system, just as I do when I'm presented with a rubric for a class.

I'm sure there are other staff who find fault with any of the sheets just as much as an educated fan because I've heard some of the criticisms by enough people involved. You have to deal with what you got, though.

sure, not everybody is going to like every system. I have surely at times thought I should be in one box and then in another BUT at least it shows me exactly where to go and even what to do. If the boxes are gone I think it's to wide open and all over the place. Although I get what you are saying and although the boxes arent where I want to be at a given time , it shows me where I am in relation to others ( agree or not ) and how much I have to do to move . Boxes may put parameters around ourselves but it becomes an accomplishment to bust out of one, You know you are making progress BUT it does the same for a judge. he or she has made a statement getting you out of one box and into another . They have actually said something at that point, and when someone says something they can be held accountable. ( hopefully )..lol.

[Pete Freedman]

For the record, by my count off the Semis video, BD horn line stood still for about 2:30 and moved for 8:04.

However, they do stop frequently for about 1-5 seconds each time (anything more than about 3 seconds I counted above).

Much of the "marching" is a kind of casual saunter, which fits their jazz style well but doesn't look remotely as difficult as what Cavvies and Cadets call drill.

The body movement seems quite sophisticated and quirky, but I don't buy the argument that it is particularly difficult just because it's more integrated somehow. They do climb over the tables near the beginning and do nicely coordinated kneel-wiggling (?) in the middle. But the others have at least as much body movement.

There were several big drill moves of course, and these looked quite difficult. But nothing on the scale (either speed or length) of say Crown's endless finale rotation thingy.

So, based on the hornline, I don't agree that they park and blow at all really (not more than anyone else); they just pause for effect a lot. However, the drill does look a lot less difficult overall.

All these years we've heard the same argument about their drill, and I do think it has some validity. But the standing still argument is just wrong.

[Kamarag]

The body movement seems quite sophisticated and quirky, but I don't buy the argument that it is particularly difficult just because it's more integrated somehow. They do climb over the tables near the beginning and do nicely coordinated kneel-wiggling (?) in the middle. But the others have at least as much body movement.

Most body movement is indeed easy. Where it becomes demanding (for any corps) is when you start adding weight shifts and center of gravity shifts. That kind of movement is tremendously difficult, as well as difficult to clean, particularly while playing. The Blue Devils and Crown have employed a lot of this the lasts few years, and the Bluecoats joined them a bit this year. Madison had a few instances of this too, though they had some achievement issues.

Factor in this kid of movement in and around props (Devils, Bluecoats), or in and around partners (a long-time Crown staple), and you really drive up the difficulty level.

[Jeff Ream]

Go away with your logic and facts.

sorry. i know logic doesnt always win on here

[Jeff Ream]

People are only complaining about all of this because it's BD.

I guarantee you that you would not hear one word of complaint if we were talking about Carolina Crown or Phantom Regiment about to break highest score ever. Not bagging on either one of of those fine groups, but it's just the way things work around here I guess.

It's only bad because it's the Blue Devils.

Sheesh, people. Suck it up, put your big girl panties on and appreciate a #### fine drum corps performing a #### fine show.

agreed. Look I've not been one of BD's biggest fans the last several years, but they deserved it and more this year. I'm sure if it had been Crown last year, to many it'd be ok.

and to those of us who realize their percussion wasn't at the top would be yelling

[Jeff Ream]

It is a fact that a 20 doesn't mean perfect. It's part of the training for new judges, and professional development for old judges. It's not an opinion, it's DCI judging philosophy and policy. If it did mean perfect, no judge that saw even the slightest mistake could ever give one out...and that system went away after 1983.

if a corps meets the criteria on the sheets for a 9.9...and some did....and then someone comes out better..what else is left to give? a 10. that's it.

and because of the talent on the field and designing the shows...you'll see those 9.9's and 10's

[Jeff Ream]

Doesn't numbers management play a role here? If a judge starts the lowest corps high, then there's less room near the top, and a higher chance of someone maxing out.

Bd is phenomenal this year, but a 100 in GE2 content at Prelims? Seems like bad management during the day

but...if a corps meets the criteria on the sheet for an 8.8, do you hold them down so you avoid the 10?

now if someone is getting 10's and there's other corps left to compete. there's an issue. But if they are ranking and rating properly using the sheets and the criteria on them and the last corps gets some 10's? Ok

[Jeff Ream]

This is the thing that confuses me, because it seems that ranking is more important and if a corps is in Box 5, they could potentially get bumped down to Box 4 scoring even though they fit Box 5 criteria. That type of thing really galls me.

Of course I don't care if there's a ties somewhere, so there's that too. Seems like we need a more granular judging system that maintains Rating as well as Ranking.

so you just want to throw out a score, then rank later?

ok, so SCV comes out in 4th. you want them to get a 10 in percussion, knowing 3 more are to go, just because you want to rate them there.

well, what if the remaining three is better? You don't have a 10.1 available. You have to rank, then rate

[Jeff Ream]

Which is another reason we need to get the judges off the field. The tick system is long gone, yet we still see judges running all over the field. Last night while Boston performed their amazing new arrangement of Conquest I saw a drum judge sprinting towards the battery. This is vestige of the old tick system that is distracting...... and Lord knows we have enough visual distractions cluttering the field already.

in a dome, you are not going to be able to hear a battery upstairs like you can up close. in fact, with huge brass lines and amps, you're going to have a hard time hearing anything.

oh and the corps keep voting to keep the judges there

[Pete Freedman]

in a dome, you are not going to be able to hear a battery upstairs like you can up close. in fact, with huge brass lines and amps, you're going to have a hard time hearing anything.

oh and the corps keep voting to keep the judges there

Yes, I would think the field judge can much more easily distinguish between individuals, for example to make sure each person is contributing equally, and errors get smoothed over at a distance.

Besides, it puts more pressure on the members. And don't they just LOVE it!