Bsader Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 (edited) Defensiveness as if their is something hidden? Wouldn't that imply a level of "unnecessary paranoia" on my part? I think your suggestion that I am trying to divert this post is to impugn my motivations so as to divert my attention from this post. This is very clever on your part. Anyways, I did contribute a previous response just prior to the one that has caused you so much obvious anxiety. Did you miss that one? It ain't overly insightful but it ain't bad. Let's say we get back to perusing the ramifications of....? #### you, you've diverted my attention. Edited September 23, 2014 by Bsader Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Schmitt Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Does anybody remember the "one trigger, one event" thing from WGI eleventy billion years ago? That's kind of where I am with this. Otherwise, why not prerecord soloists, even sequence the entire show with a click and place a speaker on the back hash. If some things are ok and some are not I think this point is a logical dividing line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soccerguy315 Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 if you can pre-record the entire horn line, surely you can pre-record one soloist... right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bsader Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 (edited) If you can pre-record the entire horn line, surely you can pre-record one soloist... right? Does this mean that the Blue Coats "special effect" opened the door to an entire sea of gray? Let's hope we don't drown ourselves. It would be tough to give up on that moment the Blue Coats provided us in order to enforce the rules in a strict black and white manner. I wish you hadn't asked that question. ' Edited September 23, 2014 by Bsader Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Does anybody remember the "one trigger, one event" thing from WGI eleventy billion years ago? That's kind of where I am with this. Otherwise, why not prerecord soloists, even sequence the entire show with a click and place a speaker on the back hash. If some things are ok and some are not I think this point is a logical dividing line. current WGI Rule “No single, triggered, electronic sound may produce rhythmic intent. Lyrics with rhythmic intent may be triggered on a per word basis. Spoken word phrases without rhythmic intent may be performed with a single trigger.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cixelsyd Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Right, but there seems to be some confusion about what sort of prerecording is allowed. Obviously there has been plenty of prerecorded voice lately, some of it by people who aren't even performing on the field, and with Bluecoats 2014, even plainly prerecorded brass. When synthesizers were approved starting in 2009, there was a "one stroke, one note" rule. That restriction seems to have fallen by the wayside but without many fans ever noticing an announcement of the change. One thing at a time: First, let me preface my comments by admitting that I do not have a DCI rule book. Would be nice if we could hear from someone who does, lest the rest of us only add to the confusion. I do not recall a "one stroke, one note" condition ever mentioned in the DCI rule proposals. I do recall "sequencing" being disallowed, though, and I have seen synth players breaking up pre-recorded material into pieces during a performance (especially Music City the year they did their Phantom of the Grand Ole Opry show). Much of the confusion stems from rules like these only applying to the show proper. It seems that during the pre-show, quite a number of additional things are permitted. Sequencing is the most obvious one that is utilized there. The casual viewer may not be aware of when the pre-show ends and the show proper starts. As for pre-recorded brass, I still think that is against the rules... but I knew before we ever approved anything electronic that it would be impossible to draw a line in the sand over which electronic sounds are "legal" and which are not. As far as I know, one such line was drawn to prohibit simulation of brass; clearly, Bluecoats danced all over that line until you could no longer find it in the sand. At the same time, I saw them in June, July and August, and not once did the sample blaring through those speakers sound to me like an authentic brass sample. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xandandl Posted September 23, 2014 Author Share Posted September 23, 2014 I too agree that what Bluecoats (one word) did was an obvious modulation of their hornline so that all hearing knew it was not meant as a mere duplication of the live performers but a change. And it worked very well. Cixelsyd raises some great nuances and clarifications. Some of what cixelsyd presents grasps another facet of the subject of the thread. When DCI rules are compared to WGI (whether indoor percussion or guard or now winter winds) or BOA or another band circuit, the reality rears its head that the designers/instructors/techs now often do the marching activity in all 3 arenas. What is peculiar to one sometimes glosses to match the other two. Sometimes DCI is a trend setter, as often and perhaps more, it is playing catch-up. Let's face it, there are about 25,000 high schools in the U.S., 6000 colleges/universities/schools of higher learning but only less than four dozen competing drum corps. The numbers of minds, imaginations, and resources is much greater in the world of WGI and the band circuits merely by the numbers. How something is effective for one arena is now almost de rigeur for the other two arenas because the major designers are writing for bands, drumlines, guards AND corps. Thus the standard protocol today almost presumes "that line" is danced on and over. Penalties, other than practicing in a restricted area, are non existent today. (Should the T&P judge be dropped and replaced with an electronics judge???) The OP questions become more complicated unless one follows MikeD's thinking to allow everything anytime for DCI (in costumes, not uniforms, right Mike?) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xandandl Posted September 23, 2014 Author Share Posted September 23, 2014 before someone asks where I got the numbers, the answer. For part of my life I was a guidance counsellor and these are the "industry numbers" used by NEA, USCEA, College board, etc. No there are not 25K marching bands or even 25K music depts. (unfortunately) nor 6K college bands. But there are that many thinking faculties and staffs from which our music performances and visual performances benefit from ideas, new offerings, and other perspectives. Back to the discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corpsband Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 So...we're concerned that a corps is going to substitute a pre-recorded brass performance segment for a live performance segment and no one's going to know. The problem with "getting away" with this is pretty fundamental. 150 performers will know. 30-50 staff members will know. Many parents and fans will know (because they go to practices duh) . But somehow, someway the corps is going to keep this BIG SECRET from everyone else? REALLY? gotta love conspiracy theories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xandandl Posted September 23, 2014 Author Share Posted September 23, 2014 (edited) like the over-age situations in our World Class DCI history, sometimes many people know but aren't telling. and sometimes it takes quite a while for the rest of us to find out. I know one of those past over-age situations included a 3 year investigation by DCI before it was conclusively brought to light against the corps which investigation revealed that there were a large "several" over age members in fact, though just one was enough to disqualify them. Edited September 23, 2014 by xandandl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts