What is wrong with US?

[TOC]

1 hour ago, Slingerland said:

  Would the horror show of SOA's "talent night" have gone on if a couple of dads were on that bus? Highly unlikely.   

Or a bus driver who contacted the lead driver and said "I'm pulling over for a minute or so to take care of a problem."

[scheherazadesghost]

1 hour ago, HockeyDad said:

I would expect to get a sense of humility coming from SCV and Cadets leadership teams.

I feel exactly the same way. It's what they preached to us when we marched. Drove our faces into the ground about it in some cases.

[MarimbaManiac]

4 minutes ago, scheherazadesghost said:

I feel exactly the same way. It's what they preached to us when we marched. Drove our faces into the ground about it in some cases.

Lol, humility from VMAPA...go on, tell another one!

[scheherazadesghost]

6 minutes ago, MarimbaManiac said:

Lol, humility from VMAPA...go on, tell another one!

[David Hill]

4 hours ago, Jeff Ream said:

i agree.......and don't agree.

 

sadly talking to those in charge often gets you sunshine and roses answers or flat out ignored. there's some transparency in some places, but drum corps has proven time and time again to be reactionary only after the worst possible case scenarios unfold. sadly too many good intentioned people refuse to open up to let people help, and try to control everything, and make it worse. and in this day and age with lawsuits flying hourly, and it seems the statutes of limitations being widened to bring old wounds forward, airing laundry sometimes is sadly the only way to get change and transparency to happen.

 

it's a double edged sword indeed.  but until the corps themselves get ahead of #### before it breaks and be open, it's the world we live in today. if you think it's bad here, check out Reddit

Mr. Ream is correct.

The entire administrative set-up of DCI is fraught. There are no checks and balances built into the system. So guess what; said checks and balances come from interested parties from outside, and inside, the organizations involved. Only problem? We have no teeth to affect change. Should be a better way.

[Jeff Ream]

2 hours ago, HockeyDad said:

Beautifully written.  It’s a weird thing - I would expect to get a sense of humility coming from SCV and Cadets leadership teams. Instead it feels like we’re getting attitude. 

yeah. i feel for them in one way...they're getting beat up on all fronts. now that doesn't excuse the reactions they displayed, but i can understand the frustration and pressure they're under.

 

but as for stuff getting out online.....well...Cadets 18, the big explosion, and a few smaller ones til last week. Pioneer. Oregon. Crossmens old director and a certain hire. Spirit. heck this past summer with the BD tenor player. a former Mandarins staff member i think it was?

 

in many of these cases other steps were taken, but what changed? Nothing much, at least til it exploded here, Reddit or the newspapers. which backs up what i said before....drum corps is way too often reactionary, and after it's already beyond reasonable control

[MarimbaManiac]

1 minute ago, Jeff Ream said:

yeah. i feel for them in one way...they're getting beat up on all fronts. now that doesn't excuse the reactions they displayed, but i can understand the frustration and pressure they're under.

 

but as for stuff getting out online.....well...Cadets 18, the big explosion, and a few smaller ones til last week. Pioneer. Oregon. Crossmens old director and a certain hire. Spirit. heck this past summer with the BD tenor player. a former Mandarins staff member i think it was?

 

in many of these cases other steps were taken, but what changed? Nothing much, at least til it exploded here, Reddit or the newspapers. which backs up what i said before....drum corps is way too often reactionary, and after it's already beyond reasonable control

It's not just drum corps. People want to say that current generations are too sensitive, or too willing to complain, but the reality is that through social media/technology the world has become more accountable, for better or worse. 

Are there more instances of police brutality lately? DEFINITELY not, but there are now cameras everywhere. 

Are there more instances of people acting up in public? Likely not, but there are now cameras everywhere. 

Are there more issues of sexual harassment/inappropriate behavior? Likely not, but social media makes accountability easier to achieve. 

Like it or not people have more agency to call attention to issues that have been longstanding, and are using that agency to speak out against things they don't like. That CAN go too far sometimes, but how many times have we seen stories of police misconduct being taken seriously by authorities months or YEARS after the actual incident, ONLY because video finally surfaced?

 

[Terri Schehr]

11 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said:

yeah. i feel for them in one way...they're getting beat up on all fronts. now that doesn't excuse the reactions they displayed, but i can understand the frustration and pressure they're under.

 

but as for stuff getting out online.....well...Cadets 18, the big explosion, and a few smaller ones til last week. Pioneer. Oregon. Crossmens old director and a certain hire. Spirit. heck this past summer with the BD tenor player. a former Mandarins staff member i think it was?

 

in many of these cases other steps were taken, but what changed? Nothing much, at least til it exploded here, Reddit or the newspapers. which backs up what i said before....drum corps is way too often reactionary, and after it's already beyond reasonable control

You and I go further back than that.  It was about ten years ago that we started squawking about questionable people in the activity.  The slings and arrows came our way, too. 

You’re right.  We’ve moved from square one to square one A. 

[Jeff Ream]

2 hours ago, GUARDLING said:

You're right but even then ,where information comes from on either side is only as good as those giving it.  Not to re- litigate as certain director and his boundary  issues , the same people who exposed him ( which was a good thing ) are the same who kissed his butt for decades, in the inner circle, supported and defended, encouraged and stood by his side and it was only when he no longer needed them ( no surprise there )  there were private meetings on how to take him down. One can maybe say , " Well maybe they didn't now " unlikely IMO how do you spend decades , that closely and not know, there's always signs within someones behavior if one chooses to see it. These predators can for sure be very crafty hiding who they are BUT I always say when someone shows themselves as to who they really are BELIEVE THEM., and this particular person always showed who they were.

Haven't we always  seen those appearing to have all good intentions, claim to have some kind of inside knowledge, shouting from the roof tops. This does not diminish the importance of ANY alleged victim of ANY situation to be heard BUT must be backed by fact. Now a days as others have said it's always shoot first. I hate to whistle blower  term as much as I hate the woke word but with that said " whistleblowers should always be heard ALWAYS, be taken seriously ALWAYS, met with compassion and concern ALWAYS ,but ALWAYS be based in fact. Whistleblowers lately has gotten a bad name mainly because many who you see on TV meeting at times with congress have mostly been debunked or found out to be having their own legal issues. Why do they do this ? who knows! but there has been alot of it lately. Even with that , even with fact against them , even debunked there are always those who want to believe it or even have a reason . IMO it's a sign of the times where the legit " Whistleblower" can't be heard or taken seriously because of the  other" whistleblower" who does what they do for whatever reason..

Transparency is always a good thing, Shinning a light can always be a good thing, those who shine the light  can always make a difference, good or bad, reputable or not so much, the problem becomes , as we have seen  on TV ,can we tell the difference. For sure a problem for those doing their best to do the right thing or be heard. A sad view of our times.

AS the original poster said in the title "What is wrong with us " says it all about the days we live in. I have my own opinion how it all started but that's another topic not allowed here..lol🙂

 

oh success turns many a blind eye. we've seen that in so many facets of the world

[Jeff Ream]

2 hours ago, MarimbaManiac said:

Yeah, this is a BIG one. Corps, even the biggest ones, have got by for decades on hiring an army of early career staff who basically work for pennies an hour. For every Paul Rennick, there are a dozen low paid techs who float in and out during the season basically working for "experience and exposure."

That does not create a stable foundation with which to provide adequate supervision and support throughout a 3-4 month season. 

Maybe this was effectively in the 70s-80s when someone could survive on gas and lunch money, but the world is more expensive, and more complex, and there are very few people who are in situations to make that work. Inevitably that usually means "staff" are only a year or two removed from being marching members themselves, which again doesn't result in a solid foundation of supervision. 

Honestly I feel like we're reaching a tipping point in the activity as a whole. Corps need to start investing in staff members as employees, building a sustainable culture and knowledge base that's more market resistant with more accountability. Tours will need to be shorter, with more time and focus on "in residence" rehearsals in the corps locality. That of course means recruiting locally instead of out of a national talent pool, and placing visiting members in local members homes. DCI absolutely needs to become more of a regulatory force both operationally and financially, holding corps accountable if they want to participate in the tour. 

All of this is a BIG change, but the message needs to start becoming clear that business as usual just isn't going to work anymore, and if the activity wants to survive the next generation it has to start evolving.

placing members in others homes is a huge risk. so many local and state music festivals got away from this approach for a variety of reasons, and that practice couldn't have ended soon enough