MikeD Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 "Troopers Sunburst":The 'Sunburst' made famous (And a corps "Trademark") by the Casper Troopers was "Originally" done by the old Norwood Park Imperials taught then by Rick Maas. I believe that Jim Jones, the director of the Troopers (And drill instructor), saw Norwood perform it at the 1962 VFW Nationals (Which is where I first saw it) and thought it would "work" for the Troopers. Obiously it was a good choice. Sorry, from what I have been told that is incorrect. It was Don Angelica who suggested that move to Jones when they brought him out to Casper...and he was using already in the Bergenfield band...an early corps-style band under band director Dr Baggs and then Angelica. Not sure if the move was during the Baggs era (when Don was a student there) or the Angelica era, buit it was pre-Troopers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rut-roh Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 Ah, yes, when in doubt attack the messenger. I wonder, though, what response you would have for someone like MikeD, who has been around for decades and who agrees with what I have to say. Or glory, or rut-roh, both of whom have been around longer than I have and defend amplification. ####, Hopkins, the very guy that proposed amplification, was the director of some of the most activity-changing shows we've ever seen. Show me your credentials, and I'm sure that you'll have me beat. But while you're asking me "who are you to be telling us what drum corps should be?", guys like George Hopkins, were they to choose to, could ask you the very same question. What would you say to them? I wager their credentials would have you beat. I make no secret of the fact that I didn't become a fan of that activity until the late 90's. I didn't get to see shows like Cadets '83 or Star '93 live. But I've made an effort to learn, buying the DVD's so that I can see these shows on tape, and asking questions of people who were there. If that's still not good enough for you, if that still isn't enough for me to have an opinion on the activity, then this activity is going to die out pretty quickly. Well said, friend. You have more than held your own around here against people who you openly admit have more experience than you. And what's more, you post with class, intelligence, respect, and as inclusive an outlook on the activity as anyone I've seen. Some of the "experts" around here could learn a lot from people like you. I know I have, and I've been around for a long time. Keep the faith. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Medeabrass Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 "Miss Saigon" "west side story" "Tommy" "Porgy & Bess" "Jesus Christ Superstar" ...a vry few example of roots drum corps shows can be traced back to. You see, drum & Bugle corps didnt need folks singing into microphones, or narrating their way thorugh the show to adapt these shows for the drum corps idiom, they needed "true creativity" to take these ideas and adapt them for the football field. No amps needed for SCV in 1991... Ding ding ding...As you said earlier, no crutches needed. I think this is what makes drum corps special to me. You just reminded me of why I love drum corps so much. We take the limited resources of brass and drums and try to reproduce music and/or productions that, in their original form, may have taken, woodwinds, strings, voice, actors, brass, and percussion to perform. I like seeing how drum corps can still pull off all of the emotion and ideas of the original with the few tools they have at their disposal. I think this crystalizes my objection to amped voices in any form. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elphaba01 Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 (edited) Sorry, from what I have been told that is incorrect. It was Don Angelica who suggested that move to Jones when they brought him out to Casper...and he was using already in the Bergenfield band...an early corps-style band under band director Dr Baggs and then Angelica. Not sure if the move was during the Baggs era (when Don was a student there) or the Angelica era, buit it was pre-Troopers. "Angelica to Casper": The migration of Don Angelica to Natrona County did not happen until late 1963. In late 1963 he was fired from Garfield, and replaced by none other than Hy Drietzer. By then the Troopers were already doing the "Norwood" burst. They had traveled to the Mid West in 1963 and upset several of the then "Big Guns" such as Madison, Bellville and Norwood at a show in Racine WI. Don Angelica was THE reason for the "Overnight Success" of the Troopers. His "residence" in Casper provided them with a great instructor who had immense "connections" in the drum corps "world" of that era. In one season they went from "Casper Who" to "Casper Wow"..... If there are any old "Vets" of late 1950s early 1960s drum corps who remember Norwood Park and the "Circle" feel free to jump in. Elphaba WWW Edited February 16, 2006 by elphaba01 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 "Angelica to Casper":The migration of Don Angelica to Natrona County did not happen until late 1963. He was fired from Garfield, and replaced by none other than Hy Drietzer. By then the Troopers were already doing the "Norwood" burst. Don Angelica was THE reason for the "Overnight Success" of the Troopers. In one season they went from "Casper Who" to "Casper Wow"..... If there are any old "Vets" of late 1950s early 1960s drum corps who remember Norwood Park and the "Circle" feel free to jump in. Elphaba WWW Don't know when Don suggested it (if it was him)...but that is the story I have been told many times since 1972, when Don was our brass guy...by a number of different people. So...who knows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rut-roh Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 (edited) No amps needed for SCV in 1991... You've mentioned a truly creative example here. An example that was the exception rather than the standard of what everyone else was doing. The Bridgemen traffic jam is another. Yes, very creative...at a time when just about every other corps on the field was just playing music and marching around with no such "sound effects." The exceptions were extremely creative, no doubt. That being said, I believe the same will eventually be true of amplification. In the coming years, most corps will use them in the standard way, to varying degrees of success. Just as some of the acoustic "effects" some corps try don't come across well at all, or leave the audience scratching their heads. But the day will come, you can be sure of it (if you still care to attend the shows and see) when someone will use this technology in a way nobody had ever dreamed of. In the very best and most creative of ways. Count on it. As far as recruiting a vocalist being the same as Scouts or BD recruiting a Soprano soloist....couldnt be further from the same thing, see, that Soprano soloist will be part of a hornline, the main reason they want to be there. The vocalist will be taking a spot away fro a talented brass/percussion player so they can grab their Mic and croon. Big difference. Did I miss a rule change or something? I always thought that each drum corps was at their discretion to use their 135 people in whatever way they see fit. This isn't like WGI percussion where every performer has to contribute to the percussive performance...even if it's only for one beat. But since you're so fond of citing specific outstanding examples like 1991 SCV, tell me again...how many times did the Garfield solo dancer pick up a flag or rifle in the 1987 Appalchian Spring show?? What instrument did the Star of Indiana juggler play? Did "Alice" play anything but a featured non-instrumental role in the early 1970's Madison Scouts show? Point is...the performers are contributing to the program, each corps is allowed to utilize their performers in any way they wish, and there have been examples of "featured performers" in the past going back to before anyone currently marching in DCI was even born. This is no different. Edited February 16, 2006 by rut-roh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom&Phitch Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 "Angelica to Casper":The migration of Don Angelica to Natrona County did not happen until late 1963. In late 1963 he was fired from Garfield, and replaced by none other than Hy Drietzer. By then the Troopers were already doing the "Norwood" burst. They had traveled to the Mid West in 1963 and upset several of the then "Big Guns" such as Madison, Bellville and Norwood at a show in Racine WI. Don Angelica was THE reason for the "Overnight Success" of the Troopers. His "residence" in Casper provided them with a great instructor who had immense "connections" in the drum corps "world" of that era. In one season they went from "Casper Who" to "Casper Wow"..... If there are any old "Vets" of late 1950s early 1960s drum corps who remember Norwood Park and the "Circle" feel free to jump in. Elphaba WWW fine, you want another example.... Spring 93 did the DNA sequence move before Cavies did it in 95 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_S Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 Did "Alice" play anything but a featured non-instrumental role in the early 1970's Madison Scouts show? That's the first example I thought of. Even before DCI, corps were taking members from the hornline or drumline or guard, and featuring them throughout the show. Amps haven't changed that. And yes ~G~, I have seen video of Scouts '71. :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gcuzzocrea Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 fine, you want another example.... Spring 93 did the DNA sequence move before Cavies did it in 95 Another example: The 1992 Velevt Knights used a two-tone uniform design (red on the front, white on the back) that was taken directly from North Penn HS, a look they had employed for many years prior. It was the same drill designer (Eric Kitchenman). Same basic concept and effect created. Gary C NP Staff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Brady Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 The Bridgemen traffic jam is another. Yes, very creative...at a time when just about every other corps on the field was just playing music and marching around with no such "sound effects." Just for the sake of accuracy, and don't get me wrong, I loved the Bridgemen, but the New York Skyliners were doing the "Traffic Jam" years before Bayonne did it.....it was one of thier signature moves. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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