Wild Nights Posted July 4, 2006 Share Posted July 4, 2006 There's different levels of Cadets drill, and last year may have moved but I'd never rank that drill design in the Top 10 of anything. Are there tons of amazing drill moves, rotating boxes, HOW DID THEY DO THAT? moments, and a ######## final movement? The last 2 years they've had one... I'll say it again, I don't really like this years show, but last years, I liked a great deal. At the very end when they formed the asterisk thing around the door right before the last big hit, with the percussion in an arc in the back, that about made my day. I never saw it coming and I was like.... b**bs And they do it again this year....yay! See it here- it happens at about 1.10 into the video. They get to the set a little earlier in the phrase this year, and hold a little longer, but it's there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Posted July 4, 2006 Share Posted July 4, 2006 its obvious from that (illegal) video clip that the Cadets stand around the whole show (BARF!!) :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X DM Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 (edited) Are "experts" (as in the thread subtitle) more expert at understanding shows than mere corps fans, or are they just better trained to respond with commentary and a score? I'm not challenging anyone on this, I'm just curious what most fans believe. I can't speak for anyone else here, but personally I defer to the judges the right to tell me which Corps were more efficient and deserving of " winning " the competiton as they know better than I the judging criteria. The judging community set up those standards. I was not involved in setting up that scoring criteria. So the scores and placements remain in their domain. And I have no problems with this, and don't get all that worked up on placements and scores........ that said, I reserve to myself the right to determine which shows won me over in an emotional or intellectual level....... which Corps reached me, at some level, and which ones missed. Once I paid for tickets, I became an " expert " in this personal evaluation procees with the corps performing in front of me. What some former judge thinks as a spectator (with all due respect to that former judge ) won't have much bearing on whether a Corps show reached me or not. That judge only has a possible influence with me as to whether or not the scores or placements were valid in his or her view or not. Nothing more, nothing less. Edited July 5, 2006 by X DM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X DM Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 (edited) I think there are a few points to consider:Judges are trained to look for certain criteria that may or may not be relevant to "fans". Look at a judges sheet. Want to explain what some of those subcaptions mean? Ask an average fan to define "GE" and they might say "audience appreciation." Of course it's a whole lot more esoteric than that. Also, of course, judges have an ideal vantage point to observe their caption. It's tough to tell from 35 yard line, row 57 whether a corps has interval issues, for instance! Also, I'm not a percussionist. I can tell the difference in excellence between Pioneer and Cadets drum lines, but not between SCV and Cadets. Finally, these guys watch the same aspect of a show for 11 minutes. I might notice an outstanding brass lick or a guard move, but I'm not watching either caption for 11 minutes. So, ultimately, I believe most judges look past a show concept they might not like; it's not the job of a field percussion judge to speak to whether the singer sings too much. Given all this, I'm amazed that I agree with the placements as often as I do. Yes, judges do sometimes have an " ideal vantage point " to observe their captions...... most of the time. But not all the time. Do you really believe, for instance ,that on Finals Night when a Corps with ( say )a loud and furious emotional ending, with the crowd on their feet yelling, a music caption judge in the booth 50 yards away can hear whether or not the Corps may have had severe cross tempo musical issues ( or attacks, release issues,, etc ) with their final musical ending passages ? Or conversely, may have unchararateristically even played it better than ever ? The Music caption judge in the booth has nearly an impossible task. Thus, I cut them a lot of slack in trying to do the near impossible for us. I know pretty much what the human ear can hear and not hear regarding DISTANCE. I don't have to be an " expert " on this either. When it comes to distance, it falls into the common sense realm. The judges all go thru lengthy and rigorous musical training programs to finally become music caption judges. I appreciate this. And I respect them for this. But it is not possible to increase one's auditory DISTANCE level, no matter the rigorousness, breadth, and duration level with all of that musical training. Thus, I don't get all that worked up when a judge is trying to properly judge (say) a '95 Madison Scout, or Phantom Regiment, 03 type final ending musical passage, etc . If a spectator in the lower 20 fron rows or so can't hear the Corps important final musical movement because of the audience noise, certainly one can assume with a high degree of certainty ,that neither can a judge way further back and way up in an partially enclosed booth. Edited July 5, 2006 by X DM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiamiSun76 Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 its obvious from that (illegal) video clip that the Cadets stand around the whole show (BARF!!) :) So how many times did you watch the (illegal) video clip? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dciguy01 Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 I just watched the (illegal) video clip ...............WHY..............THE DOOR...............AGAIN..........WHY???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 I just watched the (illegal) video clip...............WHY..............THE DOOR...............AGAIN..........WHY???? Well...as I understand this (and did not yet see it, so take this as an opinion from reading only) the show is a continuation of last year's, so tghe door does make sense. One review said they use it early and then move it back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BMBob Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 I can't speak for anyone else here, but personally I defer to the judges the right to tell me which Corps were more efficient and deserving of " winning " the competiton as they know better than I the judging criteria. I agree with you here. I may occasionally say that I think different, but they're the ones up there (or down there) with the tape recorders, and it's their thoughts that count. However, I do not defer to them to decide which shows I enjoy or think are entertaining. Many times, these shows are not the ones that win, other times they are. It all depends on what I think in that case. Therefore, if judges do not find Cadets' show design distracting, they deserve the score, because those kids are out there executing some great and tough stuff. Even so, if I decide I don't like it much, I don't have to watch it again whether or not it wins DCI. Everyone has an opinion. Mine counts for me, but the judges' count for the score. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 I agree with you here. I may occasionally say that I think different, but they're the ones up there (or down there) with the tape recorders, and it's their thoughts that count.However, I do not defer to them to decide which shows I enjoy or think are entertaining. Many times, these shows are not the ones that win, other times they are. It all depends on what I think in that case. Therefore, if judges do not find Cadets' show design distracting, they deserve the score, because those kids are out there executing some great and tough stuff. Even so, if I decide I don't like it much, I don't have to watch it again whether or not it wins DCI. Everyone has an opinion. Mine counts for me, but the judges' count for the score. Personally, I rarely stay in the stands for the scores. I'd rather leave the stands and either drive home or mill about the parking area. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 So how many times did you watch the (illegal) video clip? once. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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