JMS0527 Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 (edited) I don't buy it. Cavies drill is excellent, and I will say a bit more innovative. But I see a lot of follow-the-leader stuff and shifting blocks. Same thing that BD gets slammed for year and year. To me .. the visual package needs to interpret the music book and provide staging for the various elements as they need it to make impact. In that category, I believe BD does extremely well, and is why they score so well in GE visual and visual captions, even though folks consistently say their drill is "easy". Oh .. and their drill is NOT easy. In terms of the hornline, watching Jay Murphy's drill bores the snot out of me....but in terms of the whole corps, he's a master at staging people for solos (musically or visually)...and the staging is seamlessly done compared to the whole Edited July 9, 2006 by JMS0527 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlamInvert122 Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 It doesn't get more simpler than that. Thanks for giving us the... uh... intelligent way of putting it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feathers Up Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 But thats the irony of oyur statements. This is the first read of the top three(four) corps, from the same panel of judges. Had the score stayed in line with previous scores when they didnt compete against each other, I would be more suspect. This is a seasoned, solid, quality panel. They got the first read of the groups together, it will change but as of last night, thats how it was. And I would say this no matter how the numbers stacked up !~G~ The only thing that puzzles me is Glassmen's brass performance score compared to Crossmen...A friend of mine told me I should check it out, and I was left scratching my head when I did to be honest..In one night, they went from being a point over Crossmen (at the same show) in brass performance, to barely edging out Southwind the next night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChicagoFan Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 If you go by the scores coming in (and the performances I witnessed the night prior) the brass performance scores (which among other things had Gmen below Crossmen) and guard scores (Cadets and others got trashed by this judge) you'll get where I'm coming from.When a judge is completely out of line with all the other judges leading up to the competition something is wrong - and last night we had two judges who certainly saw things very differently than the prior judges and by me. If, in your thinking, judges scores should always reflect those that have come before from previous contests, why even bother to hold competitions or use judges at all after the first show? If, as you seem to be suggesting, relative scores and placements shouldn't vary from night to night, regardless of what happens on the field performance-wise, we may as well hold one contest in June and be done with it. It actually gives me some faith in the judging system when scores and placements DO fluctuate from one show to another. The idea that night after night results should fall in line with the previous evening's rankings seems more suspect to me than having a few diverse/dissenting scores (within reason) from a couple of judges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayM Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 (edited) 7. Brass: Cavies by .4 Makes sense with all of those intonation problems in BD's upper brass ;) We'll see what Wayne Downey and folks can do by season's end8. Music ensemble: BD by .4 BD has a very rich, dark sound this year. They simply sound better collectively thus far 9. Percussion: BD by .65 largest caption spread, and the most obvious difference to me so far this season. BD's percussion ensemble, particularly their pit, is the best they've had in a long time. I'm betting on BD in a tight finish, only because their show design, from top to bottom, seems to be a cut above the rest. Cadets ... I'm just not sure what I'm watching anymore. I know we're just arguing opinions here, but, I'm gonna do it anyway. That's what makes this place fun. I find it funny that BD fans are attributing BD's loss in brass to "intonation problems" in the upper brass. BD's upper brass sounds about how they have all season, based on what I've heard in BlueView and through the APD. I simply think they have a weaker/younger brassline this year. I think the design team knew this, too, which might explain the 1 minutes and 30 second-long brass tacet at the start of the show. And for what it's worth, Downey isn't really involved with BD's brass anymore, other than being their arranger. It's all Meehan now. Music Ensemble doesn't really have to do much with having "rich, dark sounds". I assume you were talking about the brass, and if so, I think "dark and rich" kind of contradicts high brass problems, but that's just me. As far as I know, music ensemble is about how the entire ensembles plays as a whole. BD's percussion seems to be better than previous years. Good for them. Show design a cut above? I'm not seeing it. Cavaliers trump them in this caption. Maybe even the Cadets, too... Edited July 9, 2006 by Jayzer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kamarag Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 actually - you're the one being "insulting" ("lack the balls")If you go by the scores coming in (and the performances I witnessed the night prior) the brass performance scores (which among other things had Gmen below Crossmen) and guard scores (Cadets and others got trashed by this judge) you'll get where I'm coming from. Well, I saw Cadets, Glassmen, Crossmen, etc the night before in Elizabeth (live). I thought Cadets, while clearly the winner, were given a very inflated score by many of the judges. When a judge is completely out of line with all the other judges leading up to the competition something is wrong - and last night we had two judges who certainly saw things very differently than the prior judges and by me. That's "George Speak" for "The judges don't agree with me, so they must be wrong." Rediculous. The judges judge thier caption, and that is all. They don't get together before hand and make sure they all "agree" on numbers and placement. They also are not required, nor should they be, to base thier numbers off those of the previous night. They are to judge the performance in front of them only. And I "elaborated" in the other thread / but it applies here as well. Folks need to put the scores from last night into perspective - its just one panels perception - and its a perception vastly different than other nights panels - so therefore it is suspect. IMHO Gee, contradict yourself much? I submit again that your rediculous comments are insulting to Mr. Stone and Mr. Poor, both of whom are excellent judges. If you don't agree with them, that's fine...but you have no reason to be insulting towards either of them, or to allude that they are incompetant. They certainly are not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
utaheuph Posted July 10, 2006 Share Posted July 10, 2006 I know we're just arguing opinions here, but, I'm gonna do it anyway. That's what makes this place fun.I find it funny that BD fans are attributing BD's loss in brass to "intonation problems" in the upper brass. BD's upper brass sounds about how they have all season, based on what I've heard in BlueView and through the APD. I simply think they have a weaker/younger brassline this year. I think the design team knew this, too, which might explain the 1 minutes and 30 second-long brass tacet at the start of the show. And for what it's worth, Downey isn't really involved with BD's brass anymore, other than being their arranger. It's all Meehan now. thats why their brass score went down almost a full point fromt he night before right? cuz the cavies are just better. i know you cant compare shows but a drop that big implys a bad run through in that category. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Posted July 10, 2006 Share Posted July 10, 2006 But thats the irony of oyur statements. This is the first read of the top three(four) corps, from the same panel of judges. Had the score stayed in line with previous scores when they didnt compete against each other, I would be more suspect. This is a seasoned, solid, quality panel. They got the first read of the groups together, it will change but as of last night, thats how it was. And I would say this no matter how the numbers stacked up !~G~ I compared the corps which DID FACE EACH OTHER at the prior show - I wasn't talking about comparing scores from different sets of judges / and I have no issue with the Cadets in third - my issue was the scoring in certain captions - its just doesnt agree with either reality or prior reads. That's all. We'll see how it flushes out tonight and beyond. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayM Posted July 10, 2006 Share Posted July 10, 2006 thats why their brass score went down almost a full point fromt he night before right? cuz the cavies are just better. i know you cant compare shows but a drop that big implys a bad run through in that category. No, it implies (this is the correct spelling, see?) that a different judge judged the show and that scores jump around quite a bit when you go from having four Div 1 corps performing one night to fourteen the next. Scores are relative, never absolute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Posted July 10, 2006 Share Posted July 10, 2006 I submit again that your rediculous comments are insulting to Mr. Stone and Mr. Poor, both of whom are excellent judges. If you don't agree with them, that's fine...but you have no reason to be insulting towards either of them, or to allude that they are incompetant. They certainly are not. so because I disagree with you my comments are "rediculous" (sp)?? Too funny. Either Stone & Poor got it wrong or the judges did the night before (and before that, and before that - ohh, and probably the nights after that) Just because you agree with them doesn't make you right - or me 'rediculous" we have some corps competing again tonight - we can see how these captions line up again - should be interesting over the next few days to see which scores exactly were out of line and which weren't Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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