LSU GRAD 82 Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 Someone is living in a dream world. Healthier? I don't know, but definitely not more entertaining. With a few creative exceptions, DCI is now nothing more than Marching Symphony-Wind Ensemble-Opera-Ballet-Theater. Very little kick a** Drum and BUGLE Corps any longer.......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 I'll attempt to address this portion of your comments in hopefully a succinct way.First, I agree...after speaking with one from this group of "headliners" I would say this felling was expressed by this director of one of the "headliners." Health of the overall activity is not their concern. They first look at the health of their individual organization and then to the health of DCI member corps. As a headliner, they seldom see the "leading acts" the corps who go on when the sun is still shining as I like to put it. So your comments lead us to the relevance, the scope, the involvement in these organizations....the "leading acts" as I will call them. DCI has....and I think we will agree here...a very limited supporting role of II/III corps. I don't think they pay them much...if at all...for their performance opportunites at DCI shows. In some cases, they are not even on the invitation list. At DCI meetings, they are banished to their own room when the Executive Board meets to discuss member rules, governance etc. They may have token representation, but I believe it is still advisory only and has no voting privileges. There are a select few Senior (all ages) corps in the DCI affiliation rank, and my guess is their input is at about the same level (or less) than that of Div. II/III. So...ok...DCI would want to know why is it their job to protect all of drum corps? If their 18-25 corps are in good shape (and not all are by any means) isn't that enough work for us? What obligates us (DCI) to help support the whole activity? And could we...if we chose to take on that challenge? I know...my comments are filled with conjecture, but follow me please... I do not believe DCI as capable of supporting all of drum corps. It hasn't the means...and perhaps even interest in doing so. So for the health of the activity....if DCI gets it's 25 corps (just using a round number) in decent shape year after year, with about 5 additional "on the bubble" corps as a reserve unit....my guess is that DCI would consider their corner of the drum corps market as healthy. Let me make sure I'm crystal...I don't believe that there are 30 Div. I corps (or potential Div. I corps) who are currently healthy. It's closer than it was 10 years ago, but not healthy yet. By healthy, I would suggest the definition be "able to sustain competitive touring on an annual basis". And again, my numbers are just round...it could be closer to 20 and 5 instead of 25 and 5. I guess I'll move toward closing with this point...would...Div. II/IIIs then, be as or more successful with their own separate governance? Could they sustain a annual tour on their own? Is one necessary? II/III is certainly more competitive each year than the upper echelon of Div. I where everyone gets really excited when a new corps breaks into the top 12. Could II/III manage this on their own? How would that lead to the health of the activity? Finally, is their any need for DCA/DCI relationships to be formed? How would this be beneficial to securing the health of the activity? hinestly, to truly improve the health of the activity, the whole way D2/3 is set up needs totally overhauled. this "they're DCI corps but they're not DCI corps" stuff is absolutely bunk. either bring em in all the way, or cut em off. granted, cutting em off will kill the few left, but it's better than this 2nd class status Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Brace Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 Healthier? I don't know, but definitely not more entertaining. With a few creative exceptions, DCI is now nothing more than Marching Symphony-Wind Ensemble-Opera-Ballet-Theater. Very little kick a** Drum and BUGLE Corps any longer.......... You obviously haven't watched the 2003 finals...just look at corps 7-12. Pretty good stuff in there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Brace Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 hinestly, to truly improve the health of the activity, the whole way D2/3 is set up needs totally overhauled.this "they're DCI corps but they're not DCI corps" stuff is absolutely bunk. either bring em in all the way, or cut em off. granted, cutting em off will kill the few left, but it's better than this 2nd class status The fear...and it's real fear....if you left it up to DCI...they'd cut 'em off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 i wont disagree which is a shame Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audiodb Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 So...ok...DCI would want to know why is it their job to protect all of drum corps? I can't say for sure. But DCI keeps saying it is, both in words (mission statement) and actions (assuming operations of regional circuits and DCI Division II/III). If their 18-25 corps are in good shape (and not all are by any means) isn't that enough work for us? What obligates us (DCI) to help support the whole activity? Your post will give one reason below.... So for the health of the activity....if DCI gets it's 25 corps (just using a round number) in decent shape year after year, with about 5 additional "on the bubble" corps as a reserve unit....my guess is that DCI would consider their corner of the drum corps market as healthy. ....there it is. DCI might need to pay heed to the health of the non-members in order to ensure there will be a pool of non-members from which to draw for future members. Now that DCI is the only circuit left in North American junior corps, they can't assume some other entity will take care of that. Let me make sure I'm crystal...I don't believe that there are 30 Div. I corps (or potential Div. I corps) who are currently healthy. It's closer than it was 10 years ago, but not healthy yet. By healthy, I would suggest the definition be "able to sustain competitive touring on an annual basis". And again, my numbers are just round...it could be closer to 20 and 5 instead of 25 and 5. Understood (and aptly described). I guess I'll move toward closing with this point...would...Div. II/IIIs then, be as or more successful with their own separate governance? Hard to say. I would say that, IMO, the best situation would be one where all divisions cooperate in shared governance. Could they sustain a annual tour on their own? Is one necessary? Thank you just for asking that question. Wish more people would. II/III is certainly more competitive each year than the upper echelon of Div. I where everyone gets really excited when a new corps breaks into the top 12. Could II/III manage this on their own? How would that lead to the health of the activity? I'd like to think they could manage on their own, but there are two concerns that shake my belief. 1. They don't want to. The II/III corps have voluntarily given up autonomy on occasion (GSC and DCE/Atlantic Division, for example) to go under DCI's umbrella. Back in 1983, they had national-scale meetings of the class A corps to form their own organization, but as soon as DCI made any changes on the class A front (even for just one year), the class A corps dropped the whole idea. 2. They're nearly all touring now. Most of these corps are now hooked on going to DCI Championships every year, and would rather fold than go anywhere else. For over 30 years the one constant message, from the Executive Board all the way down to the division III corps kid trying to get a friend to march, has been that "DCI Championships" is the main attraction. As a result, a corps like Arizona Academy that recruits successfully and stays local is virtually unheard of. (Of course, they're going to DCI Championships now, too.) Finally, is their any need for DCA/DCI relationships to be formed? How would this be beneficial to securing the health of the activity? Apparently, DCA has their own issues to deal with, judging from discussion on the DCP all-age forum. I don't see them serving division II/III's needs from coast-to-coast any time soon, if that's what you're asking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted November 1, 2006 Share Posted November 1, 2006 no, DCA needs to take care of DCA, and DCI needs to take care of junior corps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audiodb Posted November 1, 2006 Share Posted November 1, 2006 bump Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 well, Magic out for the year. comments on the health? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audiodb Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Well, "time to celebrate" doesn't seem appropriate. 2007 may be the first year since....(ever?) that we have less than one corps per state in the USA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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