Conquistadors Important Announcement

[CloudHype]

I will be backing Matthew on this at seasons end. Along with Jeff and Bill. It just makes sense.

[Skylinersop16]

Time to start rumor patrol. I expected this when I made the announcement though.

Did the corps fold?

No.

Why did I decide to go inactive?

I am not in a position right now to play the numbers game. I am very busy at this point and can't take the time to dig through websites and threads for numbers. Being beaten so badly right out of the gate this season made me aware of that.

What is my real issue with the league?

It is all DCI. I've been opposed to this right off the bat. I had one of the founding corps of this league and I never liked the scoring system. I believe something as general as this needs to have a general scoring system. If you intend to attract people from overseas who are involved with DCE or the DCA crowd in America you need to start making the game open to them too. Dump the DCI based scoring and invent a new one. If I knew how to manipulate numbers I would do it for you.

I have stuck to my decision to not field the corps and I appreciate the concerns that have been sent to me but I can no longer participate in a biased league. That makes me sad because I like DCP-I.

[gcurrier]

What is my real issue with the league?

It is all DCI. I've been opposed to this right off the bat. I had one of the founding corps of this league and I never liked the scoring system. I believe something as general as this needs to have a general scoring system. If you intend to attract people from overseas who are involved with DCE or the DCA crowd in America you need to start making the game open to them too. Dump the DCI based scoring and invent a new one. If I knew how to manipulate numbers I would do it for you.

I have stuck to my decision to not field the corps and I appreciate the concerns that have been sent to me but I can no longer participate in a biased league. That makes me sad because I like DCP-I.

having done other leagues like VCL that are numbers based and not DCI based I can say I think changing stinks! I am not saying because I couldnt win in VCL with hard work---I won all three divisions in one season---but as the moderator of VCL told me that year--its just luck--so is having a league thats based solely on luck going to make it more fun for someone who doesnt like DCI? I doubt it, it wouldnt me. I am all for developing segments if we can, but I currently dont support changing DCPI to not be based off DCI.

as far as the two corps in one division...we have voted on this and it didnt pass to go to just one corps--it was debated, discussed and failed. Maybe just the "active" directors voted, but we did vote and long before the season actually started. ALL were invited to vote. Instead we went for a change where if you had 2 corps, they couldnt share a single caption...this would have changed the top 12 last season---look at GE Music and GE Visual--there are a lot of scores that are exactly the same because in those two categories people picked the same corps--even for their own two corps--that cant happen any longer which in my opinion will mix the top 12 up...BUT if it doesnt well then we have a chance to vote AGAIN--AFTER the season...

As far as not enough time to pick scores---can't help you there--I make time, but thats my choice--if someone can't make time, well its still pretty easy to look at DCI scores and get a pretty solid guess going...does it always work out--nope--I've been almost dead last before, but I just come back later. Part of life---you get more OUT from something you put more IN to...maybe we can get a festival class for those that can't put enough time in--or maybe we can find a DCA division, but I dont think this whole thing goes down the drain because one person doesnt like DCI...

I've always respected the Conquistadors--but this happening right at the begining of the season without any debate prior to the begining of the season (or atleast since the last vote)--doesnt sit well with me...I respect you not having time--especially to revive a great corps, but dont take it out on DCPI. JUST my opinion.

[ced3905]

My two cents (or five, i may only have a nickel)

As far as the off season being a number/research game. It is, and if people were in FDCI they knew that. And i don't think that would be any different if this was DCA. If the Live season use DCA socres from the live season, then for off season use historic DCA scores. I don't think the branch of drum corps has to do with anything.

As far as time is concern. i'm a middle school band director and an assistant at the high school. I spend as much time as i need/want to on league. i don't think my job suffers from it. It's actually something to help me relax from work. Which leads me to...

Number of corps. I like having five, and i don't think it's that big of a deal to put two in a division if they are differently constructed. Which is the case with the new rule. Here's my suggestion

Have a DCI Div I, Div II, DIv III, and have an DCA option. (I don't know if they have differnt divisions like DCI) I know me personally, i don't know anything about DCA, but if it meant that i can keep all my corps in play, then i'd learn about DCA. Just change the overall league name to be more DCI/DCA friendly and see what happens. Somebody who KNOWS about DCA (hint, hint) could be in charge of the captions and so forth.

In conclusion, i think this league is great. It is really interactive, and I KNOW WHY I SCORE THE WAY I SCORE. there's know randomness about it, live or off. But the key is to remember, it's only a game. And real life shouldn't really interfere with this.

[Galen]

Number of corps. I like having five, and i don't think it's that big of a deal to put two in a division if they are differently constructed. Which is the case with the new rule. Here's my suggestion

Have a DCI Div I, Div II, DIv III, and have an DCA option. (I don't know if they have differnt divisions like DCI) I know me personally, i don't know anything about DCA, but if it meant that i can keep all my corps in play, then i'd learn about DCA. Just change the overall league name to be more DCI/DCA friendly and see what happens. Somebody who KNOWS about DCA (hint, hint) could be in charge of the captions and so forth.

Ced (and others),

As I've said before, I'm supportive of having a DCA section of our little "game". I enjoyed it the one season we did it and I wish we could have kept it going (although now that I'm on the other side of the virtual desk I can see why it was so hard to run it). And while John has told me that for the short-term, a DCA section isn't going to be feasible, that shouldn't discourage anybody from trying to come up with some way to get it going in the future. Shannon's put one proposal together- feel free to put others together if you have them.

I'll say this right now- my policy as acting emergency executive co-whatever is that DCPI will be a league of, by and for YOU, the DIRECTORS. There isn't going to be any unilateral action here. So I put it to you, the owners- TAKE OWNERSHIP. If there's something, some function of the league you'd like to be a part of, or some idea that you'd like to see us try- ASK! Gary Currier has asked if he can put together a DCPI newspaper, and John and I are working with him to make that a reality. I can't promise that we'll be able to implement every idea that hits our PM boxes, but I can promise that we will give any proposals you care to make a fair evaluation and do everything within reason to implement and accommodate them.

And Ced- yes, it IS possible, as you've suggested, to have two in a division (and have both make finals) within the scope of the rules as they are now.

Harry- sorry that DCI isn't your cup of tea. But you can't expect us to totally revamp the way we do things just because a couple directors don't want to open themselves up to a "different" type of drum corps.

[Matthew]

My two cents (or five, i may only have a nickel)

As far as the off season being a number/research game. It is, and if people were in FDCI they knew that. And i don't think that would be any different if this was DCA. If the Live season use DCA socres from the live season, then for off season use historic DCA scores. I don't think the branch of drum corps has to do with anything.

As far as time is concern. i'm a middle school band director and an assistant at the high school. I spend as much time as i need/want to on league. i don't think my job suffers from it. It's actually something to help me relax from work. Which leads me to...

Number of corps. I like having five, and i don't think it's that big of a deal to put two in a division if they are differently constructed. Which is the case with the new rule. Here's my suggestion

Have a DCI Div I, Div II, DIv III, and have an DCA option. (I don't know if they have differnt divisions like DCI) I know me personally, i don't know anything about DCA, but if it meant that i can keep all my corps in play, then i'd learn about DCA. Just change the overall league name to be more DCI/DCA friendly and see what happens. Somebody who KNOWS about DCA (hint, hint) could be in charge of the captions and so forth.

In conclusion, i think this league is great. It is really interactive, and I KNOW WHY I SCORE THE WAY I SCORE. there's know randomness about it, live or off. But the key is to remember, it's only a game. And real life shouldn't really interfere with this.

You would still be able to run 5 corps, but you would only be able to run some during certain seasons. That is, if the proposal passed. And it was VERY close to passing this previous time. There are several people who are now seeing the difference, and will probably vote FOR the proposal to happen this time. Even with sharing NO captions, you are still competing against yourself, when you run multiple corps in a division--there is no point to that (in my opinion). Have a live season group of corps, and an off season group of corps.

[StarOrg]

My two cents on this after reading everyone's threads....

Number of Corps

I started playing the game in 2000 with Star of Jupiter. This was my ONE corps for years. First year out was a live season, FDCI 13 and I finished 21st. As in any game you figure out how the game is played and did well. Like most I much prefer the live seasons and finally winning a "live" season with 2 corps this last summer was great but it's really luck. In this game if you make the top 17 you are doing well..I mean look at the scoring margins in comparision to real drum corps. Last season I picked up SOH from Matt in Div II and started Cross in Div I. The only reason I started Cross was trying to build up the number of corps in the league. I am not against the rule of one corps per division. I do however think that the new no-shared caption rule will help as Gary said.

Scoring

I played VCL. Sean did a great job with that league but I must say I don't like the pick a random number game. The big problem with VCL was if you picked the right numbers at the start of the season you did well. When SOJ won VCL XI that is what happened. I did well the first weeks and then you get more numbers and the domination begins. I didn't like the scoring cause it's not realistic to DC. One thing I like about DCPI over FDCI is the adding the points through the season. The problem in FDCI (especially in the off season) was a director typically would put in their final picks and then let it ride all season....boring. The DCA option would be cool but I am not for replacing the current DCPI scoring with captions.

On a positive note I want to say that the guys here at DCP (Matt B., Matt, Steve, JohnD, Jeff) have done a great with the league and the new website has really taken this game to a new level. Really a place where Dr. Jeff was working too as well. So great job guys and let's keep building on this.

Now back to fantasy....what are those pit guys doing now....ugggh....

Edited January 17, 2007 by StarOrg

[Skylinersop16]

I just wrote a very long editorial on my blog that gave insight into this whole mess that is the Conquistadors. Unfortunately for some reason the site logged me out and it was lost forever. I am very upset by this now because it took 20 minutes to write and I could never rewrite something with that much information without leaving something out.

Basically it stated that what I did was spend a lot of time preparing my captions after searching several different sites for the information I needed. This is something that I never had to do because Steve had it all put in one thread to be accessed easily. After spending all this time I came to find out that I was pulling some of the lowest scores I had ever pulled. That's when I called for some sort of change to the scoring system to help those of us not fluent in DCI. I brought up the possibility of DCA type scoring as well and was stomped on. Then I was accused of wanting a VCL type scoring system. I too did VCL and hated the system. My key words were "Invent a new system" It can't be impossible to do. Like I said, if I had the knowledge of computers that I wish I did then I would help.

I don't need to be preeched to about making time for myself. My life hasn't gotten any busier than the last 3 seasons. i go to school full time, manage a fast food store as a night manager, march and help run a drum corps, teach a color guard and up until now play this game because it was an escape from the hectic real world. Yes, I am frusterated. I'm not taking anything out on this circuit. I just simply stated my opinion, something many of you do quite often. I never make comments towards others that weren't necessary or accuse them of anything. I helped in founding this circuit as a few of you did. I was always on board with all the changes that were made around here and I was on board with the new site up until my work load was drastically increased. I said something and now I am a black sheep within this circuit. I am not sure that a return would be appropriate after seeing some of the assumptions and accusations that have been made both on here and in private PMs. I really hope the majority of you that cannot be optimistic to some sort of change can rethink your attitudes towards it during this season and maybe help think of a solution that benefits everyone. Pulling my corps was one of the hardest decisions that I could make. It was a well thought out decision because if I had just left them there and ignored it then I would turn into one of "those directors" that isn't involved. This place has turned into a sort of club and if you aren't on board then you aren't allowed in. That being said, I am done with my rant and you won't have to deal with me for the rest of your season. Feel free to PM me with further concerns. Good luck to all corps. We'll see some of you in Roselle Park at our home show where we will be in exhibition.

I would also like to offer my public apology on behalf of the Conquistador Organization for the controversy and uproar that was caused. I had to voice my concerns. I may have opened Pandora's Box here but hopefully some good will come of it.

Edited January 20, 2007 by Skylinersop16