On amps

[JamMan]

FIRST OFF, THIS IS NOT A DISCUSSION OF WHY YOU HATE AMPS. NO DRY HUMOR, NO DEROGATORY COMMENTS, NO SIDES. THIS IS A TOPIC FOR WHAT AMPS ARE ALL ABOUT.

Okay so first off, amps make things louder, right? Not entirely. When keyboards are played, the bars create overtones when played very loud. Using microphones allows the player to play softer, and thus with a better sound, while still maintaining volume. But, as the dynamics go up, the overtones that normally don't make it to the audience, become more apparent due to the amps.

Second, bass travels less distance than treble, so amps help in bringing out the bass tones of certain instruments. But, a lot of mixing is required to get a great sound, and conditions change, making quality change drastically from show to show.

[NR_Ohiobando]

This is quite possibly the most educational thing I've seen on amps in a while. Thanks for posting this!(I learned something new today, hooray)

On that note, my understanding is that technically the benifit of amps is somewhat dependant on how well it is mixed at the conditions of the show? If we could somehow teach all corps the perfect mixing method for this I'd have a much fonder opinion on the subject.

Edited February 19, 2007 by NR_Ohiobando

[MGCpimpOtimp]

My pit had three different settings for our mixer. Small venue, medium venue, and large venue. Everything was mixed by a professional. I've yet to hear anyone complain about our amplification, other than just the fact that we do it.

[raphael18]

Please pick a side!

I can't stand neutrals...you never know where you stand with them. :)

[Sideways]

Amps are certainly louder when launched from a trebouchet versus simply sitting idle. I dare say far more entertaining as well.

[tylerdurden]

FIRST OFF, THIS IS NOT A DISCUSSION OF WHY YOU HATE AMPS. NO DRY HUMOR, NO DEROGATORY COMMENTS, NO SIDES. THIS IS A TOPIC FOR WHAT AMPS ARE ALL ABOUT.

Okay so first off, amps make things louder, right? Not entirely. When keyboards are played, the bars create overtones when played very loud. Using microphones allows the player to play softer, and thus with a better sound, while still maintaining volume. But, as the dynamics go up, the overtones that normally don't make it to the audience, become more apparent due to the amps.

Second, bass travels less distance than treble, so amps help in bringing out the bass tones of certain instruments. But, a lot of mixing is required to get a great sound, and conditions change, making quality change drastically from show to show.

Well, sort of. Higher frequencies tend to be more directional to our ears than lower frequencies, so our ears generally pick up on the highs first. Bass frequencies move slower in wavelength terms, not distance, and tend to scatter more than highs due to the ability to move around objects.

Amplification systems can help shape that low end and focus it more, removing the subharmonic junk that isn't needed.

When I run live sound in a new area, it takes a few hours to get the system tuned up and dialed in. You don't have this time when setting up for a corps, and have to run it on the fly. So there will be some errors, but over the past few years it has been worked out fairly well.

The best idea has been to allow for a staff member to run the board during the show.

[chris ncsu]

Well, sort of. Higher frequencies tend to be more directional to our ears than lower frequencies, so our ears generally pick up on the highs first. Bass frequencies move slower in wavelength terms, not distance, and tend to scatter more than highs due to the ability to move around objects.

Amplification systems can help shape that low end and focus it more, removing the subharmonic junk that isn't needed.

When I run live sound in a new area, it takes a few hours to get the system tuned up and dialed in. You don't have this time when setting up for a corps, and have to run it on the fly. So there will be some errors, but over the past few years it has been worked out fairly well.

The best idea has been to allow for a staff member to run the board during the show.

I was gonna say...this I assume is the logic behind the proposal of a 'professional' (non corps member) running the soundboard live.

[tylerdurden]

I assume so, I never read into any other reasoning why. It also takes the pressure off of the pit members/whoever to make sure it is running.

When you mix live sound for any other purpose, it is essential that someone is operating the board to handle any issues, and to actually mix during the performance. You set general levels, and things always change due to air temperature, amount of people in the crowd, the size and shape of the stadium, any strange materials in the way (such as a huge concrete wall), and so on.

Pit micing is easy, that usually has no issues if everything is running with cables and attactched mics. Those problems are easy to fix in seconds. When wireless mics come into play, it opens a whole new world of trouble. There is always the risk of someone being on the same channels as you, RF noise in the stadium, cell phone disturbance, and so on.

Stadium power can suck as well. Some of the older high school and college stadiums have electrical issues, like bad and old wiring. With the lights on, the stadium PA going, and other electrical needs you can run into issues powering the sound system or end up constantly tripping the breakers.

[dcpguy1111]

Amps are bad because they didn't use them in 1932

[scouttimp]

All that being very well said-

one problem that I have as a long time watcher is when front ensemble dynamics are controlled from the sound board by the pit instructor (here's a big pit run, so up come the faders...). It sounds unnatural to my ears, because it is unnatural.

Given that amplification is here to stay, I would prefer to only notice the clarity and harmonic support, and not the fingers of the sound board operator (think Cavies Bond show as a positive example, I won't be negative.).

I assume so, I never read into any other reasoning why. It also takes the pressure off of the pit members/whoever to make sure it is running.

When you mix live sound for any other purpose, it is essential that someone is operating the board to handle any issues, and to actually mix during the performance. You set general levels, and things always change due to air temperature, amount of people in the crowd, the size and shape of the stadium, any strange materials in the way (such as a huge concrete wall), and so on.

Pit micing is easy, that usually has no issues if everything is running with cables and attactched mics. Those problems are easy to fix in seconds. When wireless mics come into play, it opens a whole new world of trouble. There is always the risk of someone being on the same channels as you, RF noise in the stadium, cell phone disturbance, and so on.

Stadium power can suck as well. Some of the older high school and college stadiums have electrical issues, like bad and old wiring. With the lights on, the stadium PA going, and other electrical needs you can run into issues powering the sound system or end up constantly tripping the breakers.